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4 speaker stereo and pre-outs vs zone 2


Emile

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Hoping to get some suggestions/advise on my rear speaker setup :) 

 

"TV room" measures about 15 x 25 ft ... one side and half of the rear is open to a 30 x 40 ft room. Currently use an Onkyo AVR TX-ZR810 in a 7.1 setting with Klipsch speakers front/center/side/rear. (Rear speakers "were" linked wireless to AVR's rear speaker output.)  AVR's zone 2 is linked to a Marantz 2252B with KPT904 speakers. (Got this Onkyo a month ago because it transfers HDMI inputs to zone 2.)

 

Got the Pro KPT904's a couple of months ago and they replaced my "front" Cornwall's. So; moved my Cornwall's to the rear and then decided the wireless connection just wasn't very good :(Therefore, got a Yamaha CR-620 as a "rear" amp ... sounds very nice with the Cornwall's using the tuner and a temporary cd player.  Of course ran wires (across my attic, etc) and used "rear"  pre-outs from my AVR to the Yamaha. Barely any sound at all :( Learned that the "pre-out" volume is controlled by the AVR ... and not "fixed" as I thought. So, at low/medium AVR volume levels have very little rear output and I have to crank the Yamaha up to max (making the sound distorted). Even tried raising the "rear" levels by 12dB in the AVR, but still not enough volume :(  (Plus I break my windows when I forget to change the volume as I switch to "tuner.")

 

Playing around, I split the "zone 2" (set to fixed) signal to go to both my front Marantz amp AND (reversed) to the Yamaha. Only tried it with a couple of records, but think it sounds awesome ... and "full" volume. Guess I can reset my AVR to 5.1 and use this "4 speaker" stereo setup.  But, a google search generally shows 4-speaker stereo as a very "BAD idea." Interference, waves cancelling/adding gives poor stereo sound.  Well; it sounded good to me; did not hear interference in my short test. :)  Maybe I do not get interference because I am using different amps (vs A/B from one amp) and a 40ft wire run ???????

 

Appreciate your inputs. Many, many thanks!

 

Cheers, Emile

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Most AVRs have an 'all channel stereo' setting that plays a two channel source through all the speakers you have connected.  If you try and play a two channel source through a surround format like Dolby Digital you're going to get very little output from any surround speakers.

 

Am I understanding your issue correctly?

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10 minutes ago, wuzzzer said:

Most AVRs have an 'all channel stereo' setting that plays a two channel source through all the speakers you have connected.  If you try and play a two channel source through a surround format like Dolby Digital you're going to get very little output from any surround speakers.

@wuzzzer , many thanks! :) never even thought about the different sound settings on the AVR ... duh :) Yes; switching to 2 channel stereo increases the output to the rear a bit :)  but still have to "crank it up."  So; this setup would be the same as using my zone 2 output, but still controlled by the AVR's volume. Therefore, still think "zone 2" is the best solution. Just concerned how "BAD" front PLUS rear stereo sounds :)

Cheers, Emile

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It will take some playing around to get things where you're satisfied. Not sure with avr in mix, though pretty confident all will be well.in my case zone two going through outlaw 950 pre-pro powered form 125x5 acurus.allows me to have all format as needed in second location, though using mainly two channel. Not stereo as I prefer plim+cr through Cornwall, and sub when needed. Patience, you'll get there.

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OK; reversed the phase as recommended below. Still hear no difference ... still sounds very good :) 

 

Quote from AVforums.com .... "One thing to consider is the position and orientation of your rear speakers. If you have your front speakers facing the rear wall of the room (normal configuration) and your REAR speakers facing the FRONT of the room, then then speaker are out of phase. In this situation, I would wire the rear channels in reverse polarity (amp(+) to rear speaker minus). That would make the front and rear speakers move in the same physical direction at the same time."

 

Cheers, Emile :) 

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Are you hooking the pre-outs to the front speaker connections vs rear?  If you are trying to manage the efficiency difference between the two via the receiver than you will need to use the rear but as you found out, the pre-outs or your new amp does not have the same gain as the internal amplifiers.  That will be validated or not by hooking up the front pre-outs. 

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Hi @pzannucci. Thanks! No; did not hook up front pre-outs to my additional front amp. Hooked up zone 2 to my front amp to give me "stereo" on my front KPT904 speakers. (Works nice since zone 2 gives me full fixed power.) Hooked up the rear pre-outs to my rear amp, hoping to maintain 7.1 surround sound.  Then found out the pre-outs' volume was set by the AVR and the volume going in my rear amp was way way low.  So; hooked the rear amp up to the "same" zone 2 connection as the front amp. Much better sound, but "lost" 7.1 (now 5.1, of course with "double stereo").  Sound good, but don't think it's "supposed to be this way." :)

Thanks and cheers, Emile  

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