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tubetwister

Lip Sync Problems...HELP!

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We just spent over $10,000 in upgrades to our theater, Epson 5050UB, Yamaha CX-A5200, Klipsch RF-7 III's, plus more.

But I can't watch any video! The characters lips start moving, and then the audio starts. Is there a way to advance the audio, or retard/delay the video?

I have auto delay lip sync, but that only makes it worse!

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Yes, the Yamaha and the Panasonic both have lip sync adjustments to delay the audio. That is not the problem, however. I need to delay the video, as it runs in advance of the audio on Blu-ray  discs.

Most broadcast cable TV is ok. But the Accu-weather channel has horrendous lip sync issues.

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Found what might be the problem, and it is the audio processing. Either the DMP-UB900, or the Yamaha. I ran the audio from the DMP-UB900 thru the L&R analog output into a two channel analog system. Ran the video, doing a side-by-side listen and watch test. There was a major (MAJOR) echo (delay) of the processed audio. Zero delay in the all analog, two channel stereo audio.


If we only use two channel stereo, the movies are perfect. Unwatchable with 7.2.2 processing.


Most broadcast cable TV is Ok, with a couple exceptions.

 

HDMI bitstream = major audio delay


Analog Audio out (2 Channel Stereo) = perfect, in sync, audio with video


This is my case. Not sure where the problem is in processing...the UB900, or the CX-A5200?

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Try eliminating all extra digital audio manipulation (room e.q. etc.) and you should find the timing results nearly equal to that of the analog trial you performed.  I was going to suggest earlier today (when I first saw the thread) that you try what you've since reported, but I was too lazy to type it up.

 

I don't do AV beyond sending the stereo output to my two-channel gear.  Every additional (digital) manipulation takes additional time to perform.  If none of your audio equipment can handle the necessary synchronization by feeding the video through it, and your TV can't do it either, then perhaps you can increase the amount of video signal manipulation the TV is doing.  That should add delay to the imagery.

 

Did your upgrade cash outlay include equipment selection / setup services or did you undertake the task without such assistance?  That kind of cash, unless spent piecemeal at various sources on your own, would / should include guarantee of compatibility and initial (proper) setup, IMO.

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4 hours ago, glens said:

Try eliminating all extra digital audio manipulation (room e.q. etc.) and you should find the timing results nearly equal to that of the analog trial you performed.  I was going to suggest earlier today (when I first saw the thread) that you try what you've since reported, but I was too lazy to type it up.

 

I don't do AV beyond sending the stereo output to my two-channel gear.  Every additional (digital) manipulation takes additional time to perform.  If none of your audio equipment can handle the necessary synchronization by feeding the video through it, and your TV can't do it either, then perhaps you can increase the amount of video signal manipulation the TV is doing.  That should add delay to the imagery.

 

Did your upgrade cash outlay include equipment selection / setup services or did you undertake the task without such assistance?  That kind of cash, unless spent piecemeal at various sources on your own, would / should include guarantee of compatibility and initial (proper) setup, IMO.

 

Yes, tried all of the above. Straight-Direct audio in, no processing at all. Zero help. Tried every setting for audio on both the player and the processor. No help. Switched out BD players, and that was a small improvement...until I tried another video, then the no-lip-sync was back.

 

All items were bought online, so no assistance for set up. But a pro would do no better, as there is no option for delaying the video. That is what I need. I could just settle for stereo playback. But then the thousands spent on equipment upgrades will have been for nothing. Don't even mention this to my wife.

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My lips are sealed.  You could take an interest in Chinese movies from the '70s which have overdubbed English!

 

In all seriousness I feel for your dilemma.  Does anybody have to market a standalone device which specifically deals with delaying one or the other content, I wonder?  If not, it seems like it could be a worthwhile undertaking, financially speaking...

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Basic connection question: is the Epson connected to the HDMI 1 ARC OUT of the A5200?

Also, being a rare issue (sound lagging video), not much out there on the ol' www. However, some have reported partial success adding an HDMI switcher.

I feel your pain as I have been dealing with the same audio lag issue with some of my video sources.

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2 hours ago, baron167 said:

Basic connection question: is the Epson connected to the HDMI 1 ARC OUT of the A5200?

Also, being a rare issue (sound lagging video), not much out there on the ol' www. However, some have reported partial success adding an HDMI switcher.

I feel your pain as I have been dealing with the same audio lag issue with some of my video sources.

 

HDMI switcher? To delay the video signal? At this stage, I'm willing to try anything.

 

I'm going to ty a couple different Blu-ray players today also...just to see what happens.

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16 minutes ago, tubetwister said:

 

HDMI switcher? To delay the video signal? At this stage, I'm willing to try anything.

 

I'm going to ty a couple different Blu-ray players today also...just to see what happens.

I think the switcher simply syncs the audio and video when added to the system...

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Im assuming you have cut out the room EQ or whatever Yamaha calls their room correction?   Im running a wireless video setup due to a cathedral ceiling and out of room equipment. My Video is around 1/2-3/4 of a  second slower.  Mine needs a little adjustment from time to time and it varies in DTV channels as well.  Having lip sync issues ruins everything.  

 

I would also make sure to have all video processing or up scaling turned off the Epson, the BD player and the Pre. If you saw a change swapping out the BD player, you might try finding one with multi channel analog outputs.  I would dumb everything completely down to help with narrowing the issue.

 

Just keep eliminating variables and you will nail it

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After swapping out 4 Blu-ray players...2 Panasonic, one Sony, and a Samsung, the Sammy won the prize. No idea why. It is also 4K. But synced perfectly audio/video.

 

it is my least favorite player, as the Panasonic DMP-UB900 is a much better unit. But the 900 is now in the family room downstairs and the Sammy has taken its place in the theater upstairs.

 

I will research this further, but as for now the problem with lip sync is solved...as long as I employ Sammy!

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All is well that ends well.  Now tell us more about those tubes....

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Seems like a few frames of full-resolution video delay with HDMI I/O would be a trivially simple thing to program into any graphics card, but I searched and found very little.

 

https://vuo.org/node/2276

https://www.zachpoff.com/software/live-video-delay/

 

Anybody on the forum have experience with CUDA or OpenCL? Might make an interesting project and I wouldn't mind participating myself.

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Just when I thought all is well...wrong!

 

The ugly audio delay is back in full force. I did view one Blu-ray video (Going In Style) and it was fine. But when a 4K video (Saving Private Ryan) was played, wow, bad echo, audio delay.

 

I might go to the Home Theater Expo here in Dallas this weekend, and meet with some reps from Yamaha and Panasonic. Maybe they will have an answer.

 

If we run everything thru analog audio out, 7.1, with no processing in the Yamaha CX-A5200, all is in sync.

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Well...what can I say? It would appear that the issue has largely abated.

 

Now using the Surround-Decode Auto setting on the Yamaha CX-A5200, with no additional processing. All video/audio is in perfect sync.

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Well...what can I say? It would appear that the issue has largely abated.

 

Now using the Surround-Decode Auto setting on the Yamaha CX-A5200, with no additional processing. All video/audio is in perfect sync.

Crazy. So how many times were connections changed and reseated through your troubleshooting? How many times did you turn off and on everything? SMH over this, but glad it worked out (at least for now).

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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On 11/29/2019 at 3:15 PM, baron167 said:

Crazy. So how many times were connections changed and reseated through your troubleshooting? How many times did you turn off and on everything? SMH over this, but glad it worked out (at least for now).

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

New 8K HDMI cables were bought, thinking this would help. Wrong. Switching out 5 different BD players was interesting. My $39 Sony Blu-ray app streaming player did the absolute best, with perfect sync. Surprisingly, the PQ of the cheap Sony was about as good as my $700 UB900.

 

And the Yamaha processed 7.2.2 surround from the Sony. Not possible to do a true side-by-side comparison of the players, however.

 

It is strange...sometimes the lip-sync feature (auto) on the Yamaha helps. On some movies. And on other movies, it makes the issue worse so it is disabled. There is not a "set it and forget it" way to watch video.

 

YouTube videos are way out of sync. But that is minor, as we primarily watch UHD 4K Blu-ray.

 

To watch a video, I have to first preview the movie, check for sync issues, go into settings and do adjustments, and then call up the wife and friends to join me. It is a lot of effort to go through.

 

Yes...a lot of sitting down, watching / listening for sync, getting up and making changes, sitting down again, watching / listening...over and over and over.....

 

With my Panasonic PTAE-8000U and my Integra DHC 80.3 9.2, this was never a problem. The Integra actually had + / - for audio adjustments. My Yamaha only has a minus setting. And this is NO help when the audio lags behind the video.

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