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Zitan

1979 Heresy I refurbishing advice

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I bought a pair of Heresy I’s in 1979 in college that have been w/ me ever since. Type E crossovers, K77 tweeters, K55-V squeaker drivers w/ K700 horns and K-22-E woofers.


I replaced the K77s w/ new ones from Klipsch about 20 years ago when I blew them and I replaced the binding posts at the same time so I could use banana plugs and lower gauge speaker cable. Otherwise everything is original. 

 

I don’t hear any obvious problems with them, but I want to restore them to their former glory or better. I’ve been reading everything I can find here and at Crites and at ALK but I still have many questions and would appreciate advice. 
 

1) I know I need new caps and since I don’t solder, I plan to replace the crossovers. I could use Crites Type E, which uses the same spec as the original, or ALK’s  universal CSW which have some upgrades. A few questions about that:

 

- I understand what Al says about constant impedance and no resistive error, but I don’t use an SAT amp so does that matter to what I hear?
 

- Also, the Type E only uses a low-pass inductor for the woofer. The squawker and the tweeter use high-pass capacitors in parallel, so (if I understood Al’s site) high freq sounds that should only go to the tweeter go to the squawker too. Does that matter? Would it matter if I replaced the K77 tweeters w/ Crites CT120s?
 

- Are the actual crossover frequencies the same between the two networks? It looks like maybe there is some adjustment possible on the CSW but I’m not sure. 

 

2) Is upgrading the K77s to CT120s a good idea?
 

3) I know I need to replace the gasket between the squeaker driver and the squawker horn, but does it also make sense to upgrade the K-55-V with a Crites A-55G? Do squawker drivers wear out and/or is the A-55G a lot better?
 

4)  Crites offers CW1228 woofers as drop-in replacements For the K-22-E. Are they better, especially given that the K-22-Es are 40 years old? Or what if I just rotated the K-22-Es 180 degrees as I read somewhere?
 

Sorry about so many questions - I’ve read a lot on my own and I’m still not clear on the best way to do this. There is tremendous expertise here and I’d be grateful to tap into it. 

 

Thanks in advance  
 

 

 

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Welcome to the forum, and I will try my best to answer some of your questions from my own meager store of knowledge. 
 

1.  If you like the original sound, stick with the Crites replacements.  If you want to experiment, go with the ALK offering.

    Part2:   All I know about the second part of question 1 is:  Good caps will definitely affect what you hear. 
    Part3:   From my reading, it seems to be okay to send shorter signal impulses to a driver, but not lower frequencies than what they  are rated for.  It will not “matter” if you replace the k-77 with the Crites.  You may get more volume from the new tweets.

   Part4:   No idea.

 

2.  If the high frequencies are important to you, then by all means get new tweeters. An experiment for you:  Go to YouTube and find a frequency sweep.  Take note of just how high the notes are for the tweeter.  As for me, I have tinnitus, so ultra high frequencies do  nothing for me. 
 

3.  The 55G is supposed to be better, but I have no direct experience with them. Think about this:  We live in the midrange. Human voices, and the “meat” of the music is in this range, so I think you have more bang for your buck here.

 

4.  There are more options for the woofer.  I modified one pair of my Heresies into “Super Heresies”, following a thread in this sub forum.  It might give you more insight about possibilities.  There is also another thread called Super Heresy 2.0 you should read after the V1 below.

 

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Heresy 1 speakers are some of the toughest speakers out there , the K55 and K77 are shared with the khorn-Cornwall and LaScala , and when these drivers or crossovers are in such a smaller enclosure , they last  for a long time -

 

- you can do a host of changes to the Heresy 1 - but as @Oicu812   said it already @ClaudeJ1  has done wonders with the Super-Heresy 1 and I would go that route if you want to revamp your Heresy 1 to a much better sounding speaker -  the woofer is the key change , the tweeter can remain or you can change it for a better one , the K55V  is not modified , and the crossover is upgraded to a B network modification only -

 

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1 hour ago, RandyH000 said:

Heresy 1 speakers are some of the toughest speakers out there , the K55 and K77 are shared with the khorn-Cornwall and LaScala , and when these drivers or crossovers are in such a smaller enclosure , they last  for a long time -

 

- you can do a host of changes to the Heresy 1 - but as @Oicu812   said it already @ClaudeJ1  has done wonders with the Super-Heresy 1 and I would go that route if you want to revamp your Heresy 1 to a much better sounding speaker -  the woofer is the key change , the tweeter can remain or you can change it for a better one , the K55V  is not modified , and the crossover is upgraded to a B network modification only -

 


Nice summary.  After going this route myself, I’m seriously happy with the outcome. @Zitan

 

We can assist you with the tech and soldering, which is easy if you follow a few basic rules. 

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14 hours ago, Oicu812 said:

I’m seriously happy with the outcome.

Wow. That is much better than not seriously happy, or seriously miserable with the outcome. Kudos to you who took the plunge and became one of my many "victims." This is what PWK called me when I first met him. LOL. Enjoy the music and all the bass/midrange detail you can possibly squeeze out of those old boxes!!

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4 hours ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

Wow. That is much better than not seriously happy, or seriously miserable with the outcome. Kudos to you who took the plunge and became one of my many "victims." This is what PWK called me when I first met him. LOL. Enjoy the music and all the bass/midrange detail you can possibly squeeze out of those old boxes!!

 

Thanks!  I enjoy them all day, every day.  Properly placed, I think they hold their own with the HIP pro version.

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On 9/16/2020 at 11:34 AM, ClaudeJ1 said:

 "victims." This is what PWK called me when I first met him. LOL.

tx Claude ,  looks to me  like PWK was not kidding

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23 minutes ago, RandyH000 said:

tx Claude ,  looks to me  like PWK was not kidding

I really liked this term "victim". I got a great portrait of a slight smirk on his face, but he was never one to smile, although he had a pretty dry wit! Like his definition of DDS................Digger of Decayed Stumps! LOL.

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1 hour ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

but he was never one to smile,

That's the Military Man in PWK  , A LT Colonel of the US  Army  never smiles 

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Zitan ,

 

Where do you live?  Soldering at this level is easy and cheap.

 

No crossover redesign is warranted.  You are not too likely to hear much difference for less than the value of the speakers.  Replace, or have a local electronics shop replace the capacitors with nice film and foil caps.  Expect around $80 per speaker for the caps, but $500 per speaker could be spent.  A constant impedance network is of no value to solid-state amps.  SET, yes, but for almost any others, no.  The simple networks in a Heresy I cause minimal phase shift and the components are tough enough to use them.  I'd keep them; I've kept mine.

 

John Allen's A-55-G measures better than a K-55-V.  Some even think it sounds better.  I think I read they were all out of stock until 2021 sometime.  Keep your K-55. 

 

B&C DE120 based tweeters are smoother and sillier sounding than a K-77-?.  They are a real upgrade for your Heresies.  To get the most out of it, the horn mouth must be flush with the front of the cabinet.  I'm running Fastrac tweeter horns that flush mount and like them a lot.  DaveA's latest iteration.of his tweeter horn is fabulously well made, tests well and everybody likes them.  They flush mount, too. 

 

If your woofers don't rattle or make funny noises, they are good.  Keep them.  A Klipsch employee told me a Heresy III/IV. woofer, K-28? Would be an upgrade.  Better to check all the cabinet joints for dried out glue and leaks than to replace a working woofer. 

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You have already done the tweeters, and banana plugs are nice to have

 

Install new gaskets for the K 55

Crites replacement crossovers aren't much more than new capacitors

I would just replace the crossovers with the cost so close.

Maybe a piece of synthetic batting in the bottom of the speaker for damping.  Something from a fabric store.

Go over the cabinets with some Watco Natural Oil to freshen them up a bit

Inspect the wiring and surround on the woofer.

Stop, declare victory and open a beer.

 

Every time I turn on my H1s, they sound great for 45 years running.

They are an engineered product,

some progress made in tweeter land since they were designed, so the upgrade may sound better.

 

The next bump up for the money would be a pair of used Forte 2s or LaScala 1s

 

 

 

 

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I own a pair of heresy's I purchased vin 1977. Long story short is they were urinated on by dogs we used to Foster. The horns are corroded and the finish came off. They still sound ok and the interiors are like new. Any suggestions on how to restore them? I appreciate and answers.

 

Walter B.

Edited by Walter B
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On 9/22/2020 at 10:07 PM, Walter B said:

I own a pair of heresy's I purchased vin 1977. Long story short is they were urinated on by dogs we used to Foster. The horns are corroded and the finish came off. They still sound ok and the interiors are like new. Any suggestions on how to restore them? I appreciate and answers.

 

Walter B.

Easy Cabinets to make

Have a local cabinet maker, make you a pair.

Or a friend with a table saw, and decent wood working skills. Measure internal dimensions for copy.

Existing motor board can be the template to trace onto the new motor board, to trace the cut outs for the drivers.

Grill cloth available from Crites, canes are popular, Crites may offer new grills, ask, also offers slant risers, or make your own regular risers using the ones on the existing speakers for the template

Parts Express, has a good choice of speaker terminals that are better than the ones provided in the H1s

Stain, raw birch plywood or veneer is a cost consideration

Check the Photos on line, but Canes and Cherry Stain or veneer might look nice.

Ask on the forum, someone sells the klipsch logos for the grills

If the metal horns were peed on, so were the woofers

Horns can be cleaned, sanded with fine steel wool or fine sandpaper like 400 wet, and painted.

Mid range drivers need a new gasket, or you can send them to Crites to get new diaphragms, test the magnets and send them back with new gaskets.

The tweeters are probably OK, but better ones are available from Crites and others, tech has progressed.

Woofers, Crites sells some, there are probably some on the forum used that someone will sell you if your ask, and there are low cost replacements on the market, but it takes some searching. I think Newark had one

 

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On 9/22/2020 at 11:07 PM, Walter B said:

Long story short is they were urinated on by dogs we used to Foster.

-cats -dogs  must be kept away from speakers  , or the speakers must be kept at a 3  foot  higher  level  -plus   cats love to stretch  their claws on  speaker grilles  ,  couches etc -

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