Moderators Travis In Austin Posted April 30, 2020 Moderators Share Posted April 30, 2020 20 minutes ago, 314carpenter said: Shh, don't tell anyone. I just added up the total. $2014.54 added to the food hoard this month. Just yesterday got lucky with 15LBS of ribeyes @ $4.99, 4LBS of beef tenderloin @ 5.99, 12LBS of NY strip @ $7.29. Had to buy whole and butcher my own. Everything else was overpriced or sold out. No chicken, No ground beef. You suppose you could blame me for part of the shortages. That reminds me I have a side of beef coming tomorrow, has to make some room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted April 30, 2020 Moderators Share Posted April 30, 2020 1 hour ago, DizRotus said: There was no success in secession. Can't pronounce secession successfully. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
314carpenter Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 In four U.S. state prisons, nearly 3,300 inmates test positive for coronavirus -- 96% without symptoms Have you seen this? Did not see anyone post it. Seems as though we have ourselves a control group to study how many people can be infected with the Covid-19 virus and still be asymptomatic. This is my greatest fear. A whole world of carriers going about as if they are perfectly immune to anything, all the while shedding viruses upon all who they encounter. At least in the past if someone would cough, or sneeze they might take a day off, or at least not breathe on you. Now with the asymptomatics of the world being oblivious to the problem, I have to, at this point, reconsider everything. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-prisons-testing-in/in-four-u-s-state-prisons-nearly-3300-inmates-test-positive-for-coronavirus-96-without-symptoms-idUSKCN2270RX 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvu80 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 21 minutes ago, dwilawyer said: Constitutional scholars talk about it in law review articles from time to time, kind of "what if"stuff. I think the fact that he limited to the enemy cause most to conclude that AL was aware of what was constitutional under his executive power. Very interesting, thanks for sharing. I love history and law stuff. I'm a mental health therapist by training. It would be cool to get the @The History Kid in on this. Last I checked he was a military historian for the military, something along those lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted April 30, 2020 Moderators Share Posted April 30, 2020 1 hour ago, 000 said: here is scientific info , I had posted earlier - https://www.livescience.com/coronavirus-wuhan-lab-complicated-origins.html https://www.livescience.com/coronavirus-not-human-made-in-lab.html I had read the journal article out of Scripps that is the basis for the second article, I will have to read the first livescience article. I have always liked live science, they almost always link you to the full article they are using as the basis of their report. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted April 30, 2020 Moderators Share Posted April 30, 2020 11 minutes ago, wvu80 said: Very interesting, thanks for sharing. I love history and law stuff. I'm a mental health therapist by training. It would be cool to get the @The History Kid in on this. Last I checked he was a military historian for the military, something along those lines. I miss him. I of course remember your mental health/counseling background. Yes, military history was what I recall also for the @The History Kid I wonder what subject he is teaching? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OO1 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 McDonald's customers in New Zealand line up down the block after drive-thru coronavirus restrictions lifted https://www.foxnews.com/food-drink/new-zealand-mcdonalds-customers-line-up-coronavirus-drive-thru-restrictions-lifted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wvu80 Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 1 minute ago, dwilawyer said: I of course remember your mental health/counseling background. I forget who I tell what to. I just didn't want you to mistake me for a lawyer because I like to argue. My mom used to tell me when I was a kid I should be a lawyer because I like to argue. I think I should have been a lawyer because I think I'm always right. 😁 +++ Counseling theory Things to Remember: Everybody thinks their opinion is right. 🤓 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sancho Panza Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 1 hour ago, dwilawyer said: Wrong, We the people..It is a written constitution, modeled from Scottish Enlightenment. God had nothing to do with it, and the DOI is seperate from Constitutional authority. The Drafting Committe had TJ take out God, and put in creator. The DOI is sometimes looked at for intreptaion, but seldom. The Constitution doesn't mention or imply natural law. There is certainly nothing about rights given by a god or otherwise. The court has looked at "implied rights" such as the "right of privacy" under a penumbra of rights. It has ruled squarely against rights claimed to be given from a god such as plural marriage. The "right" to revolt and start a revolution is the same here as every other place on earth, you have to win. Otherwise you are a criminal or a terrorist. Give me liberty or give me death" was the mantra. You win, you form a more perfect nation, you lose, you go face a military tribunal and are hung or sent away forever. After succession those states were enemy territory, populated with enemies of State. They abandoned their right to petition for redress of grievances, and they knew that. Advocating for the violent overthrow of the US government is a federal crime, it has withstood constitutional muster countless times. If it ever was was god given, We the People, took it away. I think if you read the whole preamble, and get through at least ten of the first grievances you will see that their claim of a right to revolt was based on a very, very, specific set of circumstances, the foremost of which was nobody would listen. Wrong. The States had to secede from the Perpetual Union of the Articles of Confederation to form the union. Those States who had yet to ratify were treated as independent nations. Virginia, & other States, conditionally ratified the Constitution with the Right to leave. Secession was not illegal, at that time. The South wished to depart from the union, in peace, however. Why was Jefferson F. Davis not tried for treason? The Chief Justice basically told president Andrew Johnson you’d better not try him, because he’s guilty of no crime. Had he been tried, and found not guilty... Would I have been for secession in 1860? No. My 3 times great grandfather was part of the Mississippi Secession Convention. He warned against such action, & with one other gentleman, voted NO. Both signed the document. Mine sent 4 sons to Mississippi Regiments (1 KiA). T’other became a General Officer. Both were fundamentally against leaving the union; but, loyal to their State. In 1865, my ggg gf was Chairman of the State Constitution Convention. If the States couldn’t leave the union, why did they have to be readmitted to the union? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted April 30, 2020 Moderators Share Posted April 30, 2020 1 minute ago, wvu80 said: I forget who I tell what to. I just didn't want you to mistake me for a lawyer because I like to argue. My mom used to tell me when I was a kid I should be a lawyer because I like to argue. I think I should have been a lawyer because I think I'm always right. 😁 +++ Counseling theory Things to Remember: Everybody thinks their opinion is right. 🤓 You have helped me with the statistical stuff in journal articles before. All I know is correlation doesn't equal causation. My historical focus and education is so focused it is useless outside academia: Constitutional History and Theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sancho Panza Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 P. S. People can not take away God given rights. Did you flunk theology? 😉 Rex, Lex, or Lex, Rex? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The History Kid Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 @wvu80 & @dwilawyer The History Kid is a modern and contemporary military historian. By and far the Civil War is outside my purview - save for the limited roles my installation had in the war, and the roles of key officers in the Civil War in the establishing of this installation. That being said, there's often fairly heated debate amongst military historians on the Civil War. On the one hand, you have individuals who believe that the South was indeed treasonous - omitting the sovereignty that was granted by the constitution - and was rightfully punished after the war. On the other hand, there are individuals who believe the South simply attempted to establish themselves by way of a second revolution. I've often sat in the middle of these two commentaries and argued both sides. No one can deny that many fought for their state, rather than the Confederacy, yet none can also argue about the onset at Fort Sumter. At any rate, I digress. I'm a Cold War / GWOT military historian first and foremost. COVID-19 Remarks: It is day 44 since I've been in the office and in my archives - and I am not happy. I need material to read and write on from there in relation to things I've been working on, I have tupperware in the fridge there that I'm sure is a biohazard, and I'm worried about my plant. >:[ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
314carpenter Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 Even Mcdonald's can't source enough meat. In Canada, Mcdonald's had a commitment to only source meat from in-country. Now on their own website the headline reads... COVID-19 Temporary change: Due to supply issues related to COVID-19, we are temporarily serving a mix of Canadian and imported beef. https://www.mcdonalds.com/ca/en-ca/about-our-food/sourcing.html https://news.mcdonalds.ca/covid-19-temporary-change-imported-beef Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted April 30, 2020 Moderators Share Posted April 30, 2020 3 minutes ago, Sancho Panza said: If the States couldn’t leave the union, why did they have to be readmitted to the union Because they formed CSA after secession, oh and they and lost. They should have hung Lee, Davis and the rest of the traitors right then and there, we were war and a military tribunal could have quickly, and legally taken care of that. The fact that Unconditional Surrender Grant was college buds with many of them probably changed the course of history for the next 125 years. Wrong. The States had to secede from the Perpetual Union of the Articles of Confederation to form the union. Read Federalist 40, he answered way better than I could even hope to. Those States who had yet to ratify were treated as independent nations. Virginia, & other States, conditionally ratified the Constitution with the Right to leave. It was yeah, or nay. Pass fail. Others tried to make in conditional upon passage of Bill of Rights. They knew going in, once your in, your in. Kind of like the mafia. Secession was not illegal, at that time. The South wished to depart from the union, in peace, however. Congress and Lincoln had a contrary view that states who seceded were well aware of. Lincoln's 1st Inaugral, his support of the Corwin Amendment, and on, and on to avoid secession. The Southern aristocracy was blinded by greed. Why was Jefferson F. Davis not tried for treason? The Chief Justice basically told president Andrew Johnson you’d better not try him, because he’s guilty of no crime. Don't know the full answer to this, but it wasn't because of Supreme Court. I'm thinking Lincoln wanted to get country back going again and then a North Carolinian like Andy Taylor wasn't going to make things too difficult. Probably a thousand books on what if Booth. . . . Had he been tried, and found not guilty... Do you know the history of the search, investigation and trials on Lincoln Conspirators? He would have been tried for treason, there would have been at least two witness as required by Constitution and they would have hung him. It must have been more politically expedient to have him around. I suspect the scallywag cut a deal,.but as I said before, I don't know much about the history behind that. Would I have been for secession in 1860? No. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. My 3 times great grandfather was part of the Mississippi Secession Convention. He warned against such action, & with one other gentleman, voted NO. There should be a statue of him in every town square in that Mississippi. Both signed the document. Mine sent 4 sons to Mississippi Regiments (1 KiA). T’other became a General Officer. Both were fundamentally against leaving the union; but, loyal to their State. Traitors to the Union, but whose to judge. They must have been glad Union was a forgiving lot. In 1865, my ggg gf was Chairman of the State Constitution Convention. You know what they say in the South, "Thank God for Mississipi" 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoff. Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 2 hours ago, 314carpenter said: Even Mcdonald's can't source enough meat. In Canada, Mcdonald's had a commitment to only source meat from in-country. Now on their own website the headline reads... COVID-19 Temporary change: Due to supply issues related to COVID-19, we are temporarily serving a mix of Canadian and imported beef. https://www.mcdonalds.com/ca/en-ca/about-our-food/sourcing.html https://news.mcdonalds.ca/covid-19-temporary-change-imported-beef THIS ^^^^ is what has to happen north of the 49th parallel for the Spawn of PET to take ANYTHING seriously enough to make a decision that has consequences. The Cargill beef plant in Alberta has staffing issues, like others have. The PM announced shortly after this sound business decision by McDonalds that the government will consider mandating food production facilities as essential, like other countries have. There was a pre-Covid nation-wide rail blockade here that went on for weeks and was only resolved when the railway said they were done shipping anywhere in Canada due to safety concerns. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tube fanatic Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 9 hours ago, Woofers and Tweeters said: Are we in agreement that is started in the live food market or in a lab? This is more needed info, too. According to this article, it was lab created: https://www.newsweek.com/dr-fauci-backed-controversial-wuhan-lab-millions-us-dollars-risky-coronavirus-research-1500741 I can’t get very excited about proposed vaccines as the fast tracking means totally inadequate testing with no concern or knowledge regarding long term effects. I would bet that the manufacturers will be protected by the total liability shield. So when people begin showing all kinds of side effects they will not be able to sue. These side effects will be dismissed as “coincidence” as has been the case with Gardasil which has killed some girls and left others totally disabled. Maynard 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete H Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 8 hours ago, wvu80 said: I'm a mental health therapist by training. I remember us discussing that at dinner before the concert. I would imagine that you could have a very successful practice based entirely on certain individuals on the forum. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 8 hours ago, 314carpenter said: In four U.S. state prisons, nearly 3,300 inmates test positive for coronavirus -- 96% without symptoms Have you seen this? Did not see anyone post it. Seems as though we have ourselves a control group to study how many people can be infected with the Covid-19 virus and still be asymptomatic. This is my greatest fear. A whole world of carriers going about as if they are perfectly immune to anything, all the while shedding viruses upon all who they encounter. At least in the past if someone would cough, or sneeze they might take a day off, or at least not breathe on you. Now with the asymptomatics of the world being oblivious to the problem, I have to, at this point, reconsider everything. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-prisons-testing-in/in-four-u-s-state-prisons-nearly-3300-inmates-test-positive-for-coronavirus-96-without-symptoms-idUSKCN2270RX I've been paying attention to this. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DizRotus Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 I too have paid close attention to this issue, especially after watching The Innocence Files (TIF) on Netflix. I don’t wish COVID-19 on anyone, including those incarcerated. TIF caused me to reflect on those defendants I successfully prosecuted to question whether any could have been innocent. The answer is no. The requirement to do justice as a prosecutor, rather than to get convictions, made it so that valuable Circuit Court felony jury trial time was not wasted on cases with serious flaws. Even in those days, the early 80s, I questioned the accuracy of eyewitness testimony. Without corroborating circumstantial evidence, I would not take a case to trial solely on the basis of eyewitness testimony. In the days before DNA evidence, corroborating circumstantial evidence consisted of fingerprints, ballistics evidence, etc. DNA evidence was in its infancy. TIF cast serious doubt on the “science” of bite mark evidence. Fortunately, I never had a case that relied on bite mark evidence. I checked Michigan’s OTIS system to confirm that three defendants sentenced to LIFE without parole are still incarcerated. I hope they don’t have COVID-19. The United States has way too many individuals incarcerated for nonviolent crimes with lengthy sentences that do not serve justice or protect society, many of those imprisoned are not guilty of the crime for which they were convicted. I’m not naive. Being found not guilty does not mean that you’re innocent, only that the state failed to sustain its burden of proving beyond a reasonable doubt that you are guilty of the crime charged. TIF demonstrates that too many police departments and prosecuting attorneys succumb to an “end justifies the means” mindset that encourages prosecutorial and police misconduct. All of the foregoing aside, the prisons are full of aging convicts who do not represent a threat to society. If they were released, states would enjoy enormous savings, including medical costs, up front, but geriatric ex-cons would have few prospects for employment on the outside. The state would end paying for them on the outside too. It’s complicated, but the inescapable reality is that a disproportionate number of corrections officers and inmates are infected by, and die from, COVID-19. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matthews Posted April 30, 2020 Share Posted April 30, 2020 12 hours ago, Dave A said: OK I hear this all the time and I have just one question. How can you be exposed to this Wuhan virus if you self quarantine? The only way you could get this is if you broke the quarantine yourself and who would be to blame for that? You can get everything you need delivered to your house so if you went out you chose to run the risk. Why have speed limits? Just let everyone drive as fast as they want. Those who are afraid to drive fast can just stay home. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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