jason str Posted May 15, 2020 Share Posted May 15, 2020 Don't buy a used CD player, the optical pickup wears out. That is unless you can have a factory spare on hand to replace it when needed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddy Shagmore Posted May 25, 2020 Share Posted May 25, 2020 I scored a new Yamaha CD- S2100 recently for 30% off msrp. This is the 2nd from top of their line. It is SILVER too! Heavy sucker...high quality unit. I have been using the DAC feature going from my laptop (Tidal streaming) > Marantz 2245 > Chorus IIs. Very happy. This replaced my previous Yamaha CD player from 1988, which finally got tired. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codewritinfool Posted May 26, 2020 Share Posted May 26, 2020 On 5/10/2020 at 12:15 PM, artto said: You've copied all of the errors (defects) on the disc. Furthermore, just playing the disc - to copy it - creates additional errors of its own. The laser(s) do not read everything perfectly either. It's the nature of the beast. That's why we have error correction, otherwise it wouldn't work at all. Great point, @artto This is why you use EAC Exact Audio Copy or the like. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codewritinfool Posted May 26, 2020 Share Posted May 26, 2020 1 hour ago, Buddy Shagmore said: I scored a new Yamaha CD- S2100 recently for 30% off msrp. This is the 2nd from top of their line. It is SILVER too! Heavy sucker...high quality unit. I have been using the DAC feature going from my laptop (Tidal streaming) > Marantz 2245 > Chorus IIs. Very happy. This replaced my previous Yamaha CD player from 1988, which finally got tired. This is a fantastic player. Congratulations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WMcD Posted May 26, 2020 Share Posted May 26, 2020 Maybe someone can clear this up for me. The implication above is that there are errors in the digital data as it is copied from CD's and other digital media. Some years ago we had a fellow saying he had a 4th generation of a music file and of course it sounded bad (he claimed) because of errors. My question is therefore whether errors are corrected, perhaps perfectly, by the CD player before an analog output is created. The same for creating a digital file like FLAC. Going further, how about all the digital data which is sent hither and yon, copied, and archived. Computer program publishers are naturally concrned that their works will be copied and distributed, etc. Apparently the concern is that the pirate copies are indeed perfect -- or at least all errors have been detected and corrected. Don't Reed-Solomon techniques do this? It wouldn't be difficult to do a hash analysis of the files to detect errors in original versus copied files but I've not seen things like that being done. WMcD 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codewritinfool Posted May 26, 2020 Share Posted May 26, 2020 8 minutes ago, WMcD said: Maybe someone can clear this up for me. The implication above is that there are errors in the digital data as it is copied from CD's and other digital media. Some years ago we had a fellow saying he had a 4th generation of a music file and of course it sounded bad (he claimed) because of errors. My question is therefore whether errors are corrected, perhaps perfectly, by the CD player before an analog output is created. The same for creating a digital file like FLAC. Going further, how about all the digital data which is sent hither and yon, copied, and archived. Computer program publishers are naturally concrned that their works will be copied and distributed, etc. Apparently the concern is that the pirate copies are indeed perfect -- or at least all errors have been detected and corrected. Don't Reed-Solomon techniques do this? It wouldn't be difficult to do a hash analysis of the files to detect errors but I've not seen things like that being done. WMcD Yes, there are errors on CDs. Because of error correction, most can be corrected in the digital domain. The idea that if you copy a file 4 times you can hear a difference is bogus. If this were the case, all of your files would show errors, not just music. Hashes of some audio tracks / CDs are contained in a database by the aforementioned EAC. http://www.exactaudiocopy.de/en/index.php/overview/basic-technology/accurate-rip/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moray james Posted May 26, 2020 Share Posted May 26, 2020 59 minutes ago, codewritinfool said: Yes, there are errors on CDs. Because of error correction, most can be corrected in the digital domain. The idea that if you copy a file 4 times you can hear a difference is bogus. If this were the case, all of your files would show errors, not just music. Hashes of some audio tracks / CDs are contained in a database by the aforementioned EAC. http://www.exactaudiocopy.de/en/index.php/overview/basic-technology/accurate-rip/ are you suggesting that error correction will make things all better? what next, all transports sound the same? A friend was telling me about his recent love affair with a set of Roller Blocks (some call them Roller Balls) the last time I played with them was over twenty years ago or so . He was pestering me to try them again so I built a set this afternoon with some concave steel drawer pulls and three steel ball bearings and what an amazing improvement. any motion of the transport on the blocks is so very small that you cannot perceive any motion with your eye as the transport spins the disk yet your ears tell an all together different story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codewritinfool Posted May 26, 2020 Share Posted May 26, 2020 are you suggesting that error correction will make things all better? what next, all transports sound the same?Nope, just answering a question about error correction on CDs and about 4th generation copies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moray james Posted May 26, 2020 Share Posted May 26, 2020 1 hour ago, codewritinfool said: Nope, just answering a question about error correction on CDs and about 4th generation copies. OK. It has been a long time since I made any burned copies of a disk but I recall the program giving the option of ripping files at assorted speeds, the implication was that a 1:1 rip speed resulted in a better copy than a high speed rip. Is this still the case today? Is this also a situation of a slower rip speed resulting in fewer corrections in the copied data file? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codewritinfool Posted May 26, 2020 Share Posted May 26, 2020 5 minutes ago, moray james said: OK. It has been a long time since I made any burned copies of a disk but I recall the program giving the option of ripping files at assorted speeds, the implication was that a 1:1 rip speed resulted in a better copy than a high speed rip. Is this still the case today? Is this also a situation of a slower rip speed resulting in fewer corrections in the copied data file? I'm not at all certain, since it depends on what is done with the resultant data if there are uncorrectable errors. Does the software retry, does it slow down the speed, does it just give up and give you bad data? I dunno. What I am certain of is if you had a hash value for a given track from a database and then computed the exact hash value over the captured data for that same track, you at least have bit-for-bit what was on the original factory media, barring a rare hash collision. Once the data is the same in the digital domain, bits is bits. No better and no worse than the original CD contents. What happens after that, during and after the conversion to analog, is the tricky part. Just my 2 cents, and of course some will disagree. That's ok. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wetowne Posted May 26, 2020 Share Posted May 26, 2020 20 hours ago, codewritinfool said: Great point, @artto This is why you use EAC Exact Audio Copy or the like. I use dBpoweramp with Accuraterip, also my cd's were well cared for and in pristine condition. I really can't tell the difference between my rips and Tidal 44.1/16. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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