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Wire Splicing


The History Kid

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I have been operating in a 3/2.1 configuration in my main setup since December when the move began.  This has been the most dragged out move ever that I've experienced.  To give you insight on that, of my four surrounds, two finally got put up today, with two more to go.  There will be two more in the other room, plus a new two added to that system.

 

All of the rooms are bigger than the ones both of these systems are coming out of - which means that speaker cable length will not match, between the routing changing and the room dimensions.

 

I have no problems with the speaker wire I am using.  It's either monster, or it's rocketfish heavy duty cable - that stuff with the nice insulation and probably about 16 AG.  All of my main channels were originally cut with room to spare, so they're fine, but all of the surround channels will come up short.

 

My question is, if I splice and extend out the cable, what kind of signal loss might I experience, if any?  I'm not as apprehensive about doing this mainly because they're all surround channels, but I don't know for sure if there's any kind of disruption in the signal path or the timing if I do this.  It's too costly for me to justify recutting ALL of the wires...

 

Thoughts?

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1 hour ago, The History Kid said:

My question is, if I splice and extend out the cable, what kind of signal loss might I experience, if any?

Interesting question, I've never seen any tech specs on signal loss by doing that.

 

I have connected 16 awg wires using two short pieces to make a 50' section for use with Surround Back.  I used banana plugs for one pair just because I happened to have a couple of extra bananas, and the other I just twisted the wired and used some electrical tape.  I used one of those double-banana plugs with on open back designed for use to piggy-back other banana plugs.

 

image.png.65a5fb94aa3272f59e74774f386ca6a3.png

 

My perception there was no degradation of sound.  When re-calibrating Audyssey did not reset the XO points, there was just the expected re-calibration of distance.

 

I wouldn't bother with the banana plugs unless you have them laying around.  I suggest twisting the wire together and use some electrical tape.  Even without the electrical tape it will work just fine.

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7 minutes ago, wvu80 said:

I wouldn't bother with the banana plugs unless you have them laying around.  I suggest twisting the wire together and use some electrical tape.  Even without the electrical tape it will work just fine.

My thought is just this, using wire nuts to keep the wire fastened, and then electrical tape wrapping them for good measure to make sure I don't have to worry about any wires coming loose and that the insulation is good.

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1 minute ago, The History Kid said:

using wire nuts to keep the wire fastened, and then electrical tape wrapping them for good measure

The wire nuts are not needed but won't hurt.  If you overlap and twist two inches of wire (one inch overlap, then twist in-line) then cover with electrical tape that connection will NOT come loose.

 

I use the good stuff, not the 99 cent roll in the bargain bin which can get a bit gummy over time.  B)

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Scotch-2242-Rubber-Splicing-15-ft-Electrical-Tape/50430522

 

054007061656.jpg

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1 minute ago, jason str said:

Twisting wires together and taping is a no no.

Can you elaborate on that?

 

1 minute ago, wvu80 said:

I use the good stuff, not the 99 cent roll in the bargain bin which can get a bit gummy over time.  B)

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Scotch-2242-Rubber-Splicing-15-ft-Electrical-Tape/50430522

Good stuff!

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2 minutes ago, wvu80 said:

Why?  It's speaker wire.  B)

 

 

 

Same as any other wire, it should be fixed correctly.

 

You will never get good contact with that method let alone the possibility of the wires coming apart, touching together and frying a component.

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23 minutes ago, jason str said:

Same as any other wire, it should be fixed correctly.

Fair enough.  Personally I think any of the four methods would work with NO problems.

 

1. Twist and tape.  My choice (the cheap method)

2.  Wire nut and tape Michael's suggestion.  (very strong connection but it costs a little more money for a trip to the store to buy those wire nuts)

3.  Solder and shrink wrap.  Jason's suggestion. (assuming one already has a soldering station, solder, and soldering skills, then purchasing additional shrink wrap this would be an elegant solution.)

4.  Just buy a 100 foot spool of wire for thirty bucks and cut to the proper length! 

 

It's always good to have ideas and options.  :emotion-21:

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I'd buy new wire so I didn't need splices, both for strength and resistance in the splice. 

 

If there was some reason not to buy new wire, I'd wrap the ends together, solder and cover with heat-shrink tubing for strength and to prevent resistance adding corrosion.

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I'm with Jason.  Solder is best.  

 

There is a debate over solder vs crimping.  The crimping guys argue that many people are not practiced enough at soldering and so crimping is better.  There is also the camp which points out that crimping can be screwed up too.  The military seems to favor crimping with a calibrated Mil-Spec crimping tool which is not cheap.

 

You can find butt splice crimping pieces at HD.

 

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Gardner-Bender-16-14-AWG-Butt-Splice-Wire-Connectors-in-Blue-15-Pack-15-123/202523052

 

If you don't have a crimping tool there are cheap ones at HD which come with a variety of ring, spade, and butt devices.  You just have to be sure the crimp action grips the bare wires.  You can test the result with a bit of tension.

 

You'll see that the colors code for the AWG gauge of wire being used.  It looks like you might need the blue ones.

 

One issue, it goes without saying,  is to observe the polarity of the wires in any splicing.  I use zip cord.  Almost always, one side of the insulation is striated.  My mnemonic is that the striations remind me of blades of grass.  Grass is green (not really black as we're used to in terminals but it is not red) and on the ground.  Therefore I always use that for the ground side. 

 

- - - - - 

 

A bit OT.  Hams who don't have the use of both hands have a tip.  It is also applicable to situations where folks with two hands wish they had three because of any number reasons including close quarters and eyesight.  It is to wrap a couple of turns of solder around the joint before applying heat rather than tying to feed it in.  

 

WMcD

 

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6 hours ago, jason str said:

Solder and heat shrink is the proper way. Twisting wires together and taping is a no no.

 

Crimping would be a second best alternative.

Agree. If crimping don't use a cheap flat one, a good can be had for under 10 bucks and wires wouldn't pull a part. 

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6 hours ago, WMcD said:

The crimping guys argue that many people are not practiced enough at soldering and so crimping is better.  There is also the camp which points out that crimping can be screwed up too.

I am in BOTH camps as I am certified inept at soldering and crimping.  :lol:

 

I remember doing one crimp job where I squeezed so hard I snapped the crimp in half.  My soldering joints looks like someone squeezed the solder out of a tube of toothpaste.

+++

 

Seriously, are any of you guys who are advocating soldering claiming that you can actually hear an audible difference between a cable that has been soldered vs a cable which has been twisted together through some surround speakers? 

 

"Wow, that doesn't sound like a bird chirping.  Did somebody splice those dang surround sound wires???  :o"

 

C'mon man.  :rolleyes:

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I'm gonna have to pretty much go with what Dave is saying.  It's not like I have anything that's going to be pulling on wires causing them to unfasten.  I have wire nuts and electrical tape already, which means I have no expenses doing it this way.  All I care about at this point is whether or not there's signal loss or changes in quality.  Which doesn't seem to be the case.

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15 minutes ago, wvu80 said:

I am in BOTH camps as I am certified inept at soldering and crimping.  :lol:

 

I remember doing one crimp job where I squeezed so hard I snapped the crimp in half.  My soldering joints looks like someone squeezed the solder out of a tube of toothpaste.

 

Quote

 

Seriously, are any of you guys who are advocating soldering claiming that you can actually hear an audible difference between a cable that has been soldered vs a cable which has been twisted together through some surround speakers? 

 

C'mon man.  :rolleyes:

Best mechanical connection is soldering, crimping with a good crimper is next. Twisting wires together and using tape is just a bad idea, the wires can easily come apart. Audible difference, maybe?  

 

What ever method used I always off set the wires by an inch so they don't short out in case the wires come apart.

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11 hours ago, wvu80 said:

hear an audible difference between a cable that has been soldered vs a cable which has been twisted together through some surround speakers? 

You can after the wire starts to corrode.  Solder and heat shrink eliminates any possibility of oxidation and will not come loose if pulled or tripped over.  It's just a better more permanent solution.

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3 hours ago, Coytee said:

Hurry your hiney to Lowes or Home Depot & buy some 12g low voltage outdoor lighting wire.  Cut to length & share a Coke with a smile.

 

 

 

+1 :emotion-21:

 

I bought at Home Depot a spool of Carol 12g low voltage outdoor landscaping cable that I have used for years.  It’s multi-stranded copper which has not oxidized or tarnished.  The black vinyl jacket is flexible.  IMO, anything more boutique is a waste of money better spent on more music.

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