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My Khorn Bass Bins Finally Rock !! ..........................


Cut-Throat
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I have had Khorns for about 13 years now and have never really been satisfied with the Bass on them...   I really only use the Khorn Bass Bins and when I first got the Khorns, I replaced the Khorn Midrange with Altec Multicell Horns.  When I first got the Khorns I started tweaking the Bass Bins with Pipe Insulation on the Backs of them, so that they would 'seal' into the corners. Maybe I didn't do it right, but I was never satisfied with the Bass.

 

  About 5 years ago I upgraded to Oris Horns atop of my Khorn Bass Bins. Everything is pretty much Perfect with the Oris Horns, but the Bass was still not Doing it for me'. So, I installed Baltic Birch Plywood Backs on the Khorn Bass Bins.... Quite a Project.... Was not sure whether it helped or hurt.

 

About a month ago, I decide to go back to the Stock Bass Bins and see what they sounded like, and then maybe start adding tweaks 1 at a time.... So I stripped off the Back Panels... The pipe insulation was already gone to facilitate the Back panels. I pushed the Khorn Bass Bins back into my Corners and fired up the tube Amps.... Holy Moly, I've got Bass Now !!  Sat down and listened to a variety of Tracks and everything 'came to life'... Bass I had never heard out these Khorns before! .... I had 2 audiophile friends over and they were as blown away, as I was. I put on the Track of 'Fanfare for the common Man' by Copeland and we could not believe our ears.  No need to add any tweaks or fool with the PWK Bass Design... I do have great corners with Solid Block walls one one side and 6 inch Thick MDF Panels on the other side to brace the corners....These are really quite perfect for me now.... Tweaks don't always make things better... Not for me anyway.

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15 minutes ago, Cut-Throat said:

Tweaks don't always make things better... Not for me anyway.

 

Rarely is a good word to use here... they (tweaks) do change things though.

 

Sometime change is good, sometimes horrible and sometimes change "tailors" the differences.

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Glad they are doing better for you, after all these years it just shows, little changes can make a big difference. 

 

 

40 minutes ago, Maximus89 said:

I can't tell a difference between pipe insulation and without. Bass is great either way and that's with tired old AA's from 1974. 

I am not one for changes to a design but you really need to put new cape in those old crossovers, you really do. 

 

I have some split LaScala tops with AA crossovers, (same as Khorn tops) they had old original oil can caps so bad they were starting to leak. The caps were changed and the design was kept stock, I didn't expect much difference. I was shocked at the difference, being old and half deaf I didn't have high expectations but I was completely wrong. The sound was easily better, highs and midrange were clearer and crisper and the bass was even better. 

 

If you can solder I would order new caps and do it yourself, if not get someone to do it for you, it will be worth it if it is anything like mine was. I didn't know it was as bad as it was, you get use to how it sounds untill you change, then it's like wow I had no idea they were that bad. 

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Glad they are doing better for you, after all these years it just shows, little changes can make a big difference. 

 

 

I am not one for changes to a design but you really need to put new cape in those old crossovers, you really do. 

 

I have some split LaScala tops with AA crossovers, (same as Khorn tops) they had old original oil can caps so bad they were starting to leak. The caps were changed and the design was kept stock, I didn't expect much difference. I was shocked at the difference, being old and half deaf I didn't have high expectations but I was completely wrong. The sound was easily better, highs and midrange were clearer and crisper and the bass was even better. 

 

If you can solder I would order new caps and do it yourself, if not get someone to do it for you, it will be worth it if it is anything like mine was. I didn't know it was as bad as it was, you get use to how it sounds untill you change, then it's like wow I had no idea they were that bad. 

 

Thanks but Deans got me covered! He’s building me some AAs! I got more excited when I read people’s realization how great it is to freshen up the crossovers.

My first experience was listening to la scalas with deans networks compared to make stock AL. I couldn’t believe it. Though ALs are supposed to be the worst

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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That should do it, I think you will be pleased, good luck. I was never really into if there were big differences, I did it mostly because they were wet and I didn't want it to make a big mess, hoping it would sound better, and it definitely did.  I guess the amount of change depends on how bad the originals are. We will see, looking forward to what you think.   

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2 hours ago, Cut-Throat said:

About 5 years ago I upgraded to Oris Horns atop of my Khorn Bass Bins. Everything is pretty much Perfect with the Oris Horns, but the Bass was still not Doing it for me'. So, I installed Baltic Birch Plywood Backs on the Khorn Bass Bins.... Quite a Project.... Was not sure whether it helped or hurt.

 

About a month ago, I decided to go back to the Stock Bass Bins

I'm not sure what you have.  I think you now have the stock bass bins with an Oris Horn on top. 

 

Does that mean you have a two-way and you've changed your XO's, or do you have a variation of the 3-way and OEM XO's?

 

EDIT I just read your Signature quote.  You have a 2-way that is bi-amped.  I presume that is an active crossover?

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Adding circular pipe insulation to seal the bass bins edges should not affect the bass as much as you described. It had very little affect on my bins. I suspect the crossovers were affected somehow by the replacement horns. One thing that does affect the bass is switching the internal crossover frequency from 80 to 40 HZ. But then again do you have any ghosts in your home?

JJK

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15 minutes ago, wvu80 said:

I'm not sure what you have.  I think you now have the stock bass bins with an Oris Horn on top. 

 

Does that mean you have a two-way and you've changed your XO's, or do you have a variation of the 3-way and OEM XO's?

 

EDIT I just read your Signature quote.  You have a 2-way that is bi-amped.  I presume that is an active crossover?

 I do have Stock Khorn Bass Bins and the Orphean Oris Horn on Top. And it is bi-amped, but it is a 3 Way.

It is a 3 way System..... The Oris Horn has a Compression Midrange Driver with a Coaxial Tweeter.... It uses a Passive Crossover from Oris. The Midrange goes from 270 Hz to 7K Hz and the Tweeter takes over from there.

 

The Khorn Bass Bins are Powered by Hypex Bass Amps with a built in Active Crossover, that I have set at 270 Hz.

 

So, I have 2 Crossovers, 1 Passive and 1 Active.

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2 minutes ago, JJkizak said:

Adding circular pipe insulation to seal the bass bins edges should not affect the bass as much as you described. It had very little affect on my bins. I suspect the crossovers were affected somehow by the replacement horns. But then again do you have any ghosts in your home?

JJK

 

Except the Crossovers were not changed at all..... Like I said, Maybe I had the Insulation on wrong ???? ... Removing the Plywood Backs on Bass Bins were also a Factor.... Anyway I'm back to Stock Khorn Bass Bins..... Using my own Crossovers - 1 Passive for the Midrange > Tweeter and 1 Active for the Woofer.

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2 minutes ago, Cut-Throat said:

 

Except the Crossovers were not changed at all..... Like I said, Maybe I had the Insulation on wrong ???? ... Removing the Plywood Backs on Bass Bins were also a Factor.... Anyway I'm back to Stock Khorn Bass Bins..... Using my own Crossovers - 1 Passive for the Midrange > Tweeter and 1 Active for the Woofer.

 

Do you have any pictures of the before and after the back removal?

JJK

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23 minutes ago, JJkizak said:

 

Do you have any pictures of the before and after the back removal?

JJK

When looking for Pictures of the Backs, I discovered some pictures of the Brackets that I put on my Khorns, that I attached the Backs to. So, I guess I am mistaken, I do not have Stock Bass Bins. I have added four Braces to each Khorn. Maybe I discovered a New Tweak after all????  So, I left the brackets on. They are solid Oak Strips.  Anyway, I'm not changing nothin with the Bass, as they are the best they've sounded in 13 years !

Khorn Tail.jpg

Khorn Tail 2.jpg

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5 minutes ago, Maximus89 said:

interesting. I thought that vertical flat back plate needed to be against the wall but the top plate sticks out keeping it from sitting flush.  Haven't seen that. Mine aren't like that but mine are decorators so...

 

The vertical flat back plate can NOT be against the wall, because it is a corner.... So the corners of the flat back plate sit up against both side walls near the back... that is where I had the pipe insulation ---- you can see the gray stripes running down the sides of the tailboard and that is where the pipe insulation was.

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10 minutes ago, Maximus89 said:

I just googled images of rear klipschorns. Are yours DIY? That that top plate sticking out like that shouldn't be that way.   It's keeping the bass bin from being tight in the corner with the pipe insulation.

Image  reference:
Related image

Yes, I had to make the top of the Bass Bin, because remember, I do not have the TOP hat on which has the back piece to fit in the corner... But you may be on to something. The back piece of the TOP Hat also fits directly in the corner, and I modeled my 'Top Hat' exactly after that.

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Here I just tried to take a photo for a reference of what I’m talking about. I slid the top hat forward so you can see how the back sits against each corner of the wall- i have pipe insulation up and down the back vertical plate and to the sides of the top hat

0aa693471c9beed4f1bff48fbbe0dda1.jpg

Please excuse the unfinished paint lol

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

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4 minutes ago, Maximus89 said:

Your top plate sticking out like that is the issue imo. You need to saw that flat with that vertical back plate. You're essentially having your bass bins stick out from the walls due to that top plate hitting the wall before the rest.  I hope im making sense.

 

Except that the sides of the Khorn Bass Bin hit the Walls first and prevent the Bass Bin from going any further into the corner, long before the pointed back. Even in your picture, you see that you have room for the pointed surface. And remember that my Khorn Bass Bins sound fine currently with the back piece. So, I'm not changing it now for sure!

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