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To upgrade or not upgrade Heresy II's?


HDBRbuilder

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So here is the situation.  I am seriously considering up-grading  my Heresy II speakers to the internals of the Heresy III in the near future.!

 

Keep in mind  the following:

 

1.  The cost if the factory internal upgrade kit is around 500  bucks or so, which I CAN afford when I go to do this.

2.  I have ZERO invested in these speakers (so far, because I won them in a contest on THIS forum almost twenty years ago!) and they are HWL models in GENIUINE like-new condition, considering they have seldom been out of their boxes.

3.  They were made at the turn of the 1990's to 2000's decade, which SHOULD mean that there will be no need for any motor-board modifications for the new internals to be mounted...or so I have read!

4.  I really like the HIII performance much more-so than the performance of THESE PARTICULAR  HII's!  That's the MAIN reason, along with space available for them, why they have SELDOM been out of their boxes!  I use my old original HDBL's, instead!

 

So, I am interested in feedback from those who know about this upgrade!

 

Will they perform pretty-much identically to the HIII's once upgraded?  Is there anything I need to modify to the speakers to make the upgrade work, considering when they were made?

 

I basically just need to know how much extra hassle will be involved along with the performance comparison....before I go and drop a half of a grand on this project.

 

I prefer to get feedback from those who have done the upgrade to them before....and any good viable options/suggestions...to get these to at least perform MUCH CLOSER TO the HIII's

 

EDIT:  And NOW,  for the rest of the story (plan)!....IF I go with an upgrade in the (currently) Heresy II's, I have a plan for the ever-so-slightly-used HII guts:  I have a nephew from the Philippines side of my family who recently arrived in Canada where his mother has been working for about a decade.  He is currently a Junior in high school, and I have great affection for him and pride in him!  Before he graduates from high school, my workshop will have been completed and I will have already been able to do build a second pair of Heresy boxes out of Baltic birch for his use while away at college, and give them to him, along with an H/K 430 twin-powered receiver, for his high school graduation gift.   At the same time, I will still have a like-new walnut veneered pair of Heresys which have been upgraded to HIII's;  While laying out only a little over a half a grand for the entire deal.  This is a possible win/win thing as far as I am concerned.   It's either do it this way, or do the eBay/Crites/ etc. thing for parts to build his speakers!   One way or another, he will get HERESY speakers!  But if the upgrade thing gets my HII's to sound like HIII's, I prefer to go that route.

 

I'm sorry that I left this out in the original start of this thread!  

 

The main thing I need to know is how close to the Heresy III performance the upgrade will actually be, and how much hassle it is to do it!  I'd rather kill two birds with one stone, if that is possible.

 

But either route I use to accomplish getting him his speakers is OK by me...the out-of-pocket expense will be about the same. 

 

Thanks!

 

Your turn!

 

 

 

Edited by HDBRbuilder
added additional info
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You've said a couple of times that they are rarely out of their boxes.  If that's the case, why bother putting the money into them when in reality you will only realize a modest difference in performance?  Now, I really like the performance of my H IIIs, don't get me wrong.  But, considering your listening habits as you described, I wouldn't do it.

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I am surprised no enquiring minds on here have jumped the gun on an H4 mod, yet... It would be no great feat to cut a rectangle for the port in the back of the cabinet and BAM... Roy’s your uncle!

 

I was really leaning hard on the H3 conversion for my H2’s as well until this latest, greatest version came out. Now my horizon is cloudy on that.

 

It is always time well spent, but all that cheese could go to better cables... LOL!

 

 

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I think as has been shown many times within the Super Heresy thread,  it's not as simple as cutting a port in the rear panel to turn a Heresy into a Heresy 4.  Driver changes and cabinet volume changes are also a part of the equation.  I would really love to hear the H3 and H4 side by side.  Maybe this spring in Hope we can do that.

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The HIII sounds much better than the HII.

 

The upgrade kit was designed to take the II to the III.

 

If they still have them, the part number for the kit is 1006972

 

You get a new tweeter, new mid/squawker driver, new woofer, and of course the crossover. The kit used to run $300 per speaker.

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3 hours ago, jimjimbo said:

You've said a couple of times that they are rarely out of their boxes.  If that's the case, why bother putting the money into them when in reality you will only realize a modest difference in performance?  Now, I really like the performance of my H IIIs, don't get me wrong.  But, considering your listening habits as you described, I wouldn't do it.

I'm moving to somewhere that I will have room for them to be outta their boxes.

 

54 minutes ago, Marvel said:

What Dean said...^^^

 

If you can afford to do it then go ahead. Then I would build a nice BB cabinet for a Tangent 400 to install the old parts. BOOM!

 

Bruce

That's part of the plan I have...they will then go to my nephew who will soon be in college...but they will actually be custom Heresys.  He'll also get an H/K 430  to go with them!  After they get beat all to hell while he's is in college, and he gets settled into a job somewhere, THEN I will build much nicer custom boxes for him.  😉...OR it they are just mildly beat up, I will veneer over the damage for him.

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2 hours ago, jimjimbo said:

I think as has been shown many times within the Super Heresy thread,  it's not as simple as cutting a port in the rear panel to turn a Heresy into a Heresy 4.  Driver changes and cabinet volume changes are also a part of the equation.  I would really love to hear the H3 and H4 side by side.  Maybe this spring in Hope we can do that.

I'm hoping that will happen this coming weekend for me while at the museum event.

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4 hours ago, Trey Cannon said:

As PWK said...IF it isn't broke, don't fix it...

 

I plan to use the HII guts in another pair of new boxes for my nephew's use.  That way I basically end up with TWO pairs of Heresys (one pair upgraded to HIII's! for MY OWN USE!) for just the expense of one set of new guts and still have only relatively little out-of-pocket expense.  Those new boxes I build with the SLIGHTLY-used HII guts will be his High School graduation surprise in a year and a half!...along with an H/K 430 receiver in great condition!

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2 hours ago, jimjimbo said:

I think as has been shown many times within the Super Heresy thread,  it's not as simple as cutting a port in the rear panel to turn a Heresy into a Heresy 4.  Driver changes and cabinet volume changes are also a part of the equation.  I would really love to hear the H3 and H4 side by side.  Maybe this spring in Hope we can do that.

 

I am hoping we do that, the new corns, and the new lascalas this Friday.  I already heard the new Khorns with Lilly Winwood.

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Folks, I apologize!  In Retrospect, I really SHOULD HAVE given the ENTIRE PLAN for what I am thinking about doing up-front when I originally started this thread; but, I left out the intended use of the old ever-so-slightly-used HII guts!  I will now add that plan to the original post, just wanted you all to know that I screwed-up!  (And no, I wasn't under the influence when I started the thread, BELIEVE IT OR NOT!)

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HDBRbuilder, I installed the H3 kit in one of my 1989 Heresy IIs, and I'm really happy with the improvements.  I was using it as a front centre speaker, so I only upgraded the one speaker.  It's now serving as rear centre, for 6.1 listening.

 

Just for curiosity, do you mean it costs only $500USD to do both speakers?  It used to be around $300CAD for just one.  That was back in 2008.  You do know the Heresy IIs should be the square connector pocket models, right, like 1986 and later?  If they have the earlier round pocket, some woodworking will be required.

 

The result should sound exactly like a Heresy III, since everything in the cabinet is replaced, except for the plastic squawker horn.  You reuse that.  The new woofer is clearly better, the new crossover is much more complex, and everything fits right in.  I had to slightly open up the hole for the squawker, but that may have been unnecessary.  It was a small job, anyway.

 

I could hear the improvements immediately:  deeper bass, louder sound/higher efficiency, and clearer vocals.  I was totally happy with the improvements, and now they integrate with the La Scalas a bit better.

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https://www.newark.com/mcm-audio-select/55-2952/12-woofer-with-paper-conecloth/dp/80R7003

https://community.klipsch.com/index.php?/topic/186650-heresy-replacement-woofer/

I would leave the H2s alone

start looking on this forum and e-bay for used

H1 or H2 horns, drivers, crossovers etc

You should be able to score the internals for a pair of Heresys easily

and then build the cabinets yourself from birch

and add the veneer you like, or find a friend to help with the veneer.

Maybe someone could suggest a 12in direct replacement that he could buy new ?

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I was at the Klipsch museum event over this weekend.  and I was EXTREMELY IMPRESSED with the new Heresy IV listening experience...it actually brought me to tears!  The New "IV" Heresy is SO MUCH MORE THAN IT EVER HAS BEEN BEFORE!  The cabinet has been enlarged UPWARDS about an inch in order to fit the rear tractrix porting, and make that porting work properly!  AND THAT IS BASICALLY ALL, external cabinet size-wise!  Don't get me wrong, the Cornwall IV is also a major improvement, too!  BUT, I was personally much more impressed with the change in the Heresy!  It's a "whole new ball-game", now, for the "runt" of the original "Heritage" line!!  TRUST ME!  When I heard the Heresy IV, I leaned over to one of the dealers in the lab listening-room  and said:  "Once people hear them, you're gonna sell a crap-load of THESE!"

 

 

 

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On 10/20/2019 at 11:49 AM, HDBRbuilder said:

I was at the Klipsch museum event over this weekend.  and I was EXTREMELY IMPRESSED with the new Heresy IV listening experience...it actually brought me to tears!  The New "IV" Heresy is SO MUCH MORE THAN IT EVER HAS BEEN BEFORE!  The cabinet has been enlarged UPWARDS about an inch in order to fit the rear tractrix porting, and make that porting work properly!  AND THAT IS BASICALLY ALL, external cabinet size-wise!  Don't get me wrong, the Cornwall IV is also a major improvement, too!  BUT, I was personally much more impressed with the change in the Heresy!  It's a "whole new ball-game", now, for the "runt" of the original "Heritage" line!!  TRUST ME!  When I heard the Heresy IV, I leaned over to one of the dealers in the lab listening-room  and said:  "Once people hear them, you're gonna sell a crap-load of THESE!"

 

 

so which ones sound better? Cornwall v Heresy?

 

Edited by the5chord
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On 10/21/2019 at 1:21 PM, JohnA said:

Well Andy, by now you know you need to be asking if the H IV guts will bolt into the HIi box so you can build a new back that add both volume and a tractrix port!!!!!!!!  😀

I was there this past weekend, too, John...NOW, we gotta build a new box that is about an inch taller...RIGHT??  So in reality it would not be an "up-grade kit", with just a modification of the rear panel for the addition of the tractrix rear port, now, would it?  BUT, "somebody" happened to mention that there MAY be a possibility of an "upgrade kit" being made available….so, we shall see, right?😉  YEP, I may not have appeared to be listening, but I always am!😂

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2 hours ago, the5chord said:

 

 

so which ones sound better? Cornwall v Heresy?

 

Two very different speakers...but now sharing identical voicing...makes the entire family readily obviously MEMBERS of that family!  Both speakers were obviously improved, but to my ears the Heresy got the MOST improvement due to its current rear-porting-added. 

 

I've always liked both speakers, but I've also OWNED Heresys ever since 1978....continually.  They have always been a great value for what you get in a package that small and easily maneuverable!  The Cornwall suffered in sales at times, and actually went out of production for a few years due to that.  It seems back to stay, now, though....and that's a GOOD THING!

 

One of the main reasons the Cornwall began suffering in sales in the first place was its nearness in price to the raw birch plywood LaScala...prior to the jump in price when the LaScala II came out....due to its better cosmetic appeal than the old "raw plywood version"....and many enjoy fully-horn-loaded over partially-horn-loaded even if going that route gives some reduction in bottom-end performance when comparing the two.

 

Bottom line here is LET YOUR OWN EARS DECIDE!...what you like best between the two....Heresy IV with its advantages/detractions, or Cornwall IV with its advantages/detractions....or Cornwall vs. LaScala….they're all voiced the same now, though!  Chief Bonehead did great on THAT! 

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