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how to listen?


babadono

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You'll never know until you experiment. Scattering those mid frequencies combined with the right amount of absorption could do wonders.

 

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This is what I am dealing with 19' wide room 32' high curved ceiling (The part from the window wall to the kitchen is where the curved ceiling is...it is all the way up including above the loft which ends where the kitchen can be see in the pics), and 46' long. Front , and side windows will be covered with theater sound curtains as a start.f71f58c55dbc5cc7157a698b549c5efe.jpge7c16ea2de772d04400660a71e51b10c.jpg

 

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Like you I sit against the wall for my KHorns and I have 2 bass traps at the reflection points and one large panel in the middle. I have 2 panels I need to hang at the front, but you got me wondering about diffusers there in your thread. They seem too expensive for me right now though


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Make your own they are not hard nor expensive.

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That room/house is incredible but going to be difficult to work with for audio while maintaining a clean aesthetic if that’s important. Maybe you can get large panels and diffusers attached to stands that you can store away when you’re not doing any critical listening and bring them out in their places when you do?


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What I am planning on doing is having a French cleat made out of plywood going all the way around the room just below the loft , and then hanging acoustic absorbing panels all the way around the room. I then will put a panel in the center between the windows from the panels to the floor, and also bass traps in the corners from the panels to the floor. The loft might also get a row of panels too. I will also make panels for first reflections the best I can. We are thinking of either grey panels or having artwork printed on the panels too. We have one small Persian rug now on the floor in front of our center channel, and will be getting 2 more at least. I want to have a minimum of 1 Persian rug in front of the front 3 speakers, and maybe in front of the surrounds too. My last room was a fully sound treated 2 car garage, and it sounded great... I doubt this one will be anywhere near as good, but we will give it the best we can while maintaining the aesthetics of the house,

That room/house is incredible but going to be difficult to work with for audio while maintaining a clean aesthetic if that’s important. Maybe you can get large panels and diffusers attached to stands that you can store away when you’re not doing any critical listening and bring them out in their places when you do?


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Rather than attempt to invest/interest listeners in my ‘gear’ I prefer to just have guests over and say ‘nothing’ about the music. 90% of the time during their visit I get asked about the system regardless of what’s being played or how loud the volume. It just sounds good, I know and it is clearly evident. When I have directed listeners to enjoy my gear they tend to put on their ‘critical’ ears. 

 

Neighbor has a fairly costly rig featuring German Physiks omnidirectional speakers. Every time we’re there I have to ‘appreciate’ them or the world will wobble out of orbit. They are fine sounding but for what he’s got invested in stuff - they are simply unimpressive. They overwhelm the space. But I am polite. This neighbor knows what I own and I have yet to invite him for an audience. I already know his response.

 

Simply put I enjoy what I have cobbled together and use the system for the simple entertainment of guests. When I wish to ‘flex’ the gear I do so personally. I will play music selections requested by others......... and nobody is allowed to putz with any of my stuff. 

 

 

What I like is when you invite some one over who has spent big $$$, and they hear your setup, and want to know they can get theirs to sound as good. [emoji23] You go to their place, and see there is absolutely zero room treatments, no mlp spot or speakers even setup for sound, just plopped where they think they will look good. [emoji1787][emoji1787]

 

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   @ellisr63, you have a great looking room.  IMHO, you should be careful to not over-deaden.   "Live" isn't too bad, and can be interesting, if you don't have slap-back echo.  That's where lots of DIY diffusers come in.  Is the curved ceiling concave or convex?  If convex, that would provide some diffusion (some would disagree).  The best (home) room I ever heard was live, with many "natural" diffusers, a big, rough fireplace, and the only soft surfaces were chairs and a big Persian carpet.

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The ceiling is concave. I have read you should not dampen more than about 25% of the area, and I will be less than that for sure. We have a nasty echo right now...even with the windows open.

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I have found the best way to evaluate an equipment change is to live with the new piece for a few weeks or months and then switch back to the piece it replaced.  (assuming the piece that was replaced was also "lived with" for at least a few months).     In fact I have gone back and forth between two pieces many times before I came to a conclusion which one I preferred and eventually kept.   I only recently did so with some speakers I have been switching back and forth for over a year.  Each had their own strengths, but it was each of their weaknesses that made me decide.  There are some weaknesses that cannot make up for some strengths. So it is with almost any choice I have made through the years.    (hint: I am keeping my Klipsch Forte Is). 

 

A/B tests can be useful if the differences are large enough to be able to eliminate a choice or two within a few hours or even minutes.  But it is most helpful to already have a base established. That is a default system that you have lived with for some time. 

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  • 1 month later...

 

On 11/8/2018 at 3:39 PM, babadono said:

...What led me to start this thread was another thread where opinions were being expressed about the worth(or worthlessness) of doing A/B comparison tests. Whether blind or not. So is there no merit to testing? Is it all subjective 100%?

...The idea of being able to switch immediately has merit to me. Not to prove or disprove anything but to help one decide which one sounds "better" to them.

 

Hey Babalugats:

 

I just stumbled onto this audio-only recording between Arne Krueger, the recently deceased ABX proponent and audio enthusiast, and John Atkinson, Stereophile editor, in 2005, along with some audience Q&As on the subject that you bring up.  It's an hour long and it highlights the arguments on both sides of the aisle.  This thread seemed like a much better place to put this than the "beginner" threads, which have turned into circuses and clown acts, it seems. (It would be nice if this one didn't turn into one of those, too, if you catch my drift--because there are other active threads for that sort of thing.)

 

I'll let you digest it, then we can talk about what you got out of the discussion.  I see a lot (pro and con) on both sides of the aisle and can say that I've not really heard Atkinson try to defend his position on the subject quite so clearly--along with three pretty interesting insights from Mr. Krueger that should give all the "thinkers anonymous" types here some pause.  I see a pattern (of flaws) in both arguments, but I wonder if you see it, too...

 

https://www.stereophile.com/images/downloads/HE2005_GreatDebate.MP3

 

Chris

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I have a copy of that on my shelf--Paul Newman and George Kennedy at their best.  They don't make 'em like that anymore... 

 

Let me know what you think about the Atkinson/Krueger debate when you get a chance.  I thought it was a good exercise in sharpening up those critical thinking skills rather than the usual serve-it-to-you-on-a-platter pablum from the talking heads--and it's right on point to your question to boot.

 

Chris

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@Chris A May be a little while. This is my last day at work until after New Years. We're off to Peru to visit family and hang out at the beach (summertime south of the equator). I know its tough but someone's got to do it.:) Don't know how much computer time/internet access I will have , we''ll see.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I had a bit of trouble accessing the linked audio file from Stereophile, so I found a YouTube "video" (audio-only) presentation of that Arne Krueger and John Atkinson debate:

 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

What I am thinking of is to use absorbers, and then if I have too much for my liking...make some wood artistic panels to put in front of them like the GIK ones.

 

   [mention=55367]ellisr63[/mention], you have a great looking room.  IMHO, you should be careful to not over-deaden.   "Live" isn't too bad, and can be interesting, if you don't have slap-back echo.  That's where lots of DIY diffusers come in.  Is the curved ceiling concave or convex?  If convex, that would provide some diffusion (some would disagree).  The best (home) room I ever heard was live, with many "natural" diffusers, a big, rough fireplace, and the only soft surfaces were chairs and a big Persian carpet.


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