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“Heavy Old People” hear low frequencies better??


HDBRbuilder

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So, you are an old fart and you decide to “lose some weight.”  My BEST ADVICE is to NOT to JUST “lose some weight”, but to replace your reduction of fat mass with an increase in muscle mass…at least as much as possible!  Here is why:

 

Your body mass is more responsible for picking up frequencies BELOW 125 hz than your outer ears are.  And the LOWER the frequency IS below 125 hz, the MORE your body mass comes into play and the less the outer ear plays a role in your “hearing”!  Denser body mass makes for better pick-up of the low frequencies!

 

Have you ever taken a pair of headphones and plugged them into a mic jack and used them like a microphone??  Well, that is BASICALLY how your ears work!  Just think about it, your ears resemble horn lenses, or cones on a driver…and they “gather up” the sound around you, then transfer it to your tympanic membrane which is like the diaphragm on the driver.  Then our middle ears transfer the vibrations from that “diaphragm” through a system of boney structures called the hammer, anvil, and stirrup to the cochlea, which is a fluid-filled snail-drum apparatus filled with little hair-like structures, that transfers the information to out hearing nerves which send it in “electrical IMPULSES” as information for our brains to sort out.  So, basically our ears act just like using a pair of headphones as a microphone!

 

Now, looking at your own ears, imagine how effective they would be when used as a horn lens on a driver.  Now think about THIS…at what frequency range would they BEST work at for a horn lens??  You gotta admit that it would be the mid-range frequencies MUCH MORESO than the bottom end frequencies, RIGHT??  PWK used to say “we live in the mid-range”.…this is exactly why he said that!

 

SO, just HOW do we “perceive” our hearing of the low frequencies, if our “horn lenses” are not large enough to pick them up EFFICIENTLY?  The answer is very simple:  Through our BODY MASS!  IOW, the lower the frequency is below 125 hz, then the less our OUTER EARS are “hearing” it, and the MORE our body mass is picking it up!  Our body mass transfers low frequency sounds through it to a point where those three boney structures in our ears can transfer that vibration to our cochlea…BUT there comes a point where the nerves in our bodies ALSO join into sending this info to our brains for the lowest frequencies!  This is WHY totally-deaf people can dance!!  Their body mass picks up the lowest frequencies and they FEEL it more than they can “hear” it, OBVIOUSLY!  But their brains register the “BEAT” of the music, therefore they CAN DANCE!

 

So, all of this being said, what the HELLo does it have to do with “old farts losing weight?”  Please check out the link below:

 

RE:  https://s3-us-west-1.amazonaws.com/paperchase-aging/pdf/MEHEfwyvK9FZgwJra.pdf

 

Now, here is what I was getting at!  Since body mass plays such a large part in older people who have already had hearing loss at BOTH ends of the frequency spectrum, then actually just “losing weight” will NOT help them with their low-frequency “hearing”!  BUT, we all know that reducing our fat mass is better for our HEALTH, right?  We also all know that muscle mass is denser than fat mass, right?  AND, we all SHOULD KNOW that replacing body fat mass with muscle mass is the MOST EFFECTIVE way to do things to better our health, RIGHT?

 

So, Here is the deal: if you are dieting, to reduce intake and fat mass, you NEED TO EXERCISE to replace the fat-related body mass with muscle-related body mass.  Doing this will NOT show up on the scales when you weigh yourself for some time, but eventually it will!  And because muscle mass is DENSER than fat mass is, you will “lean-up” more, even though your "weight" will NOT NECESSARILY become that much less!  PLUS, you will end up with a body mass that is DENSER, but SMALLER!  And since DENSER body mass transfers sound energy better….your lower frequency hearing will actually IMPROVE somewhat!  

 

Think about it!  Get smaller, and STILL "hear" the bass better!

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1 hour ago, Bosco-d-gama said:

Our body mass does sense low frequencies as in vibrational pulsations or ‘movement’.  To what extent would this palpable sensation translate into audible bass frequencies in the ears? Are there references you could cite for us here? 

Did you check out the link in my post??  Everything else is readily accessible online...I'm not doing a bibliography for a term paper here, ya'know? 😉

 

Here is a thought...Try this:  Take a good pair of ISOLATING headphones and plug them into your amp, with the speakers OFF.  Then sit and listen for a bit WITH YOUR EYES CLOSED, and upon YOUR HAND SIGNAL, have someone else hit the "speakers on switch"...do you NOW 'hear" more bass?  It is not coming THROUGH your ears, it is your BODY mass picking it up! 

 

Why do you think that when you go for a hearing test, they put you into a "sound-proof" cubicle, and give you head-phones to test your ears, ONLY?  BUT, they are ONLY testing your EARS with a frequency range from around 125 hz to 8 khz!  Why do you think they DON'T even test lower frequencies than 125 hz?  The answer is SIMPLE: It is because your hearing threshold with ONLY your ears involved begins to fall off around 250 hz, and EXTREMELY  rapidly just above 125 hz!  So, how do you "hear" a flat frequency spectrum BELOW 125 hz?  Body mass!  They have isolated your body mass from picking up anything by testing you in a sound-proof booth with headphones, ONLY...because they are just testing your EARS for hearing loss!  Again, "we live in the mid-range"!  Sicntista have determined thjat humans can generally "hear" from 4 hz to arouind 18 khz, but that is WITHOUT the body mass being isolated from the equation!

 

Scientists have ALSO determined that for almost ALL humans, the lower the frequency is below what ONLY our ears pick-up, the more it tends to cause depression in us the more the decibels go up, whereas the higher the frequency is, the more it excites us!..as the decibels go up!

 

They have ALSO determined that females tend to "lean towards" enjoyment of lower frequencies while males tend to lean more towards higher frequencies, and that is often MOSTLY attributed to the PELVIS bone differences in density, with the average female having much more than the average male does!  Guys play air guitar (highs),  while gals want to dance (lows)...ya'know?

 

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The work indicates (very roughly) that increased BMI results in higher hearing thresholds. A ‘higher’ hearing threshold means a person hears frequencies at greater sound levels, the hearing gets worse, not better..... hearing is less sensitive as BMI increases.  Heavier folks require louder sound (a higher threshold) to hear at any frequency according to this paper. That said, the authors acknowledge that their own data is not statistically significant and not reproducible. So who knows what (if anything) BMI does to hearing. This paper is inconclusive as far as its own authors are concerned.

 

Still I would accept the notion that lower frequencies transmit easier through any solid object and can physically resonate a persons body. The drubbing of percussive mechanical massagers is a good example but the pounding of heavy bass is also quite palpable. But IMHO this is unrelated to body mass or composition. There can be no amplification of any frequency for any given body style. Simply stated we enjoy the vibes.🤗

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4 minutes ago, oldtimer said:

Does it also cause compulsive use of exclamation points?  I'm not sure it is worth the trade off.

Do you really mean that!!!   Seinfeld has an episode about the overuse of exclamation points!  It was funny!  I always say to use them in moderation or people won’t take them seriously!  

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13 minutes ago, oldtimer said:

Are you talking about the episode where Elaine is writing a book?  My favorite part was when the character decided to put on a sweater!

There is an episode where Elaine’s boyfriend takes a phone message from one of Elaine’s friends who just had a baby.He doesn’t use an exclamation point and an argument ensues. 

 

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1 hour ago, Bosco-d-gama said:

Our body mass does sense low frequencies as in vibrational pulsations or ‘movement’.  To what extent would this palpable sensation translate into audible bass frequencies in the ears? Are there references you could cite for us here? 

See for yourself...do the isolating headphones test I mentioned:

 

"...Try this:  Take a good pair of ISOLATING headphones and plug them into your amp, with the speakers OFF.  Then sit and listen for a bit WITH YOUR EYES CLOSED, and upon YOUR HAND SIGNAL, have someone else hit the "speakers on switch"...do you NOW 'hear" more bass?  It is not coming THROUGH your ears, it is your BODY MASS picking it up!"   

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28 minutes ago, HDBRbuilder said:

See for yourself...do the isolating headphones test I mentioned:

 

"...Try this:  Take a good pair of ISOLATING headphones and plug them into your amp, with the speakers OFF.  Then sit and listen for a bit WITH YOUR EYES CLOSED, and upon YOUR HAND SIGNAL, have someone else hit the "speakers on switch"...do you NOW 'hear" more bass?  It is not coming THROUGH your ears, it is your BODY MASS picking it up!"   

We do agree that sound will transmit through a body to be heard in the ears. I do not agree that if you gained or lost BMI that the intensity of what is heard in this manner would change.

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1 hour ago, Bosco-d-gama said:

We do agree that sound will transmit through a body to be heard in the MIDDLE EAR. I do not agree that if you gained or lost BMI that the intensity of what is heard in this manner would change.

You keep referring to "BMI"...why?  I was referring to DENSER body mass...through replacing fat density with muscle density...the DENSITY of body mass is the most important thing.  Muscle is DENSER than fat is.  Sound travels through denser things better...and faster.  For example, sound travels much faster through water than it does air...so fast that you cannot easily discern where it is COMING FROM with your "stereo" ears, because they are attuned to location of a sound source in an environment of air, not water.  Any diver can tell you this.  That is why whenever a diver is underwater and hears something from a source not within his peripheral range vision, he has to look around to find the source.  If he was on land, he could easily discern the general direction to the sound source, and only need to look in that direction.  Denser is better for sound transmission. The only way the term: "Body mass index" is valid is if it uses the air or water displacement technique.  But that ALSO decreases its validity for transmission of sound, because it still CANNOT determine the bone density ratio to the muscle density ratio, to the fat density ratio, can it?  BMI is MOSTLY used for determining if somebody NEEDS to get rid of fat...and for medical applications requiring different medicines in different amounts based upon BM! results....such as weighing your dog to determine, along with the dog's age, the amount of worming meds to use....`and has little to nothing to do with transmission of sound through the body.  Because a "determined" BMI for an individual is SO VARIABLE, it really doesn't apply at all for sound transmission!  So, please leave "BMI" out of this!  Trust me, I did over 36 years in the army and totally understand that BMI is a PERCEIVED ratio, not a gain or loss thing...and that AGE figures into that index....and that it had to be done multiple times in a row to work off of an AVERAGE to begin withl  Apparently you DO NOT!  So, just go and argue someplace else, because I am done!

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8 minutes ago, HDBRbuilder said:

You keep referring to "BMI"...why?  I was referring to DENSER body mass...through replacing fat density with muscle density...the DENSITY of body mass is the most important thing.  Muscle is DENSER than fat is.  Sound travels through denser things better...and faster.  For example, sound travels much faster through water than it does air...so fast that you cannot easily discern where it is COMING FROM with your "stereo" ears, because they are attuned to location of a sound source in an environment of air, not water.  Any diver can tell you this.  That is why whenever a diver is underwater and hears something from a source not within his peripheral range vision, he has to look around to find the source.  If he was on land, he could easily discern the general direction to the sound source, and only need to look in that direction.  Denser is better for sound transmission. The only way the term: "Body mass index" is valid is if it uses the air or water displacement technique.  But that ALSO decreases its validity for transmission of sound, because it still CANNOT determine the bone density ratio to the muscle density ratio, to the fat density ratio, can it?  BMI is MOSTLY used for determining if somebody NEEDS to get rid of fat...and for medical applications requiring different medicines in different amounts based upon BM! results....such as weighing your dog to determine, along with the dog's age, the amount of worming meds to use....`and has little to nothing to do with transmission of sound through the body.  Because a "determined" BMI for an individual is SO VARIABLE, it really doesn't apply at all for sound transmission!  So, please leave "BMI" out of this!  Or, just go and argue someplace else, because I am done!

The paper cited does not support your conclusions. On the surface your perspective sounds plausible. Denser is better. Perhaps a better designed study may prove you correct....... but this study doesn’t. BMI was the methodology used by the researchers in this research so your argument is not with me. As far as I'm concerned everyone should have less fat or be leaner, or whatever. But you cannot cite this paper as any foundation for your statement. It is just not there. Sorry if this upsets you. That wasn’t my intention.

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11 minutes ago, Bosco-d-gama said:

The paper cited does not support your conclusions. On the surface your perspective sounds plausible. Denser is better. Perhaps a better designed study may prove you correct....... but this study doesn’t. BMI was the methodology used by the researchers in this research so your argument is not with me. As far as I'm concerned everyone should have less fat or be leaner, or whatever. But you cannot cite this paper as any foundation for your statement. It is just not there. Sorry if this upsets you. That wasn’t my intention.

What part of this did you not understand:

 

Did you check out the link in my post??  Everything else is readily accessible online...I'm not doing a bibliography for a term paper here, ya'know? 😉

 

NOW, I'm done!

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Well I'm an old fart (63) and I lost over 40 lbs a while back,I don't have time for work outs but I'm still working for a living and switched from a desk job to a job with quite a bit of physical activity so I guess that counts.

I'm fairly big,6' tall and dropped from 270 lbs to 225.

Maybe that's why I so love my K-Horns,I like to feel the music and they provide.

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Not to dare go OT but, it has been said that elephants can feel/hear(?) low vibration s to the point of communication from miles away.

I would have to consider LF as being a vital force in the animal kingdom. Certainly mass may well come into play for us as well.

 

 

 

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Just now, billybob said:

Not to dare go OT but, it has been said that elephants can feel/hear(?) low vibration s to the point of communication from miles away.

I would have to consider LF as being a vital force in the animal kingdom. Certainly mass may well come into play for us as well.

 

 

 

Also whale sounds,they probably use frequencies we can not hear especially under water.

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