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Jvitti1970

KI-396 VS VINTAGE LASCALA

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46 minutes ago, Jvitti1970 said:

@CECAA850  my 1976 LSI's are still all original. how should I go about rebuilding? new networks, new drivers, etc?

I was thinking of doing ALK Networks, Crites CT-120'S and AG-55's

 

1976 should be Type AA.  They might need a refreshing/rebuild.  I will recommend my crossover tweak with film and foil caps. 

You do not need a new squawker, but the solder-terminal K-55-Vs will measure a little better and will be cheaper than the A55G.

Wrap your squawker horns with 2 layers of Dynamat, or equal.  Need proof?  Play a powerful female singer at live levels and grab the K-400 in front of the K-55-V.  Consider lining the cabinet opening for the K-400 with felt to absorb mouth reflections.

You don't need a new tweeter, but you do need to get it out of that tunnel it looks through.  You can buy Z-brackets and cut bigger holes to mount the tweeter flush with the front of the cabinet.  Or you could buy new tweeters like K-77-F that have a flange to mount the mouth flush.  i will recommend Dave Harris' Fastrac Tweeter horns and B&C DE-120 drivers.  That will allow you to delete the KLiP circuit that makes the tweeter harsh at high levels.  

Type AAJohn LaScalas R1.jpg

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396's are a real performance bargain... if you can deal with direct radiating low frequencies and if you can find a used pair that isn't being sold for what you can buy them as new.

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@Schu  I know a guy that has a pair at a discounted cost. just weighing whether its worth it for me to invest my cash into the 396's or rebuilding my LaSCALAS

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8 minutes ago, Schu said:

396's are a real performance bargain... if you can deal with direct radiating low frequencies and if you can find a used pair that isn't being sold for what you can buy them as new.

 

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1 hour ago, Jvitti1970 said:

@jimjimbo  What would your route to a rebuild be?

 

Definitely the drivers we discussed above. Crossovers will come down to a bit more personal preference.

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Let me throw some spaghetti onto your walls....

 

I have a pair of 1979 LaScalas.  Bought them new and they are probably the single item that I've owned the longest in my life.  So for sentimental reasons, I'll not touch them.

 

That said, if they weren't that sentimental to me, I'd ditch the passive and slap either the K402 or K510 on top.  Note that it's the K510 that is on top of the 396 so now you're bringing all those accolades from the top end of the 396 to the LaScala.

 

If you have the space, budget and desire to really scoot your LaScalas up the food chain, get the K402 and go active.  It's essentially a plug & play situation and Klipsch has engineered all the solutions for an active.

 

The "JubeScala" (LaScala bottom with K402 on top) will in my book, easily surpass the stock LaScala because of the large (freaking huge) K402 on top AND it's two inch throat. 

 

For me, side by side, it's not a contest.  Side benefit, you already own the LaScala.  If you decide you don't like the 402, you can always sell it.  Buy a used EV Dx38 (if you want to give it a try with fewest dollars) and if you decide you like it, you can upgrade the active for something that might be more capable.  Note that the design was originally voiced WITH the EV-Dx-38.

 

New they (the EV units) were about $1,250.  They're discontinued and can be found for a fraction of that price.

 

Disclosure:  I'm a person that's "ok" with actives.  There are some here that don't care for them

 

1.jpg.172ea5014fd782e35d1a2f7367469e15.jpg

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realize that the K402 horn (if stood on end) is both taller AND wider than the entire LaScala box.

 

Kind of interesting to say your "tweeter" is larger than your entire speaker.

 

 

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2 hours ago, JohnA said:

1976 should be Type AA.  They might need a refreshing/rebuild. 

I just measured 10 2uf oil cans from crossovers I am rebuilding and the smallest ESR on any of them was .78 and up to almost 1. Capacitance was within 10% on all but one. Of the dozens I have measured not one was worthwhile and every crossover improved with rebuilds no matter which poly caps I used.

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17 hours ago, Jvitti1970 said:

@JohnA  Thanks for the info... you do the network upgrades  or tweak as you put it? is the Fastrac horn and DE-120 available at parts express? 

 

The mods are very easy DIY, if not cheap anymore.  Just remove and replace the caps.  Add the band-pass inductor as I did in the pic.  Dean the Curmudgeon will build/rebuild crossovers for you. 

 

You can get DE-120s from Parts Express as well as the inductor I added, and sometimes the correct film and foil caps.  Metalized film caps are cheaper, but I prefer the more traditional film and foil.  While you probably don't need to spend $100 a piece on caps, don't scrimp. 

 

Dave Harris isn't actively marketing his horns, now, but I believe he will make you some if you ask.  Email Dave at: fastlaneaudio@aol.com.  I recommend these because I have them and am really pleased with their sound.  Really silky and smooth, not as edgy and sharp at a K-77.  They are, I believe, faithful to the tractrix curve, too.  I have heard another of the options available to replace the K-77, but not all.  My recommendation of Dave's horn and the DE-120 does not mean the others are not as good. 

20190613_102425_1.jpg

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The first thing to do is to replace those ancient capacitors.  That’s more a maintenance thing than an upgrade, and it will bring your speakers closer to their as-new sound.  When I replaced the original caps in my 32-year-old 1974 La Scalas, the sound was immediately more clear.

 

The next step could be the tweeters.  Those old K-77s weren’t all that great when they were new, and they’re probably well out of spec by now, possibly even mismatched for output, the way mine were.  One put out 2-3 dB more than the other, which can’t be good for stereo imaging.  They also roll off by 15kHz, so the extreme top end is just not there.  I haven’t heard the CT-120s, but they’re reputed to sound better than the CT-125s that I did install.  And the CT-125s were a definite upgrade.

 

Applying Dynamat to the K400 horns is not a bad idea.

 

And that’s what I’ve learned and done.

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For some of the new people on this forum like the op. Some of these long time guys/gals on here (pretty easy to spot) aren't here selling snake oil, or telling camp fire stories. They may not all totally agree on the order of what to do first, or how far to go with some things. But no one here is going to push $1,000 speaker cables to anyone as advise. It took some time myself to see first hand how much some of these guys/gals know (I'm a very skeptical person by nature). And raised an eyebrow at just about everything.  

 

But a lot of what your reading from these hands on experienced posters. Isn't just advise. Its factual direction to improvement/change. If they say this or that will be noticeable it will (no one of course can guarantee the change will be liked by everyone). But if they say it will measure better, and have an audible difference that you will notice. Believe them. 

 

 

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