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bop29291

Onkyo tx-nr636 Pre-outs options

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Have no pre-outs, is there an HDMI work around if I use a preamp? Trying to plan use on this new to me Harman Kardon Signature Series 2.1 for 5 channels while maintaining my Atmos option.
 
Splitter on HDMI Main perhaps?

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Not sure I fully understand :(   But ... had an Onkyo NR676 and had the same problem.  About a year ago I upgraded to the RZ810 which does have full preouts.  Added bonus was that it forwards HDMI channels - but only HDMI 1-3. I use the "Zone-2" out to drive a 2-channle preamp into a Crown K1 amp with KPT-904 speakers. Haha; awesome :D 

 

There are very good (and very expensive) AV preamps out there ... probably an AV upgrade would be much cheaper.  And you could feed your 5-channel HK with it.

HDMI splitter?  I have split HDMI signals before and had no problem. There are HDMI to 5.1 audio "extractors" available ... example https://www.amazon.com/1080P-SPDIF-Digital-multi-channel-Decoders/dp/B01CQ8AWVA ... just no clue if they are any good. :) 

 

Cheers, Emile

 

NewEgg also has some ... maybe worth a try, but ... haha; how good can it be for $40???

AHED_131837847624406413VSU44Gez2W.jpg

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Well 98% of my use is home theater, and I was hoping by now that HDMI to a pre amp would be an option and that my 636 would somehow do that because it doesn't have the traditional RCA pre outs. I haven't shopped preamps yet but would need one either way. Thanks

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk

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43 minutes ago, bop29291 said:

Anyone?

My apologies Bop, but "anyone"...what?  I'm not trying to be a jerk, I'm just not sure what it is you need, or what you are asking.  B)

 

If you mean your original question in Post 1 of this thread it I've never tried to add an integrated amp to an AVR. 

 

FYI I have an Onk 717 from 2014 which has preouts for all seven channels.  I bought it under powered with pre-outs knowing that some day I might add a power amp.  Last year I found a good deal on a used Emotiva XPA-5 200 wpc which is much stronger than the anemic 110 wpc from the 717.

 

In my opinion if you want more horsepower, get a bigger horse.

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I don't know if that extractor would even be the right voltage to work as preouts ? I don't know what voltage is normal for preouts on a receiver.

 

Would the volume out of a HDMI increase when you turn the volume up on the receiver, I don't think it does.

 

?

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On 2/7/2019 at 12:54 PM, bop29291 said:

Well 98% of my use is home theater, and I was hoping by now that HDMI to a pre amp would be an option and that my 636 would somehow do that because it doesn't have the traditional RCA pre outs. I haven't shopped preamps yet but would need one either way. Thanks

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk
 

For the money its fine, I have a 616 in a bedroom, THX and pretty robust for cheap. When I buy a radio the feature set needs to meet my needs for the unit. I generally consider preouts a must unless more power will never be needed for its use. Strange as it is, many avrs with preouts are the mid upper end less likely to need them......

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I'm sorry my question wasn't specific enough so here it is...

Do either of these HDMI outputs supply a multi channel signal that could supply a newer model preamp?

Are any new AVR's even using dedicated HDMI port instead of RCA?

I realize just buying a new AVR with pre-outs could solve this problem, but I'd rather "invest" any monies to a preamp rather then another AVR at this time, but still retain my other two channels to run the Atmos since my amp is only 5ch.

4119ae6234023b392aac5d94c77dcb94.jpg

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk

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14 minutes ago, bop29291 said:

Do either of these HDMI outputs supply a multi channel signal that could supply a newer model preamp?

If it did it would have to be the OUT main on the right.

Is there any way to split your source straight to the newer preamp, like a separate system but the same source, I do this now.

I think you can split almost any connection, even optical which is 5.1 or more and run both systems at the same time.

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1 hour ago, bop29291 said:

Do either of these HDMI outputs supply a multi channel signal that could supply a newer model preamp?

 

The answer to your question is No.  The HDMI OUT supplies a signal OUT to the TV via ARC, the Audio Return Channel.  It does not provide HDMI support OUT to another pre-amp, or even another amp.  To connect to that external amp would require a 2-wire RCA cable (typical) or 3-wire XLR (high end, not typical).

 

The main new feature of the "modern preamps" is ARC, something older pre-pros did not have.  A standard pre-amp is also called a pre-pro, meaning before the amplifier and providing the processing for each of the speaker channels.  In the case of your 636 you are getting 5.1 plus two Atmos channels for a total of 7 channels, 5.1.2.

 

Your 636 HAS a preamp built-in and then supplies the processing to a power amp.  I don't know of any AVR which provides a PREAMP OUT to another external PREAMP.  Those AVR's that have a PREAMP OUT go to an external amplifier.  The 636 internal amp is bypassed in favor of the external amp.  That's how my ONK 717 is designed and how I use it.  The Onk 717 is the pre-pro to an external amp, the Emotiva XPA-5.  That means with my specific AVR I can power any five speakers externally and that I need two of the 717's internal amps to get me to my max 7.2 speaker.

 

 

Quote


Are any new AVR's even using dedicated HDMI port instead of RCA?

 

I'm not sure what a "dedicated HDMI port" is.  Except for ARC the HDMI is used to bring a signal IN to the AVR, for Game, Set Top box, Computer, Blu-ray disc player, etc.

I realize just buying a new AVR with pre-outs could solve this problem, but I'd rather "invest" any monies to a preamp rather then another AVR at this time, but still retain my other two channels to run the Atmos since my amp is only 5ch.

 

If you got a new AVR with pre-outs you could then run an external amp, generally used for more power to the L/C/R. 

 

The expensive alternative would be to get a dedicated pre-pro that would control all the speakers, but it would not provide any power.  By design this would require an external amp.

 

1 hour ago, bop29291 said:

I realize just buying a new AVR with pre-outs could solve this problem, but I'd rather "invest" any monies to a preamp rather then another AVR at this time,

but still retain my other two channels to run the Atmos since my amp is only 5ch.

 

Your 636 AVR's amp is 7 channel, 5 main speakers and two Atmos speakers.  You cannot assign the amp outputs because your unit is not designed to do that.  No matter your intent your 636 will not be able to process any more than 7 speakers, the max being 7.2 or 5.2.2 exclusively with your 636's internal amps.

 

I am confused how the HK 2.1 comes into play.  It's a dedicated 5 channel power amp w/100 wpc.  Your Onk 636 has no way to interface with it due to the limitation of your AVR.

https://www.amazon.com/Harman-Kardon-Signature-2-1-Multichannel/dp/B0000300CS/ref=redir_mobile_desktop?_encoding=UTF8&*Version*=1&*entries*=0

 

Am I making any sense?  I feel like maybe we are using different terms to describe the same things.  I apologize in advance if I've over-explained.

 

 

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WVU80 and others who took time to reply.

 

Thanks for the answer on the HDMI. Just what I was looking for.

 

Yes I was using preamp and pre-outs interchangeably. I have now been taken to school and it won't happen again.

 

Yes my 636 is 7.2. and I'm aware of what they all do. My mention of using two channels from the 636 was in fact only once the 636 and the 5ch external amp were connected (now know that's not possible) and running LCR LS RS off the external and using 636 to handle back surround or height. Doesn't matter now of course lol.

 

Thanks again for taking your time to reply with such detail.

 

We can now consider this closed as I'll be looking for another AVR as I do take advantage of some of the other features they offer.

 

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk

 

 

 

 

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