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Really impressed with the Heresy III


rjp

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10 minutes ago, jimjimbo said:

I'm trying to visualize that.....so, do you like the black ones, or the stainless?

 

Oh, wait, I forgot, Thaddeus probably only prefers the stainless cause that's what he utilizes to neuter his goats.....please forgive my indiscretion....

 

This is what I use. Should be a more effective visual than a shotgun when it comes to my girls dating...

 

nipper.jpg

 

 

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3 hours ago, ODS123 said:

Hey newbies, look at it this way: how can electricity come from a power plant 150 miles away, run through countless junction boxes, transformers, splices, wire of varying gauges - any of which might change on a daily basis - yet when we change the last three feet that runs from our power outlet to our amp, there is a noticeable change??   Yes, some claim to hear an improvement, but none of these claims take expectation bias (placebo effect)  into account.

 

Our homes can be a very electrically noisy environment in themselves with all the local electronics as well as noise coming in through the power line itself and could be part of the explanation of why some power cords could sound different on some equipment/systems because of how they might reject or suppress the electrical interference.

 

This is often why their are benefits to using good AC power conditioners that have good electrical noise suppression design.

 

miketn 

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The goats recover in matter of minutes, it's bloodless, and virtually zero risk of infection. It may look wicked, but it's the most humane method of castration I could find for my goats. I've done it five times so far, and have another three coming up. It gets easier and more efficient every time.

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This thread is all over the place now so I'm going to throw some more crap in here because I went to a lot of trouble gathering it :P

 

Rooms, Recordings and Loudspeakers are the 3 largest obstacles to good sound because they are so interdependent on each other and for the most part the weakest links in the Sound Production and Sound Reproduction chain that we all have to deal with.

 

We live in "Audio's Circle of Confusion" and if you haven't read these articles (Especially Part 2 and Part 3 of the articles) by Floyd E. Toole then I encourage you to especially if you fall into the camp that recordings shouldn't be touched with a properly designed and implemented EQ for tonal compensation or that a room/systems performance can't be raised to higher performance level with proper equalization applied. Especially Part 2 and Part 3 of the article.

Floyde E. Toole - LoudspeakersandRoomsPt1_0.pdf

Floyde E. Toole - LoudspeakersandRoomsPt2_0.pdf

Floyde E. Toole - LoudspeakersandRoomsPt3_0.pdf

 

 

1455722223_AudiosCircleofConfusion.png.cedd6a179190d83968e4ca76eb1ca227.png

 

 

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Guest wdecho
9 hours ago, mikebse2a3 said:

 

Our homes can be a very electrically noisy environment in themselves with all the local electronics as well as noise coming in through the power line itself and could be part of the explanation of why some power cords could sound different on some equipment/systems because of how they might reject or suppress the electrical interference.

 

This is often why their are benefits to using good AC power conditioners that have good electrical noise suppression design.

 

miketn 

I know in the last few days we have had  heated discussions, disagreements, and I hope you will accept my apology if I have said anything that offended you personally but I would like to comment on your post. You are correct. In better test equipment as well as better audio amplification components there is installed an AC line capacitor for this very reason. To clean up all the noise present in your AC lines. The noise on a electrical line can easily be seen on an oscilloscope along with the fundamental signal. 

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Guest wdecho
10 hours ago, mikebse2a3 said:

This thread is all over the place now so I'm going to throw some more crap in here because I went to a lot of trouble gathering it :P

 

Rooms, Recordings and Loudspeakers are the 3 largest obstacles to good sound because they are so interdependent on each other and for the most part the weakest links in the Sound Production and Sound Reproduction chain that we all have to deal with.

 

We live in "Audio's Circle of Confusion" and if you haven't read these articles (Especially Part 2 and Part 3 of the articles) by Floyd E. Toole then I encourage you to especially if you fall into the camp that recordings shouldn't be touched with a properly designed and implemented EQ for tonal compensation or that a room/systems performance can't be raised to higher performance level with proper equalization applied. Especially Part 2 and Part 3 of the article.

Floyde E. Toole - LoudspeakersandRoomsPt1_0.pdf

Floyde E. Toole - LoudspeakersandRoomsPt2_0.pdf

Floyde E. Toole - LoudspeakersandRoomsPt3_0.pdf

 

 

1455722223_AudiosCircleofConfusion.png.cedd6a179190d83968e4ca76eb1ca227.png

 

 

I respectfully disagree as I do fall in the category of less is best, as you are fully aware of by now. I may not have the degrees in education as many members here or the ones that disagree as you have mentioned in the above articles. PWK himself, who I respect and admire as a genius in his field, carried his BS button in discussions with others with degrees in the field of audio reproduction. It was not carried everyday for the average man. In other words very opinionated. I do have an electronic background dealing with repairs of electronic devices most of my adult life and I like to believe enough common sense to know who to believe when it comes to the said above discussion. Another giant, considered in a class by himself, in the audio amplification field is Nelson Pass. His track record during his lifetime proves he is and has been the best designer of audio equipment in our generation and at 66 or 67 years old still going strong designing, building new designs that are sold to the elites of the audio world. If one is not familiar with the man you can start here, http://www.firstwatt.com/articles.html  Or at one of the Burning Amp Festivals where designers and engineers fly in from all over the world to hear about his next new design, https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=nelson+pass+burning+amp+2009. It is easy to have another opinion but it is not so easy to follow up and sell your philosophy in a product to the public or the discriminating ears in the audio field. His philosophy in his designs are less is better. If there is any way to eliminate even one resistor in a design he will do so. He wants as few circuits and components between the audio medium and ones speakers because he among many others deem it as best. 

 

There is always going to be disagreements among the elites in the audio field. Deciding on who to believe is the decision we as the ones who they are trying to convince have to make. I respect your opinion but respectfully disagree. I know this subject will not be settled here on this forum. All one can really do is try it both ways and decide for oneself which they like best. I pretty much have done that my entire life and have settled on the one which I prefer now approaching 70 years of age. 

 

I have no qualms with those that like and believe in equalization in their system. We are on this forum for discussions and disagreements because of our love of music. No one is right or wrong when one chooses what they like to use for their audio reproduction. If I can eliminate one resistor between my recorded media and my speakers I am going to do so. I believe any adjustments for room environment should be done in the room and speakers and not with the electronics. There are active crossovers where this can be done in the speaker that many here advocate. I have never tried an electronic crossover myself but have done my adjustments with a passive one. The crossover is the easiest place to make adjustments for your particular room. The crossover is the brains of a speaker system. 

 

Again, I respect your opinion and others here that disagree. 

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1 hour ago, wdecho said:

I believe any adjustments for room environment should be done in the room and speakers and not with the electronics. There are active crossovers where this can be done in the speaker that many here advocate. I have never tried an electronic crossover myself but have done my adjustments with a passive one. The crossover is the easiest place to make adjustments for your particular room. The crossover is the brains of a speaker system. 

I believe in the synergy of both the room and the electronics. According to Dr. Earl Geddes, who lives near me, one should solve acoustic problems acoustically and electrical problems electrically, however, I'm not a purist in either realm, so if their solutions overlap a bit, that is OK by me. I agree that the crossover is the brains of the speaker system. That being said, doing, say a Fourth Order Linkwitz-Riley passively with a few notch filters still brings some parsitics in the process (inductors and capacitors are such imperfect devices), whereas a 96khz/24bit digital Xover that affect the SIGNAL level and not the POWER level (at the amplifier output) whereas you can simply type in any setting you like for a dozen or more PEQ filters over a 40 db range, various slopes and types, and delays that align horns electrically when they can't be done physically, is much EASIER than stocking a bunch of passive parts and twisting wire nuts, and pulling plastic retainers through  holes on a piece of plywood. That being said, both have their place in the quest for better sound and I have experienced good and bad from both worlds.

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On 7/1/2018 at 11:14 AM, jimjimbo said:

Listened to the entire Heritage line in Hope, and to me, the Heresy III was the second best speaker in the group other than the La Scala II.  I was very impressed with it.

No surprise, since the original Heresy literally saved the company (people didn't have the space or the money for Klipschorns). It's probably still the best selling of the Heritage line, so improving it was a wise choice on their part.

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13 hours ago, wdecho said:

I know in the last few days we have had  heated discussions, disagreements, and I hope you will accept my apology if I have said anything that offended you personally but I would like to comment on your post. You are correct. In better test equipment as well as better audio amplification components there is installed an AC line capacitor for this very reason. To clean up all the noise present in your AC lines. The noise on a electrical line can easily be seen on an oscilloscope along with the fundamental signal.

 

No worries my friend.... life is to short to waste time dwelling on such things. :smile:

 

Yes the basic X and Y type ac line capacitor is a start and if one wants to increase the noise suppression as well as emission back to the AC Line from todays electronic equipment more elaborate filters are available and beneficial.

 

miketn

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11 hours ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

According to Dr. Earl Geddes, who lives near me, one should solve acoustic problems acoustically and electrical problems electrically, however, I'm not a purist in either realm, so if their solutions overlap a bit, that is OK by me.

 

In an ideal world yes I agree but in the real world room modes plague most all of our systems and destroys imaging, tonal balance, mask clarity and detail and cause listener fatigue. Many problems people attribute to the loudspeaker is actually a result of poor modal response of the room below approximately 300Hz in many typical home listening rooms. Unfortunately judging from lack of attention to this problem (which PWK alerted users of his loudspeakers to many decades ago) in most listeners listening rooms many will never know just how good their loudspeakers/systems really are. 

 

Yes the reality is if one applies EQ properly using quality equipment to deal with the room modes that someone is unable or unwilling to treat acoustically it will make some listening positions dramatically better and other areas worse and the challenge is to improve as many listening positions as possible with the least compromise to the priority positions one chooses. If done correctly just dealing with one or two of the worst offending room modes can bring about an often dramatic improvement in reproduction and reduce listener fatigue resulting from them when uncontrolled.

 

I have used the DSpeaker Anti Mode Dual Core 2.0 unit in my system but did upgrade to the higher output version due to the First Watt F-3 lower input sensitivity than most amplifiers. The unit is currently placed in the tape monitor loop of my system so that I can easily bypass as well as demonstrate the improvements this unit has brought to my system.

 

 

 

My current system/room is still a work in progress and has some changes since this picture.

 

miketn

 

 

1799665092_ZebrawoodJubileenewroom.thumb.jpg.36c4cd77346ee025b2611160acd708f2.jpg

 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, mikebse2a3 said:

My current system/room is still a work in progress and has some changes since this picture.

Funny thing is I'm about to paint my walls middle gray with white trim and light gray carpet. Great minds think alike, apparently on decor as well as sound!

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14 hours ago, wdecho said:

It is easy to have another opinion but it is not so easy to follow up and sell your philosophy in a product to the public or the discriminating ears in the audio field. 

I think that is one of the most astute comments I have read on this forum.

 

 

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Guest wdecho
8 hours ago, mikebse2a3 said:

 

In an ideal world yes I agree but in the real world room modes plague most all of our systems and destroys imaging, tonal balance, mask clarity and detail and cause listener fatigue. Many problems people attribute to the loudspeaker is actually a result of poor modal response of the room below approximately 300Hz in many typical home listening rooms. Unfortunately judging from lack of attention to this problem (which PWK alerted users of his loudspeakers to many decades ago) in most listeners listening rooms many will never know just how good their loudspeakers/systems really are. 

 

Yes the reality is if one applies EQ properly using quality equipment to deal with the room modes that someone is unable or unwilling to treat acoustically it will make some listening positions dramatically better and other areas worse and the challenge is to improve as many listening positions as possible with the least compromise to the priority positions one chooses. If done correctly just dealing with one or two of the worst offending room modes can bring about an often dramatic improvement in reproduction and reduce listener fatigue resulting from them when uncontrolled.

 

I have used the DSpeaker Anti Mode Dual Core 2.0 unit in my system but did upgrade to the higher output version due to the First Watt F-3 lower input sensitivity than most amplifiers. The unit is currently placed in the tape monitor loop of my system so that I can easily bypass as well as demonstrate the improvements this unit has brought to my system.

 

 

 

My current system/room is still a work in progress and has some changes since this picture.

 

miketn

 

 

1799665092_ZebrawoodJubileenewroom.thumb.jpg.36c4cd77346ee025b2611160acd708f2.jpg

 

 

 

I can certainly agree with you on one thing. You are certainly serious about your appreciation of music. I, like many others on this forum I'm sure, can only wish for a setup as yours. Impressive. 

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3 hours ago, wdecho said:

I can certainly agree with you on one thing. You are certainly serious about your appreciation of music. I, like many others on this forum I'm sure, can only wish for a setup as yours. Impressive. 

Yes, and your photograph of the side diffusers (my audio bud has his on the ceiling) begs the question........what does your ceiling and back wall look like?

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18 hours ago, Shakeydeal said:

Mike, I see a P300 in your system. I had one of those back in the late 90s when they first came out. Good to see one still around.

 

Shakey

 

Hey Shakey    this one had the latest upgrades at the time I bought it and has been very reliable over the years.

 

miketn

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