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I am saddened for the historical loss. As for donations, there's far better and needier causes to be focused on. The Catholic Church is definitely one of the wealthiest organizations from anywhere between $15-30 billion net worth. That, ontop of whatever insurance will provide, should have any and all restorative plans covered.  

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Just now, babadono said:

GOT INSURANCE?

No insurance like the love of peoples world wide for such a structure. It was built on faith, and will be restored by faith. I was a contributing member of the Cathedral Guild in the 70s that saw completion of the National Cathedral in DC. It's become a place for all people of all, or of no, faith. This has nothing to do with any religion but with human values. 

Dave

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Roger Dave, just saying some of that better have been insured.

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15 minutes ago, haydukej said:

I am saddened for the historical loss. As for donations, there's far better and needier causes to be focused on. The Catholic Church is definitely one of the wealthiest organizations from anywhere between $15-30 billion net worth. That, ontop of whatever insurance will provide, should have any and all restorative plans covered.  

 

There are literally millions of other places  you could donate your money and I encourage you to do so as you see fit. 

 

I actually see the significance structures like this have on communities and the positive role they play in bringing people of all walks of life together. 

 

I donate other places but I will be pitching in something here also. 

 

If I donated to every charity or person in need out there, I would quickly turn into one of those in need. What good would that do anyone? 

 

Again, donate how you see fit but others should do the same. 

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29 minutes ago, K5SS said:

I actually see the significance structures like this have on communities and the positive role they play in bringing people of all walks of life together. 

Hear! Hear! Our support and efforts should be in all areas of human need, and the need for continuity in our shared history is one of them. Standing in a thousand year old human structure anywhere in the world stimulates the mind in ways few other things can and reminds us that human accomplishments are part of nature's accomplishments and should be protected and preserved as we do our plant and animal life, our oceans, and atmosphere. 

 

Dave

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1 hour ago, Mallette said:

Hear! Hear! Our support and efforts should be in all areas of human need, and the need for continuity in our shared history is one of them. Standing in a thousand year old human structure anywhere in the world stimulates the mind in ways few other things can and reminds us that human accomplishments are part of nature's accomplishments and should be protected and preserved as we do our plant and animal life, our oceans, and atmosphere. 

 

Dave

I really FEEL THE LOSS due to this fire in Paris!!  I actually visited the Notre Dame Cathedral a few times while I was stationed in Europe!!  SIMPLY AMAZING!!!  I've always "gotten into" architectural history, anyway!  And I seriously studied every aspect of it while in different places in Europe at different times!  Even the most "relatively simple" of the most ancient structures are VERY interesting...and often have a really surprising things going on with them, which the vast majority of tourists just never even get the chance to learn about...for example:

 

For a short time, while I was assigned in Vicenza, Italy in the 1970's...my very first "unofficial" off-post apartment was on the second floor of a building which had been constructed during the time of the Roman Republic!!...over two thousand years earlier!!  It only had wooden window shutters...no glass at all...just like when it was originally built.  On the floor beneath the "bedroom" window, was a SOLID thick, still-charred block of marble,  where for centuries, in the winter, a brazier had stood to warm up the chilled air making its way into the room through the wooden window shutters...by putting hot coals onto the brasier! for over-nite winter sleeping comfort.  The remainder of the upstairs floor, except where windows were, was made up of thick wooden boards....( with tiny gaps between them to allow for downstairs heat to rise into the upstairs rooms)...laid upon on heavy wooden beams!  The floor of the ground level rooms, ACTUALLY was original marble slabs and had been built for continuous winter-time hot water under-floor heating...provided by a copper boiler that had originally been located at the back of the building!!....just beside the back door (..Some of its parts were still behind the house!!)!  The boiler would be fired up in the winter-time afternoon/evening and as the water boiled over, it was channeled through a maze-like stone canal under the down-stairs floor, which ever so gently sloped downward throughout the maze and,  at its end, the cooled-off water returned to a stone basin behind the house, right beside where the boiler had once been!!  My Italian "landlord" further explained how the under-floor maze for first floor heat in the winter ALSO provided outside fresh-air cooling for the building during the hot summers!!!  I was a "student of ancient architecture" the entire time I was stationed in Italy!!    SOME REALLY AMAZING architectural technology was used WAY "back in the day"!!!

 

So, whenever there is a serious damage or destruction to ANY classic piece of architecture, it is REALLY a damage or destruction of a remaining part of the history of human existence on earth!!  And that is sad, indeed!

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On 4/15/2019 at 1:26 PM, CECAA850 said:

Have they determined the cause?

An accident during major renovations has been mentioned. Given that, I suspect it was caused by welding which starts a lot of accidental fires.

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7 minutes ago, HDBRbuilder said:

My Italian "landlord" further explained how the under-floor maze for first floor heat in the winter ALSO provided outside fresh-air cooling for the building during the hot summers!!! 

Ah, the Roman hypocaust that followed them even to the extremes of northern Britain and Germany. Probably the most comfortable form of heating ever designed. Living there must have been quite stimulating. Certainly would have been for me. 

Dave

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13 minutes ago, JL Sargent said:

An accident during major renovations has been mentioned. Given that, I suspect it was caused by welding which starts a lot of accidental fires.

I expect the cause of the fire to be something very different than "an accident" since the same kind of thing has been happening all around France, lately...but only time will tell!

 

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24 minutes ago, Mallette said:

Ah, the Roman hypocaust that followed them even to the extremes of northern Britain and Germany. Probably the most comfortable form of heating ever designed. Living there must have been quite stimulating. Certainly would have been for me. 

Dave

Yes...I found out so much more about architectural history and the technology used in its construction wherever I went throughout Europe!  Some people nowadays come up with "new ideas" all the time that were implemented millenia before they were ever born!...it really IS a laughable thing to me!😉

 

Vicenza, Italy, where I was stationed, was an architectural TREAT...after all, it was the hometown of Andreas Palladio, and some of his greatest work was done there, and just outside the town!  Thomas Jefferson was a fan of his work, too!  Hint, Hint!

villa Del Rotonda.jpg

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59 minutes ago, JL Sargent said:

An accident during major renovations has been mentioned. Given that, I suspect it was caused by welding which starts a lot of accidental fires.

Imagine being the tradesman out there that knows his slip up with a TIG welder torched a national treasure... :unsure:

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On ‎4‎/‎15‎/‎2019 at 3:11 PM, teaman said:

Let's just hope this was an accidental fire, tragic as that seems. I heard something being said about it being investigated for terrorism and after reading this, it makes me wonder even more... https://www.breitbart.com/faith/2019/03/20/twelve-french-churches-attacked-vandalized-in-one-week/?fbclid=IwAR2tTxKziLEbkpB6jpEUWTI7C0lm6W0vMQO2NA9vmPLEn9ID88ialPqtvkM

 

...and yes, I realize it is Breitbart. Just posting it for reference 

When you google this story it appears to be the same kind of outlets reporting it as something more sinister...Fwiw, Breitbart has been severely discredited and was one of the conduits of "Fake News" during the election and their mission is to stoke racial tension.  

2 hours ago, HDBRbuilder said:

I expect the cause of the fire to be something very different than "an accident" since the same kind of thing has been happening all around France, lately...but only time will tell!

 

I wouldn't buy into that conspiracy theory given where it originate  and my guess it will turn out to have been the fault of the construction/renovating people like is being reported.

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Almost 50 years of welding under my belt. Construction fires are ALWAYS the welders fault.

"Mama's don't let your babies grow up to be welders".

Very sad for Paris and the world.

 

#1 Cutting torch

#2 Stick and Mig welding

#3 grinders

Way down -TIG  (very little sparks produced plus very little TIG used in structural unless they were using aluminum)

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2 hours ago, JL Sargent said:

An accident during major renovations has been mentioned. Given that, I suspect it was caused by welding which starts a lot of accidental fires.

This definitely makes the most sense and speculating it was arson seems WAY off base given where the fire started. 

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1 hour ago, Zen Traveler said:

When you google this story it appears to be the same kind of outlets reporting it as something more sinister...Fwiw, Breitbart has been severely discredited and was one of the conduits of "Fake News" during the election and their mission is to stoke racial tension.  

I wouldn't buy into that conspiracy theory given where it originate  and my guess it will turn out to have been the fault of the construction/renovating people like is being reported.

Right, because the other churches were all lit by welder's working on rooftops....lol. I'll wait for the official word from that reputable CNN or MSNBC to weigh in before making any assumptions...hahaha.

Here is a post from NewsWeek since the Breitbart isn't good enough for you. https://www.newsweek.com/spate-attacks-catholic-churches-france-sees-altars-desecrated-christ-statue-1370800

 

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1 hour ago, Zen Traveler said:

  When you google this story it appears to be the same kind of outlets reporting it as something more sinister...Fwiw, Breitbart has been severely discredited and was one of the conduits of "Fake News" during the election and their mission is to stoke racial tension.  

I wouldn't buy into that conspiracy theory given where it originate  and my guess it will turn out to have been the fault of the construction/renovating people like is being reported.

I don't use the media for my info...about what is going on in that part of the world...I much prefer to read what I get from the Belgian Para-Commando buddies of mine from WAY BACK who KNOW what they are talking about, and also KNOW how their mainstream media and the same media in FRANCE keep playing things down over there!  I have connections you can only DREAM about!  This is me in 1974 in Khakis as one of my  unit's "official" escorts when Members of the Belgian 3rd Para Battalion took a break from training with us in Italy for a side-trip to Venice and Florence...I already knew all of them from previously training with them in Belgium a few times!...just saying....we had a real blast whenever we got together anywhere!   Don't let this pic fool you, because every one of these guys CAN BE VERY DANGEROUS when necessary...with absolutely no remorse for what they do! Even today, Belgian Para-commandos are seldom "officially" invited to join into a "coalition of forces" fray  which have "rules of engagement" attached...because they "just DON'T follow rules very well"!!😉  Some of THESE guys currently have Belgian Para-Commando GRANDCHILDREN who have been patrolling the high-risk areas of  Brussels and elsewhere while IN uniform, and also gathering intel while "out of uniform" to take down terrorist cells within their own country...the same goes for FRENCH commandos in THEIR own country...and some of them are GRANDCHILDREN of French Commando buddies of mine from "back in the day", too!

visiting forces trip 1974.JPG

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54 minutes ago, teaman said:

Right, because the other churches were all lit by welder's working on rooftops....lol. I'll wait for the official word from that reputable CNN or MSNBC to weigh in before making any assumptions...hahaha.

Here is a post from NewsWeek since the Breitbart isn't good enough for you. https://www.newsweek.com/spate-attacks-catholic-churches-france-sees-altars-desecrated-christ-statue-1370800

 

 

CNN? Haha

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In 2015 Notre Dame was digitally 3D laser scanned in its entirety. More than a billion data points provide details of the whole structure down to millimeters. The entire data base is available as a resource for the work of reconstruction. Should be an interesting effort and one that will as well be documented in detail.

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2 hours ago, teaman said:

Right, because the other churches were all lit by welder's working on rooftops....lol. I'll wait for the official word from that reputable CNN or MSNBC to weigh in before making any assumptions...hahaha.

Here is a post from NewsWeek since the Breitbart isn't good enough for you. https://www.newsweek.com/spate-attacks-catholic-churches-france-sees-altars-desecrated-christ-statue-1370800

  

I saw that article and notice it didn't mention Muslims and said there are a lot of different groups in France that have historically damaged Catholic Churches...Knowing how propaganda and false conspiracy threads are spread I knew this was coming and why those right-wing sights propagate drawing conclusions without looking at the evidence. That's my take....Like was said, we should find out in all of these incident what happened.

 

EDIT: I searched FoxNews and found no conspiracy theory but thought this was pretty informative. https://www.foxnews.com/world/notre-dames-destruction-bound-to-happen

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