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Best Cornwall....?


Don McPhee

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1 hour ago, ODS123 said:

 

Just did.  ..He's saying that ALL Klipsch speakers are engineered to be linear (true to input) within their frequency range and that playing louder doesn't mean less linear.  ..But that's NOT what you are saying.  You're saying that Pro speakers sound Better.  ..So, why?  ..If, as CBH states, all Klipsch speakers are designed to faithfully reproduce the input signal would their Pro speakers sound better at home where their tremendous SPL isn't needed??  Especially given that they don't extend nearly as low as, say, Cornwalls, which is essential to my music preferences??   ..My CW III's don't play as loud as their pro speakers but they also don't need a subwoofer.  So why, if this is true, would I have preferred the MCM 1900's you insist are way better?

All speakers need a subwoofer to get to 20 Hz.

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=== I’m thinking ODS123 is not taking into account, or has never heard what a compression driver with a 2 in. exit can accomplish in a two-way system. There is no comparison that to the much smaller horns in the Heritage or consumer line. My only home, pro cinema experience is with Jubes so I can’t comment on the Cornwall/396 comparo. But I have owned Corns,  and Khorns and Jubes at the same time. There is little comparison from extreme low volume to over the top loud. I suppose the Heritage LaScala might be considered the closest to a pro line speaker and while it still remains one of my fav speakers it just physically can’t match a 2 inch driver coupled to a horn big enough to swallow your head. 

Best advice - find yourself a home with pro cinema and listen for yourself. 

 

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The “best” Cornwall hasn’t been built yet...

 

If you are the sort of person that can leave well enough alone, you WILL enjoy the latest iteration available from Klipsch.

 

If however, you are only too aware that tastes evolve and technology does too, grab a pair of used Cornwall 1’s or 2’s and enjoy them as is while you peel the onion in search of a peach of a mod!

 

But once you cut ‘em and stuff ‘em how you please they aren’t “Cornwalls” anymore and any increased expense is a wash as far as resale goes. They will sound better though, and you don’t HAVE to spend a lot. 

 

I still think a two-way would make an excellent Cornwall IV...

 

 

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3 hours ago, ODS123 said:

 

Yes, and I'm dying to read if he agrees with you that a commercial pro Klipsch speaker intended to be a PA speaker in an amusement park will sound appreciably better in a home environment than one intended for that purpose.  ..I think he's helping make my point, not yours.

Definitely not helping to make your point. It’s obvious that you did not understand what I wrote. In case you don’t know, Paul’s four points; high efficiency, low distortion, controlled directivity, and controlled freq response. That’s what I am for and as long as I can help it, that will be the case. Will a Cornwall sound good in a typical living room?  Yep. Will a ki396, 904 or even a grand system......you betcha. You gain headroom, headroom, headroom. Did I mention headroom?  There is no compromise on the acoustic goals but only with what physics and economics limits us. Like bass extension and price points. So before you categorically decide that pro speakers are lacking the attributes of a home system, go listen to one. And now I really hope you get it.......meanwhile back to bass fishing. 

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4 hours ago, ODS123 said:

 

Just did.  ..He's saying that ALL Klipsch speakers are engineered to be linear (true to input) within their frequency range and that playing louder doesn't mean less linear.  ..But that's NOT what you are saying.  You're saying that Pro speakers sound Better.  ..So, why?  ..If, as CBH states, all Klipsch speakers are designed to faithfully reproduce the input signal would their Pro speakers sound better at home where their tremendous SPL isn't needed??  Especially given that they don't extend nearly as low as, say, Cornwalls, which is essential to my music preferences??   ..My CW III's don't play as loud as their pro speakers but they also don't need a subwoofer.  So why, if this is true, would I have preferred the MCM 1900's you insist are way better?

just my opinion, the more efficient the loudspeaker the more realistic it will sound and no attempting to make up level differences with available amplifier power does not make a lower efficiency loudspeaker sound the same as a higher efficiency one, it is not about level. it is about dynamics.

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1 hour ago, richieb said:

 

=== I’m thinking ODS123 is not taking into account, or has never heard what a compression driver with a 2 in. exit can accomplish in a two-way system. There is no comparison that to the much smaller horns in the Heritage or consumer line. My only home, pro cinema experience is with Jubes so I can’t comment on the Cornwall/396 comparo. But I have owned Corns,  and Khorns and Jubes at the same time. There is little comparison from extreme low volume to over the top loud. I suppose the Heritage LaScala might be considered the closest to a pro line speaker and while it still remains one of my fav speakers it just physically can’t match a 2 inch driver coupled to a horn big enough to swallow your head. 

Best advice - find yourself a home with pro cinema and listen for yourself. 

 

large format compression drivers have significantly lower distortion level vs small format drivers. IIRC it's around half as much lower. again it is not about level in a home setting.

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I don't pretend to put myself into any designers shoes, but the 396 has always struck me as the Cornwall on steroids.

 

Take the Cornwall, make it 2-way, slap the 510 inside and give it a stout woofer....  whaddya got?  Beats me but for my sensibility, it would seem to emulate the 396.

 

You gain from the large format driver.

You gain from the loss of a crossover point.

 

 

Now....for a new conversation,  can we hijack this thread to actives verses passives & different brands of caps??

 

:emotion-14:

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3 hours ago, Chief bonehead said:

 So before you categorically decide that pro speakers are lacking the attributes of a home system, go listen to one. And now I really hope you get it....

 

Now you're putting words in my mouth.  I didn't say that.  I'm asking the question why would pro speakers sound better in a home setting than those built for that specific purpose.

 

You mention headroom...  My Cornwall III's, which are situated in my 18'-20' great-room, play at ear-bleeding levels with a mere 5 watts.  ..And they are linear +/-3db from 34Hz - 20kHz.  So what headroom am I missing from speakers that are meant to fill much large spaces?  And to match the extension of the CWIII's I'd need a subwoofer.

 

Am I incorrect about this?

 

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Sowhat headroom am I missing from speakers that are meant to fill much large spaces? 

 

That question has been answered.  They are not MEANT to solely fill large spaces.   That is your assumption.  Has nothing to do with frequency response, ear bleeding levels, an auditorium or an amusent park.   You are bringing up points that arent relevant as to why you feel klipsch Pro doesn't belong in the house.  The only and only argument I would have in favor of your pro speakers aren't meant for the house argument is that they would be considered ugly to many with truck bed liner finish. Doesn't bother me. Sound first to me.  I think you would be surprised how deep the 396s dig in a room without a sub. I listen to plenty of genres of music with deep, powerful extended bass and they would probably shock you.   They Def have MORE bass, both quality and quantity than Cornwall IIIs.  I have owned both and used them in the same room, placed the same with the same equipment.  A sub is not needed for everyone I'm sure.   People here argue jubes and klipschorns need subs, not for me.   

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40 minutes ago, Westcoastdrums said:

 People here argue jubes and klipschorns need subs, not for me.   

It's not an argument, it's a CHOICE. You can't get to 20 Hz. without a Subwoofer. I have owned 2 pairs of Khorns, Jubilees, MWMs, and designed Quarter Pie Horns. ALL of them NEED a sube to get the FEEL and impact of MOVIES.............................for music, not so much.

 

I have enjoyed my Jubilees with Roy's 32 Hz. boost and for 2-channel HDTV watching netflix and the occasional movie (while I create a full HT system upstairs). So going active with PEQs on a Jube leaves me not NEEDING a sub for music as the FEEL of the bass in my calf muscles is there.

 

Again, it's a CHOICE, not an argument.................................and, the CURVES don't lie about getting down to 20 Hz.............you just can't get there flat without a sub, PERIOD.

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Argument - an exchange of diverging or opposite views

 

OR Choice, same difference in this case.   I wasn't using it negatively.   I don't watch movies and crave insane bass from my system. If I did, I absolutely agree with you.   I say it depends on the room as well.  Very difficult to pressure a large room from a pair of Klipschorns.   Smaller room, maybe.  I'm not debating that a large, dedicated driver for low frequencies isn't necessary to properly reproduce the lowest of frequencies with authority.   Haven't said that, neither will I.   It was stated that a Cornwall III goes to 32 hz and the 396 goes to 60 hz, as that was the model being compared.   I said I prefer a sub with the latter for my tastes.  However, the bass quality and quantity exceeds what I got from the Cornwall III despite a smaller cabinet.   This is a case of numbers on paper certainly don't tell the whole story IMO.   IF I had a larger room and neighbors that were realized, I would buy a pair of jubes and a PAIR of danley TH118 subs.   So I'm not stating other than your opinion here haha. 

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49 minutes ago, Westcoastdrums said:

 IF I had a larger room and neighbors that were realized, I would buy a pair of jubes and a PAIR of danley TH118 subs.   So I'm not stating other than your opinion here haha. 

Klipsch the best music your neighbors will ever hear :D  My nearest neighbor is about an 1/8 of a mile away through the woods. He shoots lots of guns and I shoot guns and play big speakers and we all get along just fine.

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