Wider acceptance of the 402/510??

[dtel]

3 hours ago, Dave A said:

YES and I am impatiently waiting to get the rest of the stuff in to dial in the 402's and MWM's. It is a different world and firing up the 402 for the first time was an eye opener.

I am impatiently waiting with you, just to hear what you think. 

[Dave A]

3 hours ago, dtel said:

I am impatiently waiting with you, just to hear what you think. 

At  least I get to dial it all in for the MWM's and 402's this coming week. I bet that gets me close to what I will need for the Super too.

[Deang]

The 402 is too small. A wiener horn. 

[Dave A]

2 minutes ago, Deang said:

The 402 is too small. A wiener horn. 

Wonder what the upper limit on size would be for a 500hz and up horn lens?

[dtel]

2 hours ago, Deang said:

The 402 is too small. A wiener horn. 

And all horns are honky anyway, Coytee has been saying it for years.

[Islander]

2 hours ago, dtel said:

And all horns are honky anyway, Coytee has been saying it for years.

 

So if all horns are honky, does that make them the first choice of speakers to reproduce this sound?

 

 

[Coytee]

22 hours ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

Also very few people that own stereos are Serious Listeners. Serious means little or no lighting, eyes closed, etc. for a more concentrated experience for Strictly their hearing mechanism (IOW, minimizing all other senses in the process). Even people that are serious listeners, and own LaScalas with Subwoofers, unless they have a dedicated room for Stereo (and/or HT), they are not willing to put a K-402 on top of a LaScala, where the "tweeter" is bigger than the woofer and looks silly!! Those who have Khorns, don't generally want to spoil their looks. So, to "do it right" means you gotta have Jubilees with a pretty face and no other "votes" in the household!! Your Mileage May Vary (and will).

 

22 hours ago, Coytee said:

It's a small toehold but it just seems to me the 402 is starting to get some traction in the general conversations of people.  Well, maybe not general because you still have 99% of the folks who want a Pioneer HPM 100 or something similar.  But for those who are "woke"....

 

Yep, I agree.  (tried to account for them with my 99% comment)...

 

I know you get it... you've had more horns in your hands than Roy's caught bass (or do I mean bass?)

 

[Coytee]

8 hours ago, dtel said:

And all horns are honky anyway, Coytee has been saying it for years.

 

We'll just have to change it and let it be known the K402 is not only a wiener horn.....but, it's the chosen horn for wieners!

 

So now, as you sing along with the "I'm a (Dr.) Pepper too" song....you can interlace it with "I'm a Weiner too"

 

You get the chant started......  GO!

 

 

[HPower]

11 hours ago, Deang said:

The 402 is too small. A wiener horn. 

 

As Crocodile Dundee would say, "Now that's a horn"

 

 

[Blvdre]

19 hours ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

I have ALWAYS said, the bigger the horn, the better the horn. Either way it takes an exceptional woman, who loves music enough,  to "allow" a man to have those in the house. This is a REALITY check, as confirmed by many posters here who have mentioned the WAF and GAF in their many posts. Don't shoot the messenger! I raise my wine glass to those exceptional women (Dtel's wife and Rigma's being two that I know of).

IMO, the relevant point is that some people don't or can't accommodate large speakers, in spite of the advantages, period. I hate the term WAF. Women who like large speakers are not exceptional, I know plenty of them. 

[geoff.]

20 hours ago, tigerwoodKhorns said:

It seems like Roy should make a CF4 with the 510 horn, in  a fully finished cabinet, front and back veneered. 

 

...a CF-5... with 15” woofers!

 

End of story.

[Chris A]

14 hours ago, Dave A said:

Wonder what the upper limit on size would be for a 500hz and up horn lens?

A horn whose mouth is equivalent to ~17.4" diameter would be about the maximum size for which the horn would return increased horn gain at 500 Hz. It needs to be at least 6.8" deep from the mouth to the acoustic center of the compression driver in order to achieve full horn gain performance at 500 Hz. 

 

So for a horn that's good to 200 Hz, that size increases to 5/2(17.4") = 43.5" diameter. 

 

By the way, these are horns (below) with "horn lenses" attached--a Bart Locanthi invention while he was still at CalTech in the 1940s:

 

 

The horn includes the portion that extends from the driver to the angled Venetian blind horn lenses.  It's actually a misnomer to call a horn a "horn lens": it creates confusion, IME.  JBL stopped using horn lenses in the 1970s-80s when they figured out how to get the same dispersion using horns with "constant coverage" profiles.

 

Chris

[ClaudeJ1]

3 hours ago, HPower said:

 

As Crocodile Dundee would say, "Now that's a horn"

 

 

Look like Roy's future vented 2102????

[ClaudeJ1]

1 hour ago, Chris A said:

By the way, these are horns (below) with "horn lenses" attached--a Bart Locanthi invention while he was still at CalTech in the 1940s:

Bart Locanthi, FYI, is the guy behind the TAD driver design for Pioneer, which we all know and love!! Gee, I wonder why it's 4" diaphragm is so similar to JBL's?? LOL

[ClaudeJ1]

3 hours ago, Blvdre said:

IMO, the relevant point is that some people don't or can't accommodate large speakers, in spite of the advantages, period. I hate the term WAF. Women who like large speakers are not exceptional, I know plenty of them. 

Knowing a .00001% of women as anecdotal evidence does not change the statistical truth. My ex-wife didn't my Khorn in our tiny apartment, she bought me the very first Sony CD player for Christmas back in 1983, and I got her some Oak Heresys (which she kept when we went our separate ways). She also arranged a trip to Hope for me to meet PWK back in 1985. Some women can "compromise" and some refuse. There are ALWAYS exceptions to everything and everyone in LIFE.

[pzannucci]

My better half (oops) doesn't even like the little 511s on top of my 8cuf bass sections.  Go figure.

She did like the long gone khorns sitting in the corners though.

 

Perhaps a 510 with a finished top would split the difference.

[Dave A]

4 hours ago, Chris A said:

A horn whose mouth is equivalent to ~17.4" diameter would be about the maximum size for which the horn would return increased horn gain at 500 Hz. It needs to be at least 6.8" deep from the mouth to the acoustic center of the compression driver in order to achieve full horn gain performance at 500 Hz. 

 

So for a horn that's good to 200 Hz, that size increases to 5/2(17.4") = 43.5" diameter. 

 

By the way, these are horns (below) with "horn lenses" attached--a Bart Locanthi invention while he was still at CalTech in the 1940s:

 

 

The horn includes the portion that extends from the driver to the angled Venetian blind horn lenses.  It's actually a misnomer to call a horn a "horn lens": it creates confusion, IME.  JBL stopped using horn lenses in the 1970s-80s when they figured out how to get the same dispersion using horns with "constant coverage" profiles.

 

Chris

So are they just loud or are they musical too?

[Chris A]

This quote is from one of the guys that I trust over at diyAudio: https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/192615-horn-lens-experience-mixing-lows-highs-jbl-2390-a.html#post2639286

 

A picture of the lens and horn assembly that's described in the above quote:

 

 

and a pdf file of its specifications and performance: http://www.jblpro.com/pub/obsolete/Acoustic_Lens_Family1.pdf

 

Chris

[Blvdre]

8 hours ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

Knowing a .00001% of women as anecdotal evidence does not change the statistical truth. My ex-wife didn't my Khorn in our tiny apartment, she bought me the very first Sony CD player for Christmas back in 1983, and I got her some Oak Heresys (which she kept when we went our separate ways). She also arranged a trip to Hope for me to meet PWK back in 1985. Some women can "compromise" and some refuse. There are ALWAYS exceptions to everything and everyone in LIFE.

Whatever you need to tell yourself, Claude. The issue isn't statistical truth; it's about prejudice, and painting any group with a broad brush. It's a sh*tty way to treat people. "Some people can compromise and some refuse". Pretty simple.

[ClaudeJ1]

2 hours ago, Blvdre said:

Whatever you need to tell yourself, Claude. The issue isn't statistical truth; it's about prejudice, and painting any group with a broad brush. It's a sh*tty way to treat people. "Some people can compromise and some refuse". Pretty simple.

Dude, chill out. Your over reacting a bit. I actually agree with you, but it's still a small percentage of women. I photographed over 35,000 women as a Pro Photographer. 95% of the ones I talked to never heard of Klipsch and preferred BOSE. Your sample rate is too low to call it truth, and you don't know me well enough to be so long on conclusions and short on data. As to you "broad brush" comment, it could serve as a pun if I didn't prefer a paint spray gun and roller. It's not that serious, really. It seems you skipped the last part of what I wrote: "There are ALWAYS exceptions to everything and everyone in LIFE." BTW, there are many men who would not have big speakers in their house either! Some of those are my friends and relatives.

 

Apparently you know a lot of exceptional women who like big speakers. Great.