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Ti midrange upgrade for Forte I


kink56

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I have asked simply speakers this question and their answer was "The diaphragm is very similar but we can not verify if it will fit because we’ve never tried!"

 

I am considering upgrading my Forte I speakers midrange drivers with these: https://www.simplyspeakers.com/klipsch-replacement-speaker-diaphragm-127122.html 

My Forte Is have the K-53-K midrange horns.   I THINK I have seen other hear recommend this upgrade. I cannot find the thread I read that in at the moment.  I have already upgraded my Forte I with the Crites crossovers and the titanium tweeter diaphragms. 

 

So, I am asking for those who KNOW. Will these  Klipsch Factory Speaker Diaphragm, K-52/K-53-Ti, Titanium, 127122

Part Number:KLP-127122 fit my old K-53-K midrange drivers?   If so, does anyone have experience or an opinion on in what manner it may or may not improve the sound of my Forte I speakers?   I have no problem with the actual procedure of replacing the diaphragms as I did this myself with the tweeters.  So unless there is something in particular I should be aware of or look our for. I am fine with the doing the work myself. 
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Yes. The diaphragms will fit.  The issue is that the titanium increases output to beyond what the stock diaphragm outputs and peaks at the same time as the tweeter so both mids and tweeters will be peaked at i think 6-7k according to Bob Crites.   He does sell a band pass for people who install the Ti mids that lets the Ti mid drop off before the tweeter.  Some thought it was better.  Some thought it was unnecessary.  Most seem to think the TI mids are too harsh/bright/shrill but those who love it, swear by it.   I think at the price, i myself will be giving it a shot for my Chorus II's soon enough.

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Interesting, thank you.  So, I may find things too bright with this mod then. Would it even be worth my effort to install these?:

 

https://www.simplyspeakers.com/klipsch-replacement-speaker-diaphragm-127120.html

:Klipsch Factory Speaker Diaphragm K-52, K-53-PH, K-58, K-62, Others, Phenolic, 127120

Part Number:KLP-127120
 
It is not that I have any particular complaint about my Forte I. But I can ALWAYS appreciate a smoother, more realistic sounding midrange. 
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Did the Forte I's not have stock phenolic diaphragms?  I don't know anything about swapping for phenolics or if there are differences between those or Crites replacements. I just know a little bit about going Ti mid because i've been interested in trying it myself.

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Lower distortion levels and/or flatter response does not guarantee a subjectively more pleasing listening experience. That’s not a very popular view around here - but there it is. 

 

I prefer the sound of phenolic diaphragms. 

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I find a b tests to be less reliable than long term listening.   We are always struck by the differences, but it is only after living with something for a while that we fully appreciate the differences. I went back and forth between two sets of speakers for about a year before I decided which set I would rather live with.   First impressions though is YES, they do have a bit brighter if not a tad smoother response to the Ti diaphragms.   Less grain but more upper mids/lower highs.  A trade-off for sure. 

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I think I am going "back to stock" on BOTH the speakers!    But before I do, I am awaiting the arrival of a XiangSheng 728A Vacuum Tube Pre-Amplifier.

Maybe going tube will relieve some of the fatigue I am experiencing with the Ti midrange drivers.  If it doesn't then I am definitely going back to stock! 

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21 minutes ago, kink56 said:

I think I am going "back to stock" on BOTH the speakers!    But before I do, I am awaiting the arrival of a XiangSheng 728A Vacuum Tube Pre-Amplifier.

Maybe going tube will relieve some of the fatigue I am experiencing with the Ti midrange drivers.  If it doesn't then I am definitely going back to stock! 

 

 

I upgraded to Ti-diaphragms on my forte II a couple years ago, both tweets and squawkers..  I am very pleased with the results.  Forte III, Cornwall III etc. all have titanium diaphragms in the tweets and squawkers.  You will need a band pass roll-off due to the simplicity of the forte / forte II crossover.

 

Best regards,

John

 

Please read below per Bob Crites.

 

Although the response curve will vary from the attached forte II graph, the concept remains the same.

A bandpass limits the out put of the squawker driver. Please see detailed description from Bob Crites below:

I can provide a little technical information of using the Klipsch titanium midrange to replace the orignal phenolics. On the trace below, the red is an original K-53 phenolic diaphrgm and the green is the K-53TI titanium midrange diaphragm on the same 700 hz horn. We see slightly higher average output for the titanium than the phenolic. The phenolic output drops like a stone at 6khz where the tweeter takes over. That allows the crossover to be pretty simple since there is no reason to roll off the midrange. But, the titanium diaphragm keeps on going, in fact heading for a peak at around 7.3khz before it drops off. So, if the titanium diaphragm is used in place of the phenolic without a crossover mod, you would have the midrange and tweeter both at full output at the same time around 7khz.

Bob Crites

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  • k53tiphen.jpg
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2 hours ago, kink56 said:

I think I am going "back to stock" on BOTH the speakers!    fatigue I am experiencing with the Ti midrange drivers.  If it doesn't then I am definitely going back to stock! 

 

Did you do the band-pass crossover mod at the same time? Last I checked Crites offered them for around $75? you'd have to check with him. 

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I personally DO NOT like the way Forte's or Forte II's sound with both midrange and tweeter changed to titanium. I kind of learned this after one of my earlier rebuilds when I did both.

Use a stock diaphragm for the midrange and use titanium for tweeter only....best bet.

 

 

George

 

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36 minutes ago, kink56 said:

I put the stock midrange diaphragms back in. Oh, what a relief it is. 

Last I spoke with Bob Crites about the Titanium mids he said it seemed to be about a 50/50 split on who liked the change and who didn't. I tried them twice in my Chorus II's over the years, first time without the band-pass filter and I could not get them out fast enough, they were way too bright. I think I left them in for a few hours hoping they would tame down but they never did. A couple years later I tried them again with the band-pass filters and they were way better but after a month or so I decided to go back to stock. At lower volumes I thought they sounded pretty good, very detailed but when the volume got turned up they got shouty and fatiguing pretty quickly. 

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It's odd really...it's  a love or hate topic with most on the forums and our resident crossover guys in Crites and Dean both preferring the stock as well.  I always wondered how many guys used the titanium combo with the sonicaps and not a PIO cap in the mids or something with a warmer signature sound + tube amps or warmer sounding SS.

I read through this thread, and most seemed to love it especially the SET12 guy who apparently has amazing sounding Forte II's. He didn't even feel it necessary to install the crites  band pass, neither does @moray james IIRC.

http://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/replacing-klipsch-midrange-diaphragms-wi.388280/

I personally think about at least giving it a try and finding out for myself and if i don't like it, i can always keep them around if i get a pair of HII or KLF-20/30 speakers.   But, most of all, i'd prefer to find a way to use the A55G mid drivers with adapters in the Chorus II's.  Not sure if it fits.  @Born2RockU ordered a single A55G mid driver for his La Scala center, so maybe if i can order the adapter, Craig can let me try and see if it fits into the Chorus II cabinets and demo it at his house?

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2 hours ago, Maximus89 said:

But, most of all, i'd prefer to find a way to use the A55G mid drivers with adapters in the Chorus II's.  Not sure if it fits.

 

I just installed a pair of k-55v's in my Chorus II's and really like the sound, big improvement to my ears. I started a thread:

 

 

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