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Bosco-d-gama

Covid19 redux

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6 minutes ago, sputnik said:

Question:  If you had to prioritize development of vaccines vs stockpiling PPE considering budget limitation, where would put resources?  With the benefit if hindsight,  I don’t know.

Tough decision in that hypothetical. Like a chicken and egg, cause and effect.

Fortunately, we can do both.

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Question:  If you had to prioritize development of vaccines vs stockpiling PPE considering budget limitations, where would you put resources?  With the benefit if hindsight,  I don’t know.

Individual states and medical institutions should be responsible for “stockpiling/providing” PPE and not depend on the federal government. Individuals should take responsibility and have their own masks, provisions, etc in the event of an emergency. You know, kind of like seasoned veterans of hurricanes make sure they have adequate supplies.


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11 minutes ago, sputnik said:

 

If you want to fix a problem, you need to look deeper into the cause.  Why was there a shortage of N95 masks?  The answer is politics and not pointing blame at either administration, congress also had a contribution.  The solution......place public safety above politics, listen to experts, be prepared, don’t bend facts, don’t exaggerate, don’t blame the the other guy, and get past partisan budget fights.  I think the link below is enlightening.
 

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2020/apr/08/donald-trump/trump-said-obama-admin-left-him-bare-stockpile-wro/

The title says, "Wrong," and that is misleading.  Her short synopsis at the top actually vindicates his claim.  Her argument is that "empty" doesn't mean "some," despite his clearly figurative use of the word.  

 

Journalists - the same as politicians - will use poetic license, won't they?

 

Still, the buck stops with the President, and if the claim is that the former Pres. should have stockpiled more, he had 3 years and the best economy the nation has ever head to build it.  Let's face it; we were caught with our pants down. 

 

In fairness, though, not a lot of people gave much thought to the idea of a serious pandemic.  It's kind of like all those scientists writing reports about how we're way past due for the San Andreas fault to give Californians an epochal shaking.  Meanwhile, people are going about their routines, and real estate prices there are as high as ever.  Just imagine what our state of the Union would be if the California coast was devastated.  It would make this virus look like child's play.

 

By the way, the earth is going to burn up within 30 years.  Or is it 12?  Or is it supposed to freeze over?  

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3 minutes ago, dtel's wife said:


Individual states and medical institutions should be responsible for “stockpiling/providing” PPE and not depend on the federal government. Individuals should take responsibility and have their own masks, provisions, etc in the event of an emergency. You know, kind of like seasoned veterans of hurricanes make sure they have adequate supplies.


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I was getting ready to make the same comment about self-preparedness, but it occurred to me that governments exist for the purpose of serving the unprepared.  No matter how right you are to claim people should be prepared, the fact is that 80% won''t be.

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1 hour ago, Bosco-d-gama said:

I was wondering. There are now 7 types of Coronaviruses known to infect humans. 4 of those are relatively benign while 3 cause severe infections and covid19 is among those. The 4 less severe viruses cause what we term a ‘common cold’.

 

So with covid19 we have proportion of victims showing no symptoms and another group suffering severe ailments...... and this seems to be confusing to science. Well what if (purely speculation), what if the people showing mild or nor symptoms recently had a Coronavirus type cold? Could they have achieved some level of immunity to covid19 having defeated a recent Coronavirus infection?

 

This is just a maybe...... thinking out loud here like Trump tends to do. Seems too obvious an answer on one hand but sometimes people overlook the obvious. They say that 15% of our regular ‘cold’ episodes are caused by Coronaviruses. Could these people have some limited and temporary immunity to covid19?

Some immunity likely from as you stated, also has to do with blood type.  Lots of variables.

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25 minutes ago, sputnik said:

Question:  If you had to prioritize development of vaccines vs stockpiling PPE considering budget limitations, where would you put resources?  With the benefit if hindsight,  I don’t know.

I would think PPE's as opposed to developing vaccines for viruses that aren't in existence yet.  This is assuming that you're referring to stockpiling in preparation for the next pandemic.

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I was getting ready to make the same comment about self-preparedness, but it occurred to me that governments exist for the purpose of serving the unprepared.  No matter how right you are to claim people should be prepared, the fact is that 80% won''t be.

Unfortunately personal responsibility is a rarity these days. This creates an imbalance in society that is difficult to overcome, placing the task squarely on the shoulders of the government.

 

If those people would put forth just a 50% effort we wouldn’t find ourselves in the predicament we are in as a nation. Sadly, there are those who would rather sit with their hand out.

 

Additionally, some people are so blind, selfish and unwilling to budge in any direction that getting anything accomplished is nearly impossible.

 

The hatred that some folks have towards another’s value or opinion is quite frankly disgusting.

 

 

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5 minutes ago, CECAA850 said:

I would think PPE's

Have we concluded that PPE's are ineffective and can actually do more harm than good?

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Just now, Jeff Matthews said:

Have we concluded that PPE's are ineffective and can actually do more harm than good?

If that were the case hospitals would discontinue use.

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1 minute ago, CECAA850 said:

If that were the case hospitals would discontinue use.

But I heard Fauci say it on 60 Minutes!

 

TBH, I'm just floating in the wind, trying to be fairly careful but not going to agonizing lengths.  I hardly know what to think about so many of the issues surrounding all this.  

 

Would you ever imagine that there is a push among some of the highest authority figures to actually default on our debts to China as a means to extract compensation for its mishandling of the virus outbreak?  

 

 

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More questions:

What happens as the virus spreads in developing countries where conditions are more conducive to infection with no substantial resources and limited by poor data?

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/future-development/2020/05/05/the-unreal-dichotomy-in-covid-19-mortality-between-high-income-and-developing-countries/

 

I don’t believe any of the conspiracy theories put out in this thread and a lot of other places involving intentional spread on the part of China, Soros, Trump, Fauci, HRC, Gates, or Weinstein (that was a good one) but how would you prevent some enterprising terrorist or whack job from weaponizing this or another virus?  It’s not a huge leap from suicide bomber to suicide viral vector and not very hard to accomplish.  This is what scares me.

 

Could we be weakening our virus resistance with our social distancing?  

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2 minutes ago, Jeff Matthews said:

I hardly know what to think about so many of the issues surrounding all this.  

Nor I.

 

It's hard for me to fathom most everything going on as I have been so minimally impacted by all this in my day to day life.  I've only really noticed it in my paycheck as I'm mostly commission and things are slow.  I know no one personally who has been directly impacted this either other than financially of course.

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2 minutes ago, sputnik said:

Could we be weakening our virus resistance with our social distancing?  

Lick a toilet a day!  It's what I've been doing for years!

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Just now, CECAA850 said:

Nor I.

 

It's hard for me to fathom most everything going on as I have been so minimally impacted by all this in my day to day life.  I've only really noticed it in my paycheck as I'm mostly commission and things are slow.  I know no one personally who has been directly impacted this either other than financially of course.

I know someone whose mother died from it.

 

Other than that, the only thing that has changed is not eating out.  I've gotten used to it, actually.  Although restaurants are back open, I haven't been to one, yet.  I used to go at least 3 times a week.

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28 minutes ago, Jeff Matthews said:

I was getting ready to make the same comment about self-preparedness, but it occurred to me that governments exist for the purpose of serving the unprepared.  No matter how right you are to claim people should be prepared, the fact is that 80% won''t be.

The ownership is a Federal or State responsibility?  Seems most states should hold responsibility.  You really don't want to rely on the federal govt. to push it down.

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24 minutes ago, dtel's wife said:


The hatred that some folks have towards another’s value or opinion is quite frankly disgusting.

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Put correctly.  As I said earlier, if you try to compromise and don't show disdain toward other opinions and values, the fringe elements beat you into submission.  Forced compliance and hindrance of open dialog.  oops fascism.  That's why I wonder about when someone talks about a therapy or possible drug, if there isn't hard science that goes with the norms, that is shut down.  What happened to discussion of ideas?  Might not be perfect but don't pummel it or blatantly discount it (or hide it like youtube).  It might have merit and without appropriate evaluation should not be dismissed.

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9 hours ago, pzannucci said:

Put correctly.  As I said earlier, if you try to compromise and don't show disdain toward other opinions and values, the fringe elements beat you into submission.  Forced compliance and hindrance of open dialog.  oops fascism.  That's why I wonder about when someone talks about a therapy or possible drug, if there isn't hard science that goes with the norms, that is shut down.  What happened to discussion of ideas?  Might not be perfect but don't pummel it or blatantly discount it (or hide it like youtube).  It might have merit and without appropriate evaluation should not be dismissed.

Exactly!  What you are describing occurred the minute Fauci didn't express the same kind of excitement [Moderator edit,.political]

 

Everyone politicized this event until we are where we are now...  chlor was indeed studied and found ineffective, and Fauci is in the back pocket of Chinese billionaires and the WHO.

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9 hours ago, Jeff Matthews said:

Exactly!  What you are describing occurred the minute Fauci didn't express the same kind of excitement [Removed, political]  Everyone politicized this event until we are where we are now...  chlor was indeed studied and found ineffective, and Fauci is in the back pocket of Chinese billionaires and the WHO.

You need to tell Rudy it wasn't effective along with all the other studies.  Too many to discount other than the one that was botched by the VA.

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9 hours ago, pzannucci said:
9 hours ago, Jeff Matthews said:

Exactly!  What you are describing occurred the minute Fauci didn't express the same kind of excitemen.

You need to tell Rudy it wasn't effective along with all the other studies.  Too many to discount other than the one that was botched by the VA.

Actually either way, it doesn't matter what works, somebody won't like it..  I like to sift through data and when data is ambiguously portrayed and slanted, it isn't data to me.  It shows a motive.

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2 minutes ago, pzannucci said:

You need to tell Rudy it wasn't effective along with all the other studies.  Too many to discount other than the one that was botched by the VA.

It's strange how things work out as they do sometimes.  I've seen many claims of people being cured by all sorts of things.  As I recall, though, chlor was put to a clinical trial.  Trials measure averages and standard deviations in a defined population.  Anecdotes are what we rely on when we're out of luck, grasping for straws or trying to beat the odds.

 

Believe it or not, many trials prove placebos actually work in some patients!  If a placebo can cure an illness in some people, I am not surprised chlor cured COV in some, too.

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