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Recently Acquired La Scalas and Upgrade Progress


Desert Noises

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This is my first post and I’m new to the forum. After owning a pair of Heresy 1s for close to 10 years, I decided to take the next leap and bought a pair of La Scalas in raw birch. One manufactured in 1987 and the other in 1988. They came with the infamous AL crossovers, which I switched out immediately with new Bob Crites AA without even listening to the AL. After vacuuming out the cobwebs I hooked these beasts up and played some music. Initial impression was that drums and other percussion instruments sounded more realistic with incredible 3D imaging. However, the mid bass sounded a bit boxy and stuffy at times compared to my Heresys. 

 

Not willing to let well enough alone, I ordered a pair of Allen A-55G drivers and gaskets from Crites to replace the factory K-55M drivers. I noticed quite a difference after this change. That “glare” in the midrange vanished and the soundstage opened up and sounded wider. There is more distance between the instruments, if that makes sense. 
 

Out of curiosity, I swapped out the K-77M tweeters with Crites CT-125s I originally installed in my Heresys. I preferred the K-77 in my Heresys over the CT-125s, but in the La Scalas I didn’t notice much difference, if any at all. In my Heresys the CT-125s sounded less detailed and the high end sparkle I liked  in the K-77 disappeared. Not sure why it makes a less dramatic difference in the La Scalas, but I suspect it is because the midrange and bass on the La Scala are more efficient than those on the Heresy.

 

I read some members’ posts on here regarding excellent results from replacing the stock K-33E woofer with the Eminence Kappa 15C. Initially this sounded like a dubious upgrade because of the thinner gasket issue but Parts Express had a great open box deal on the Kappa 15Cs a couple weeks ago, so I pulled the trigger for a small risk. I installed the new woofers last week. I must say that, besides the A-55G, this is the biggest, most noticeable upgrade thus far. That annoying boxy/stuffy sound in the mid-upper bass is gone and the bass is much more punchy and realistic. These La Scalas sound so much better now. Wide soundstage, accurate depth and texture, and clear detail. It’s hard to describe, but these speakers are leagues better than they were when I first got them. 
 

The only thing I’m itching to try now is Crites CT-120s vs the CT-125s I’m using now. Another curiosity is lowering the crossover point to 4500 Hz. Anyone done that with A—55Gs and noticed any difference in the upper end? 
 

This is a great forum and I really appreciate the knowledge you have shared here

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3 hours ago, Desert Noises said:

 

Out of curiosity, I swapped out the K-77M tweeters with Crites CT-125s I originally installed in my Heresys. I preferred the K-77 in my Heresys over the CT-125s, but in the La Scalas I didn’t notice much difference, if any at all. In my Heresys the CT-125s sounded less detailed and the high end sparkle I liked  in the K-77 disappeared.

 

Welcome to the forum!

 

My K77Fs, K77Ms, T35s(EV equivalents, but without the Klipsch testing), too, have high end sparkle.  I like it.  At least one other forum member went through the same reversal; his thread is labled "Back to the K77s." 

 

If some think it sounds like frying bacon, that's O.K. with me.  The brass, in particular, is bright and burnished, and sounds like the brass I have heard in live orchestras.  

 

Maybe the CT-125s just need to be turned up a bit. 

 

Yes, great fireplace!  The house I grew up in had one like that, but a little bigger, with JBL 030s in C34 rear folded horn enclosures, and the acoustics were great!   I think the fireplace acted as a diffussor.   Phantom center material, including soloists, came right out of the firebox opening.

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As it stands it is much too bright, and the Realtor's wide angle lens makes it seem bigger than its 16 x 24 feet, but when my parents and I occupied it we had a large Persian rug, piano, and better placed, more absorbent couches, plus a dog and cat.  I've tried for years to duplicate the acoustics, but failed, by a little, so far.  My parents designed the house, and my father, a master carpenter, built it single handed, except for a little extended family help lifting and placing.

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1 hour ago, jimjimbo said:

You have made all the right choices, especially the Kappa 15C.  Enjoy!

Since I was one of the original proponents of the 15C, with it's superior MIDRANGE sound (screw the shorthorn bass) as creating a better balance in my own LaScalas about 10 years ago, the only thing left for you to do now is upgrade to DaveA's fabulous MAHL tweeter horns with B&C DE-120's, 111's or 110's and get a THT LP subwoofer to match.

 

Also, if you want to breathe new life into those Heresy 1's, you can turn them into Super Heresy's (Version 2.0 being the best).

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2 hours ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

Since I was one of the original proponents of the 15C, with it's superior MIDRANGE sound (screw the shorthorn bass) as creating a better balance in my own LaScalas about 10 years ago, the only thing left for you to do now is upgrade to DaveA's fabulous MAHL tweeter horns with B&C DE-120's, 111's or 110's and get a THT LP subwoofer to match.

 

Also, if you want to breathe new life into those Heresy 1's, you can turn them into Super Heresy's (Version 2.0 being the best).

Your posts about the 15C were majorly influential in my decision to try them. I will never switch back to the K—33E. The improvement is that good. In fact, during my testing, I thought I’d try the 15Cs without my subwoofer. I went to turn the sub off, but it was still unplugged from moving the La Scalas around! I know the midrange is definitely much improved, but I hear improvement in the bass across the board. If I lost 5 Hz. down low, then oh well. I didn’t notice. I strongly feel the 15C is the woofer that belongs in the La Scala. I’m currently using an SVS SB-2000 subwoofer, crossed over at ~65 Hz., volume at 1:00, and it transitions so well that I never notice its presence. 
 

I’m going to look into those MAHL tweeters a little more. To be honest, I’m lukewarm on the way the elliptical horn “looks.” I bet it sounds great, though. I’m also curious about doing the Super Heresy, especially when I get a second setup going. I did an A/B comparison between my Heresys and La Scalas and, boy, what a difference. The Heresys sound like boom box speakers by comparison!

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8 hours ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

Yes it is, visually, but sonically, it could be another matter altogether.

 

7 hours ago, glens said:

 

Haha!  He'd just got done saying he's mostly failed to replicate the superior sonics of that room...

 

... and I pointed out that back when it had superior sonics, there was a "large Persian rug, piano, and better placed, more absorbent couches, plus a dog and cat."  In the adjoining dining room (barely visible on the left) there was another thick rug, as there was also in the sun room (also on the left).  There was also an entry hall off to the right of the room.  The acoustics were very musical and complex.  😊

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4 hours ago, jimjimbo said:

You have made all the right choices, especially the Kappa 15C.  Enjoy!

Along with ClaudeJ1, your posts about successfully using the 15C in some La Scalas influenced my decision to try them. After hearing them I’d recommend them the same as you. Hands down one of the best upgrades for me. The bass lines in The White Stripes’ Seven Nation Army sound downright impressive. Same with timpani, kettle drums, and bass in orchestral pieces. Love it!

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29 minutes ago, Desert Noises said:

I’m going to look into those MAHL tweeters a little more. To be honest, I’m lukewarm on the way the elliptical horn “looks.” I bet it sounds great, though. I’m also curious about doing the Super Heresy, especially when I get a second setup going. I did an A/B comparison between my Heresys and La Scalas and, boy, what a difference. The Heresys sound like boom box speakers by comparison!

It's a quasi Tractrix curve inside the elliptical shape, which yields a ratio that favors horizontal dispersion over vertical, which is part of the criteria for most horn tweeters.

 

I guarantee you would never say that about a Super Heresy v2.0! Especially now that DaveA has figured out how to get a DE-10 driver in that little box. The bass is puts out approaches a LaScala, with higher, but tolerable IM distortion, BUT greater phase coherence. No joke.

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7 hours ago, Desert Noises said:

The only thing I’m itching to try now is Crites CT-120s vs the CT-125s I’m using now. Another curiosity is lowering the crossover point to 4500 Hz. Anyone done that with A—55Gs and noticed any difference in the upper end? 
 

This is a great forum and I really appreciate the knowledge you have shared here

You can't go wrong with the Crites CT-120's, they are so very much better than the CT-125's, which I had in my LaScalas "back when." I had to radically change the network to make the 125's work, whereas the CT-120's are a straight drop in/plug and play improvement, big time.

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22 minutes ago, Dave1290 said:

@ClaudeJ1 gives the best full body massage you'll ever get!  It's just that drive to his place that's killer.  It's pretty amazeballs though cause he doesn't even touch you.  THEN ya don't wanna leave!  Trust me on that one!  lolololol

I can give you the plans for all the subs you heard if you like. It's only time, money, and cubic FEET for the cabinets. LOL. Also, the A500 amp you heard has just been upgraded to an A800, which is even better on those subs. I should have the third/rear Super Tapped Horn done by end of October, just in time to scare the Halloween kids! LOL.

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1 hour ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

It's a quasi Tractrix curve inside the elliptical shape, which yields a ratio that favors horizontal dispersion over vertical, which is part of the criteria for most horn tweeters.

 

I guarantee you would never say that about a Super Heresy v2.0! Especially now that DaveA has figured out how to get a DE-10 driver in that little box. The bass is puts out approaches a LaScala, with higher, but tolerable IM distortion, BUT greater phase coherence. No joke.

No actually it beats the La Scala for lower hz bass. It does not  beat the La Scala for thump though.

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If you’re still in the mood for upgrades.

A doghouse brace with further the articulation, all around wonderful upgrade.   You can get the braces which need to be hand gotten from Greg at Volti or Dave Harris.  
the other upgrade would be a fastrac kassala horn from ALK/Dave Harris.  Will fit existing opening if I recall? Increase size of sound stage.  Less congested mid range.  
 

lovely room  and speakers. 

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If you are handy you can make that mid brace yourself and I have provided dimensions for this here. A very worthwhile upgrade and along with crossover capacitor recapping one of two things I would do with new to me La Scalas with out fail. Cheapest bang for the buck and both will give real improvement.

 

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On 9/29/2019 at 6:49 PM, ClaudeJ1 said:

 

I guarantee you would never say that about a Super Heresy v2.0! Especially now that DaveA has figured out how to get a DE-10 driver in that little box. The bass is puts out approaches a LaScala, with higher, but tolerable IM distortion, BUT greater phase coherence. No joke.

 

Does the Super Heresy, in any version, sound better than the Heresy III?

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7 hours ago, Islander said:

 

Does the Super Heresy, in any version, sound better than the Heresy III?

I can't say for sure unless I have done direct comparisons by measurement and listening. 

 

However, with reason and logic, let's look at the FACT that the later Cornwalls used the same Midrange horn as the Heresy (K700). This means that the greatest differentiation between the two speakers was box size, woofer size, and vents. By using a "top of the line" Eminence (read more expensive) woofer in the Heresy, putting a port in the REAR, like the $20,000 pair of Palladiums I heard at Klipsch Headquarters in Indy, and upgrading to a Modern Tweeter, I was able to really create an "umgawakikbootie" sound from that little Heritage box.

 

I would say that the latest Heresy IV's existence has proven me correct in this regard, since I did the Super Heresy mods almost 6 years ago and they have brought much listening pleasure to so many since then.

 

 

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