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Streaming better sounding than hi-end CD ??


richieb

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— unless my hearing is playing tricks on me a quick switch to steaming the Radio Paradise app through an older iPad at 128k sounds better than either one of my older, yet in their day, hi-end CD players. No Dac just a five buck 3.5 to split RCA cable into the preamp. Sounds cleaner, crisper, better dynamics - what the hello?! I know what I’m hearing or at least think I do. I am both surprised and amazed but of course happy for this perceived gain.

Expanation as to why? Yes, I am old but haven’t been drinking —

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As long as the seedee is standard redbook, (16/44) not much chance of a 128kb stream sounding better. I can't explain what you hear, but that's my take on it.

 

Tidal is the only streaming source that can possibly sound as good as or better than cd. Qobuz is lossles too, but not available in the U.S.  yet.

 

Shakey

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55 minutes ago, rplace said:

I'm not a digital guy beyond background music, but could it be the DAC in laptop is better vs CD player? That and media seems like only difference. What if volume is slightly louder from laptop so it seems better?

 

I would accept this before I would consider that the laptop has a better DAC than the cd player. And even if the DAC was better, lossless will sound better than lossy every time.

 

Shakey

 

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11 hours ago, richieb said:

...unless my hearing is playing tricks on me a quick switch to steaming the Radio Paradise app through an older iPad at 128k sounds better than either one of my older, yet in their day, hi-end CD players. No Dac just a five buck 3.5 to split RCA cable into the preamp. Sounds cleaner, crisper, better dynamics...

It's possible that your hearing itself has drifted over time if you've been listening only to your Jub setup daily.  It also could be the type of music that you're playing...notably amplified or electric instrumentation...that has a great deal of modulation distortion embedded in it and you've become sensitive to those sidebands.  I've found that when asked for a sampling of music types that others are listening to that also claim low-quality lossy tracks sounding better, it usually correlates more closely with "what" they're listening to rather than something having to do with music format (phono, CD, higher resolution digital, lossy, etc.).

 

Note also that Jubilees have some of the lowest induced sidebands of any loudspeaker on the market--especially louder listening levels (90--110 dBC).  Do you get out to hear acoustic music performance, i.e., recalibrate your ears--like PWK mentioned so many times?  This is an important part of that "recalibration of hearing".

 

One of the things that lossy codecs do is to remove higher and lower sidebands to the dominant frequencies, like the arched areas represent (i.e., the envelopes of the specific frequency sidebands) in the following figure--and we can particularly hear the removal of those lower sidebands if our speakers are playing the music cleanly all the time (i.e., not adding their own sidebands):

 

300px-Am-sidebands.png

 

Those sidebands are usually part of the music itself--but they are also what PWK called "the mud factor" if you're regularly listening at higher SPL (greater than 80 dBC at your listening position), and your setup is adding those sidebands at playback time.  Sometimes I get sensitized myself to listening to those things.

 

One of the most interesting effects that I've found in my demastering adventures is that when I find and remove line-level noise (50/100/150 Hz European, 60/120/180 Hz US/Canada), the music sounds much clearer--because those modulation sidebands due to that droning power supply noise are removed.  It's sometimes startling how different and clearer the music sounds when those noise-induced sidebands which have been resurfaced that's been left in the recordings themselves (when I restore the bass levels) are when they are removed from reproduction.

 

Chris

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2 hours ago, Shakeydeal said:

As long as the seedee is standard redbook, (16/44) not much chance of a 128kb stream sounding better. I can't explain what you hear, but that's my take on it.

 

Tidal is the only streaming source that can possibly sound as good as or better than cd. Qobuz is lossles too, but not available in the U.S.  yet.

 

Shakey

Radio Paradise just released their lossless web player.  And for any of you using MIchael Herger's Squeezebox server and Radio Paradise plugin, he just updated the plugin to allow access to the four FLAC mixes.

Mike

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=== Thanks, good points all.

- I do listen to live jazz several times a year but it has been several months now. And yes, a soon as I’m get home I listen for the comparison - live vs. home.

- I rarely listen “loud” but when going from CD to streaming it seems volume levels are similar.

- although both CD players are getting long in the tooth the Pioneer Elite uses what some consider the holy grail of Burr Brown Dacs (dual) 

and the CEC is always regarded as an extremely fine sounding machine. While certainty possible I can’t imagine the Dac in a several year old iPad can match those in the CD.

Another description and one I’ve heard before is it sounds like the glass has been wiped clean, everything seems to be “cleaner, crisper”.

I just changed amps for another point of view - we shall see. 

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8 hours ago, Shakeydeal said:

As long as the seedee is standard redbook, (16/44) not much chance of a 128kb stream sounding better. I can't explain what you hear, but that's my take on it.

 

Tidal is the only streaming source that can possibly sound as good as or better than cd. Qobuz is lossles too, but not available in the U.S.  yet.

 

Shakey

I just got an email from J-River they now offer 2 streaming Radio channels both streaming losssless FLAC ( the channels are currently user support so only asking for a donation above what you pay for j-river) My internet service SUCKS and streaming is pretty much a no go so cant comment on SQ

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