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DBX 4BX Mods


babadono

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15 hours ago, Westcoastdrums said:

Nice. I have never played around with a dynamics expander in a hifI system.   If implemented correctly without having a sound signature of its own, I can see the usefulness of such a device.  

 

14 hours ago, Mallette said:

 

DBX has none IF you have a good ear and learn to set it just right. Some find it easy, some take a while. In my case I've used them so long if an adjustment is needed it's a matter of no thought and just doing it. In most cases I already know what I want and when it's off I recognize it immediately. 

Dave

I just wanted to say and I hope it makes sense, it definitely makes recordings sound different. But it is an improvement not an impediment. And if adjusted properly it is subtle. But to me that means it has a sound signature.

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9 minutes ago, babadono said:

just wanted to say and I hope it makes sense, it definitely makes recordings sound different.

Rather pointless if it didn't, wouldn't it? However, restoration to original dynamic range means better fidelity by definition. No offense, but might as well listen to MP3 as a lot of vinyl given the compression. It becomes painfully obvious once you've used a great dynamic range restoration device just how compressed it is. Plus, you get that nice silent "blackness" between cuts known only to digital users and those with high end R2R. 

Dave

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7 minutes ago, Mallette said:

Rather pointless if it didn't, wouldn't it? However, restoration to original dynamic range means better fidelity by definition. No offense, but might as well listen to MP3 as a lot of vinyl given the compression. It becomes painfully obvious once you've used a great dynamic range restoration device just how compressed it is. Plus, you get that nice silent "blackness" between cuts known only to digital users and those with high end R2R. 

Dave

Roger. But I wanted @Westcoastdrums to know it has a "sound". He is thinking of the recording side of things and does not want an expander/gate to color the sound. But the playback side is different. I want to increase the dynamic range of compressed recordings to make them more life(live) like.

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I was thinking of mixing/engineering side of things.   What I meant by color the sound is introduce an unpleasant sound in addition to dynamic restoration.   I can say, there is a TON of compression if most "modern" music.   This is why I said I can certainly see the usefulness of such a a device and I think for many there would be a small learning curve setting it correctly. 

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15 hours ago, Marvel said:

I finally was able to look at what I have for my DAW... I have a Harrison Consoles XT-EG expander/gate. I need to work with it some more to learn it.

 

Dave, it's what I used on that song I sent you.

Marvel, looked this up and watched the youtube. It looks like this is only a downward expander. I could be wrong.

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Just now, Westcoastdrums said:

What I meant by color the sound is introduce an unpleasant sound in addition to dynamic restoration. 

As mentioned above, I've been using dbx in my systems since the late 70's and I don't hear anything except better dynamic range. Of course, I might be deaf as I also hear no difference in high dollar interconnects or power cords. 

 

However, one of my best know quotes is "You can't fix crap." Some stuff is so mushed and compressed that improving the dynamics makes the crap louder as well. That sort of things goes in the trash, virtual or real can. 

Dave

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By the way, your monicker suggests drums. Later dbx units had variable impact restoration that put a lot of punch into drums and other impacts. Can work very well, but it also does the same for all impacts...like record pops! Unless the recording is pristine I rarely use it on LPs for that reason.

Dave

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10 minutes ago, Westcoastdrums said:

For example, if you were to throw a lot of low to mid level pro gear into your system, a lot of it is noisy and from my experience can certainly quite audibly degrade SQ.   

While I originally developed this saying for my photography class years ago, it applies to audio chains as well: Your picture will look precisely as good as the crappiest piece of glass it went through. Same applies to the sound of an audio chain. The sound will be that of the weakest link.

Dave

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12 minutes ago, babadono said:

Marvel, looked this up and watched the youtube. It looks like this is only a downward expander. I could be wrong.

 

You could be correct. I haven't had my DAW powered up for a few weeks to check it out more. I'll look at some others, too. I found one that is a three band and a five band that might be closer.

 

Are the new boards you put in made by THAT? I looked at some of their products but haven't had much time to spend browsing.

 

Bruce

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On 9/14/2018 at 11:03 AM, Marvel said:

 

You could be correct. I haven't had my DAW powered up for a few weeks to check it out more. I'll look at some others, too. I found one that is a three band and a five band that might be closer.

 

Are the new boards you put in made by THAT? I looked at some of their products but haven't had much time to spend browsing.

 

Bruce

Yes I used all new VCAs and RMS level detectors made by THAT Corp. Not that the original DBX ones were bad but I increased the operating voltage to + and - 17 volts from the 12(I love headroom) and the DBX I.C. s were not rated that high. But that was the mods I made a couple years ago to these units. I should have photo documented those mods, it definitely was fun and a huge learning experience. I went through my two units circuit by circuit, opamp by opamp, adjustment by adjustment. These units have like 30 trimpots in them. Talked with engineers at THAT a few times during this period. They came up with the first schematics I was able to find. Later I was able to find some service documentation from a repair shop in San Jose CA. As far as I was able to determine they were the only source for this.

BTW no new boards, just modified the original DBX boards. Edit--Except the Remote Control Receiver boards,those were new from "DownUnder"

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I have a 3BX, but it appears to have an issue in that one band stays red. I didn't toss it yet, even though I figured the likelihood of being able to diagnose and fix it was pretty small. Hope springs eternal...

 

I believe it rather highly regarded by the analog crowd. 

 

Dave

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On ‎9‎/‎13‎/‎2018 at 5:43 PM, Westcoastdrums said:

What were the results? 

First modded unit hooked back into 2 channel system utilizing balanced I/O. Sounds identical to before mods. So I didn't break anything:rolleyes:.

Need to get second one done so I can use in mono, one for each channel.

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I have been a DBX user since I was introduced to them in Germany in 1986, heard a DBX 3BX-III on a nice system playing Phil Collins Sussidio album.  The impact is so amazing it will literally startle you.  I have owned them all including their top of the line components the TX-1, CX-1 and BX-1.  Dual EBX 3BX-DS 3-Band Range Controllers with Impact Restoration units were my absolute favorite.  I have owned many 5BX-DS units as well but I prefer upward expansion not downward but the five bands of independently controllable bands of Impact Restoration were very nice.  I still have a ton of information on their components.

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