Center channel for Forte III

[WorkingEdge 38]

On 5/18/2019 at 8:25 AM, Endo said:

^ "Heresy III fits in my IKEA console like it was custom made for it." Wow, that is remarkable–very, very nice. Not just the fit, but the height of the drivers. Klipsch dealers might sell more Heresy center channels if they also offered the IKEA cabinet... Man, that would sell! 

Well, I did need to use a little trim on the sides and took off a center drawer to fit. 🙂

[DTO 118]

Seeing that this topic has 6000 views in a week you’d think there is enough interest in a heritage center channel for one to be made.

[Islander 1580]

On 5/15/2019 at 10:25 PM, MetropolisLakeOutfitters said:

I've asked the powers that be at Klipsch to make a matching horizontal Heritage center channel, hopefully they will someday.  

 

Since those centre speakers with side-by-side drivers look appropriate, but can have lobing problems, it’s hard to picture Klipsch building a Heritage centre speaker with that obvious flaw.  As it is, the Heresy II or III makes a fine centre channel, and sounds equally good lying on its side.

 

Years ago, I used a Heresy II on its side as a centre speaker between La Scalas, and it did a fine job, plus it fit neatly into the large TV stand.  A bit later, I installed the Heresy III upgrade kit, and was very impressed with the improved sound, deeper bass, and higher sensitivity.  The $300 price tag was a great deal, too.

 

Later, as the system evolved, the La Scalas became 510 JubScalas, and the TV stand and H3 were replaced with a Belle Klipsch, which was a definite upgrade.  For me, the Belle is the ideal centre speaker/TV stand combo, and sounds right between La Scalas.  Since singles are hard to find, I had to get a pair of Belles to have one for the centre position.  It was no waste, though, because the second Belle made a good rear centre speaker, if a bit bulky.  It sits in the corner as a spare now, and the little H3 is now the rear centre speaker between the two original La Scala surround speakers.  They got shifted to the surround positions when a pair of LS2s joined the stable, and are now the main Left and Right speakers, in 402 JubScala II form.

 

To sum up, the best Heritage centre speaker is the Belle, followed by the La Scala, then the Cornwall (I know the Cornwall only by reputation, but it’s a good reputation), then the Heresy III, then the Heresy II.  That’s my opinion, anyway.

[DTO 118]

1 hour ago, Islander said:

 

Since those centre speakers with side-by-side drivers look appropriate, but can have lobing problems, it’s hard to picture Klipsch building a Heritage centre speaker with that obvious flaw.  As it is, the Heresy II or III makes a fine centre channel, and sounds equally good lying on its side.

 

Years ago, I used a Heresy II on its side as a centre speaker between La Scalas, and it did a fine job, plus it fit neatly into the large TV stand.  A bit later, I installed the Heresy III upgrade kit, and was very impressed with the improved sound, deeper bass, and higher sensitivity.  The $300 price tag was a great deal, too.

 

Later, as the system evolved, the La Scalas became 510 JubScalas, and the TV stand and H3 were replaced with a Belle Klipsch, which was a definite upgrade.  For me, the Belle is the ideal centre speaker/TV stand combo, and sounds right between La Scalas.  Since singles are hard to find, I had to get a pair of Belles to have one for the centre position.  It was no waste, though, because the second Belle made a good rear centre speaker, if a bit bulky.  It sits in the corner as a spare now, and the little H3 is now the rear centre speaker between the two original La Scala surround speakers.  They got shifted to the surround positions when a pair of LS2s joined the stable, and are now the main Left and Right speakers, in 402 JubScala II form.

 

To sum up, the best Heritage centre speaker is the Belle, followed by the La Scala, then the Cornwall (I know the Cornwall only by reputation, but it’s a good reputation), then the Heresy III, then the Heresy II.  That’s my opinion, anyway.

 

I love the post! So much great information. It brings up so many questions and or solutions. We are all in many boats, some dingys some sea-rays.

 

To address lobbing. I personally have never experienced it, or more likely, I am too ignorant to notice it. Yet klipsch makes 10s or 100s of thousands of center channels already that have this inherent flaw. With the prices the RC-64iiis go for you would think this problem is solved. Alas, maybe a sideways oriented heresy iii? I’m such a noob but I feel like the horn dispersion of a regular H3 on its side might be off if they are meant to stand up? They changed this before with the sideways version of Cornwall’s. 

 

I cannot comment on khorns, la scalla, nor belle, as I own none nor can fit them in my current abode.

[Islander 1580]

Lobing is caused by interference between side-by-side speakers.  The soundfield in front of them has high and low volume areas, where the sound from one driver either cancels or reinforces the sounds from the other one.  It may not be super-obvious, but it’s there, and should not be produced by a Heritage speaker.  Good enough is the enemy of perfection.

[DTO 118]

Thanks! My new question is about dispersion from the horn loaded drivers. Their axis, standing straight, is very obvious. Does it change being laid on the side?  

[Paducah Home Theater 2786]

3 hours ago, Islander said:

 

Since those centre speakers with side-by-side drivers look appropriate, but can have lobing problems, it’s hard to picture Klipsch building a Heritage centre speaker with that obvious flaw.  As it is, the Heresy II or III makes a fine centre channel, and sounds equally good lying on its side.

 

Let's just be realistic here... if we're going to point out the inherent flaws of a horizontal center channel, then taking a Heresy and laying it on its side shouldn't get a free pass, come on.    Off-axis measurements would be jacked plus you'll be spraying sound all over the floor and ceiling.  

[Maximus89 308]

Take a KLF-C7, get a replacement FIII mid horn + k70g driver and drop it into the KLF-C7. The k70g is used as a 2 way in some PRO surrounds-which brings me to the next best option outside of 1. A Forte III center(which still isn't ideal given the passive radiator creates more placement issues-i personally own a single Forte III as a center speaker), is to use a KPT-1260H Klipsch pro surround speaker which uses the same Forte III 12" woofer and the mid horn/driver combo as a 2 way. 102db sensitivity. Built-in 8° downward angle with 15° angle option for different placement options. 

 

[Islander 1580]

2 hours ago, MetropolisLakeOutfitters said:

 

Let's just be realistic here... if we're going to point out the inherent flaws of a horizontal center channel, then taking a Heresy and laying it on its side shouldn't get a free pass, come on.    Off-axis measurements would be jacked plus you'll be spraying sound all over the floor and ceiling.  

 

You have a point, but keep in mind that a Heresy has 3 different drivers, each covering a different section of the frequency range, so lobing is not much of an issue, except near the crossover points.  Those horizontal centre speakers, on the other hand, typically have 2 or even 4 drivers that cover the same range.  That’s what makes them ripe for lobing.

 

As for the sound spraying over the floor and ceiling, it may well be, but perhaps my tin ears made it hard for me to notice.  I usually sit on axis anyway.  Considering that it’s covering mostly vocals, it didn’t seem to be much of an issue.  Naturally, the right-side-up Belle sounds much better.

[DTO 118]

Next center I’m plugging in, KL-650-THX. We will see how it blends with forte iiis. I have no clue if it will play well. Anyone with experience?

[paulgyro 18]

On 6/5/2019 at 11:09 AM, DTO said:

Next center I’m plugging in, KL-650-THX. We will see how it blends with forte iiis. I have no clue if it will play well. Anyone with experience?

How did this experiment go? I was thinking of doing the exact same thing with my Forte IIIs for a center.

[picky 172]

Perhaps, I'm way off base, but why not try a Heresey IV? It has a larger squawker, similar to the Forte and a lower profile.

[Frzninvt 527]

Just use a third F III and stop playing around it is the only way to assure absolute cohesiveness across the front three.  Just make it happen and stop making excuses.  You will thank yourself later.  I run three La Scala's at LCR and I made it work because I wanted a seamless front stage.

[paulgyro 18]

On 5/23/2019 at 9:58 PM, Paducah Home Theater said:

 

Let's just be realistic here... if we're going to point out the inherent flaws of a horizontal center channel, then taking a Heresy and laying it on its side shouldn't get a free pass, come on.    Off-axis measurements would be jacked plus you'll be spraying sound all over the floor and ceiling.  

You are right, laying a Heresy on its side would be a disaster for horizontal frequency response.   

[paulgyro 18]

On 5/15/2019 at 8:37 AM, DTO said:

I currently have an Academy with Crites tweeters and replacement crossover, thanks @314carpenter! A great, not little, speaker that blended with my heresy ii and quartets. I recently plugged in a pair of Forte iiis in place of the quartets and, alas, the academy still sounds good, but this addiction runs deep and I wonder what would be even better. In a perfect world I would love to use another forte for a matching L/C/R or, even better, there was an updated three way horn loaded klipsch center channel. My basement has low ceilings so the forte is out and a new klipsch center is a unicorn. That brings me to the original klipsch center channels, the heresy and Cornwall. Does anyone have experience using a single Heresy III as a center for the Forte III ? The other option would be a Cornwall on it’s side. Would it being on its side throw of the dispersion patterns of the horns and would it play well with the fortes? The front ports make it easier to integrate into the room. Thanks for reading and sharing your knowledge!  

Did you consider using your Quartet as a center for your Forte III? 

[Max2 1297]

[DTO 118]

1 hour ago, paulgyro said:

Did you consider using your Quartet as a center for your Forte III? 

Hello

i ended up using an HIii but have since changed things up.

[jjptkd 1661]

4 hours ago, paulgyro said:

You are right, laying a Heresy on its side would be a disaster for horizontal frequency response.   

 

Those are fighting words with the diehard vertical Cornwall II crowd!!

[paulgyro 18]

1 hour ago, jjptkd said:

 

Those are fighting words with the diehard vertical Cornwall II crowd!!

Lol, well all I can do is shake my head and tell them to go look at the Heresy's vertical frequency response measurements.  

[Terry Palmer 34]

I have two Forte I’s. With a Hersey l as a center. And two Hersey’s for surround. Sounds amazing.


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