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What were Chorus cabinets made out of?

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On 3/21/2019 at 8:57 PM, jason str said:

 

Post a picture for the OP, i have no doubt Klipsch used scraps available at the time so not to waste good stock.

 

My point was not to expect plywood where MDF was specified.

In my experiences at the plant, Klipsch never made ANY speakers using "scrap" of any kind except for with the crossover network boards. But, I left in OCT '83!  And you would be surprised how many folks who worked there were found digging out VERY USABLE "scrap" from the "scrap trailer" after work at the loading dock in front of the cabinet shop all of the time!!...INCLUDING MYSELF!!  It was standard to use plywood for the motor-boards and rear panels, though!  As Klipsch BEGAN its production of the earliest of these speakers, they were still in the process of using veneered poplar lumber-core plywood for the side, top and bottom panels of the boxes, unless they were "decorator" models...so for awhile there may have been some made out of poplar lumber-core plywood for those particular panels, but the INTENT seemed to be a move towards using veneered MDF for the sides, tops and bottoms when I left in 1983.  R&D had already been playing around with testing out MDF for those panels in the speakers...and had even built up some LaScalas using it for their testing. GP had kept jacking-up the prices of the Poplar lumber-core panels in fine veneer, and R&D saw the cost advantages and sonic advantages to moving to MDF as much as possible for production in the future...and the Chorus, Quintet, etc. were still in the works, along with all but the earliest of the KG series (KG2 was already beginning production at the time).  SO, I am pretty sure that they were all DESIGNED with use of MDF panels wherever possible, while retaining plywood for use in anything that would need to be routed-out and have drivers installed to it....based upon what I saw happening before I left in Oct '83.  The industrial line at the time would remain plywood construction throughout.  JRH can expand on all of what I SAW/HEARD, since he was so heavily directly-involved in the R&D in those days.  FWIW, Being in the cabinet shop part of the plant gave us much more of a clue as to what was in the works...simply because so much of what was GONNA happen tended to show up there, very early on in its PHYSICAL development, as far as cabinet-construction development went, ie.: "What the hell is that??"  "I can't tell ya, it's top secret!!"  Kinda hard to do totally "top-secret" development when you gotta go to the cabinet shop with it all of the time...back in those days!

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I know the Chorus 1's have a plywood motorboard you can count the ply's in all the cut-outs, pretty sure the Chorus II's are the same.

20180111_093236 - Copy (1024x1017).jpg

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1 hour ago, HDBRbuilder said:

In my experiences at the plant, Klipsch never made ANY speakers using "scrap" of any kind except for with the crossover network boards.

I did not figure scrap for one second. pieces that big are never scrap.  In your opinion would 1989 be way to late for the all lumbercore builds? What fooled me here when I was told this was all wood was the sound of the side and top panels. It was exactly like the back sounded and I am used to MDF sounding different.

 

 

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14 hours ago, Dave A said:

I did not figure scrap for one second. pieces that big are never scrap.  In your opinion would 1989 be way to late for the all lumbercore builds? What fooled me here when I was told this was all wood was the sound of the side and top panels. It was exactly like the back sounded and I am used to MDF sounding different.

 

 

It's possible that the very first production Chorus I's were will made out of Plywood and Poplar Core Veneers, just like the other Heritage. I remember Woody Jackson, then VP of Marketing/Sales,  coming to our local Klipsch dealer to demo the first Chorus I. I asked Him if would replace the Cornwall. His reply? "We'll let the Market decide." The market did decide. You can still get New Cornwall's, but the Chorus I or II is only available used.

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Could very well be the earlier Chorus used plywood in the construction as mentioned.

 

The cabinet material description implied by Klipsch says MDF but it seems this must be taken with a grain of salt.

 

Information on Chorus and k-48.pdf

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My Chorus I speakers are 3/4 inch plywood,about 90 lbs apiece I estimate,loaded.1989 build.

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On 3/26/2019 at 4:13 PM, a9050lx said:

My Chorus I speakers are 3/4 inch plywood,about 90 lbs apiece I estimate,loaded.1989 build.

OK how did you verify plywood in the sides and top? I mean I think mine might also be plywood but I can't prove it without damaging something to see.

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The risers were very likely part of the cut sheet for matching purposes, check the bottom of the risers.

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9 hours ago, Dave A said:

OK how did you verify plywood in the sides and top? I mean I think mine might also be plywood but I can't prove it without damaging something to see.

for mdf to remain stable it must have a veneer layer om each side preferably the same type of veneer so that expansion and contraction is balanced. similar but less expensive wood veneers are often used foe the non show side to save money.

   all you need to do to solve the the question of mdf or ply question is to drill a small hole into the the panel that you want to know about and take a look at what comes out of the hole. when you are done you can fill the hole with glue and forget about it.

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31 minutes ago, moray james said:

for mdf to remain stable it must have a veneer layer om each side preferably the same type of veneer so that expansion and contraction is balanced. similar but less expensive wood veneers are often used foe the non show side to save money.

   all you need to do to solve the the question of mdf or ply question is to drill a small hole into the the panel that you want to know about and take a look at what comes out of the hole. when you are done you can fill the hole with glue and forget about it.

I smiled at the for MDF to remain stable comment. Avoid drops, shocks, water, wives with planters, friends with cold sweaty drinks and humidity would be a reasonable start to that besides a real wood bandaid on both sides. Good tip and if these weren't already sold I would do so. 

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I can tell whether MDF by looking at the painted edges of the box's main body panels at the rear of the speaker cabinets....but not always when looking at PICS of them!  I can also tell about near-surface voids in the plys of finely-veneered and birch plywood by sweeping my hand across the surface and the listening for sound changes as my hand moves....advantage of building them for years!  I culled lots of box panels in my days for immediate near-surface voids which would have been a major quality-control mistake if they had been used!!  Just imagine your breaking through the fine veneer when moving your new speakers around..due to a void under that veneer!!  That would likely be a PR/QC catastrophe in this day and age!!

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1 hour ago, HDBRbuilder said:

I can tell whether MDF by looking at the painted edges of the box's main body panels at the rear of the speaker cabinets....but not always when looking at PICS of them!  I can also tell about near-surface voids in the plys of finely-veneered and birch plywood by sweeping my hand across the surface and the listening for sound changes as my hand moves....advantage of building them for years!  I culled lots of box panels in my days for immediate near-surface voids which would have been a major quality-control mistake if they had been used!!  Just imagine your breaking through the fine veneer when moving your new speakers around..due to a void under that veneer!!  That would likely be a PR/QC catastrophe in this day and age!!

I had a Timber broker come to my land once to look at timber. We walked around for half a day and he had a hatchet with a flat end with him. He would tap the trees and could tell if there was a void or crack and how far up and big they were. Now I could not go out there and do it but I could hear the difference. Experience means a lot.

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16 minutes ago, Dave A said:

I had a Timber broker come to my land once to look at timber. We walked around for half a day and he had a hatchet with a flat end with him. He would tap the trees and could tell if there was a void or crack and how far up and big they were. Now I could not go out there and do it but I could hear the difference. Experience means a lot.

It is also how 18-wheeler operators determine check for adequate tire pressure in the tires of the rig...claw hammer with wooden handle...holding the hammer head, they tap the wooden handle against the tire and the sound will tell them what they need to know.  Fast check that confirms things!  Having 18 tires to check and getting paid by the mile has created its own rapid solutions to particular checks!  It also provides a valid reason for the claw hammer in the door pocket by the driver seat....LOL!

 

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On 3/28/2019 at 4:22 AM, Dave A said:

OK how did you verify plywood in the sides and top? I mean I think mine might also be plywood but I can't prove it without damaging something to see.

I am probably wrong.The motor board looks closer to 1 inch Ply as looking through the ports.The sides have black painted veneer and sound like ply when thumped on,LOL.

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On 3/26/2019 at 3:50 PM, jason str said:

Could very well be the earlier Chorus used plywood in the construction as mentioned.

 

The cabinet material description implied by Klipsch says MDF but it seems this must be taken with a grain of salt.

 

Information on Chorus and k-48.pdf 125.5 kB · 4 downloads

Remember, those descriptions were edited whenever something changed for a speaker...so what you read is the final VERSION FOR A particular model.

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On 3/28/2019 at 11:45 AM, jason str said:

The risers were very likely part of the cut sheet for matching purposes, check the bottom of the risers.

Risers were never part of the cut sheet, per se...they took panels that had something minor wrong with them and ripped them into riser parts.  For example some live-wood in walnut which looks kinda creamy in color (which was ripped out)...or a bad glue line where the book-match of the veneers met on a box panel...things like that.

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On 4/4/2019 at 8:44 PM, HDBRbuilder said:

Risers were never part of the cut sheet, per se...they took panels that had something minor wrong with them and ripped them into riser parts.  For example some live-wood in walnut which looks kinda creamy in color (which was ripped out)...or a bad glue line where the book-match of the veneers met on a box panel...things like that.

 

Makes sense to use up scrap material where you can, i used mine for bracing normally.

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