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Corona Virus Disease/(SARS-CoV-2) II


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7 minutes ago, Chad said:

Bunch of "armchair infectious disease experts" 'round these parts (and by that I mean all over the internet and probably most U.S. communities).

 

I think the smartest thing to do is understand this is super early in the timeline of the outbreak. Is it time to freak out and hoard all the TP (seriously what is that about)? Probably not. Is it time to be nonchalant about it? Hell no. The media certainly ain't helping at all.

 

Let's listen to actual science and to people who have spent the better parts of their lives actually studying these types of things, rather than dismiss it as being overblown though. That Joe Rogan podcast snippet linked above is a good example of real information we should probably pay attention to. Don't listen to the "entertainment news" or our politicians. Get your info from the real actual experts.

 

 

Well stated. I am watching to see if this is a real peril or not and will react accordingly.

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15 minutes ago, Chad said:

Don't listen to the "entertainment news" or our politicians. Get your info from the real actual experts.

I assume real, actual experts were involved in quarantining much of China, shutting down factories, welding doors of infected people shut so people can't come and go, removing infected people involuntarily from their homes, etc.

 

It's not at that stage over here, but at least we have seen a glimpse of how bad it can get.  No panic on my part, but I'm not scoffing at it, either.

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4 hours ago, Chris A said:

Not to pile on, but rather to inform...

 

When I finally recovered from H1N1 later in 2009 (it took a couple of months), I went back to my GP for a yearly physical.  My doctor started talking about the H1N1 diagnosis in August when he looked at my chart. He then said something that really got my attention: how the county medical officer "disallowed" the diagnosis.  My doctor is a brilliant guy, so for him to mention this meant that he was trying to convey something important that I should know.  

 

When I heard this, something that I felt inside turned me ice cold.  Why would a county medical officer "disallow" a diagnosis without examining me or the test sample first hand?  The answer of course is that something was pressuring the county medical officer to disallow it rather than admit that it did occur.  Now why would that be the case?  I'll leave that to your imagination (as did my doctor with me). My doctor then reiterated that two sample tests had been used and both came back positive (one a rapid test, and another a more thorough but longer test that takes a few days that confirms the first).  He was visibly disgusted with what he had to tell me.  He then changed the subject immediately back to my physical exam. 

 

The effect that this would have, I think (and Texas has a pretty good track record for public health relative to geographically adjoining states) is that under-reporting of non-hospitalizations during these "pandemics" is probably the norm. 

 

That should get your attention.

 

Chris


A diagnosis of a high profile disease in a private health care setting would be a death sentence for the admitting hospital. Extend that further to the county for trade and tourism.

 

All dollars and no sense.

 

I remember SARS cases being reported for months in Canada yet not a single one in the USA.

 

Not bloody likely.

 

There are 10 Americans for every Canadian.

 

There was, and has been a “convenient cover-up” for years.

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20 minutes ago, Jeff Matthews said:

I assume real, actual experts were involved in quarantining much of China, shutting down factories, welding doors of infected people shut so people can't come and go, removing infected people involuntarily from their homes, etc.

You could also assume most of that (beyond basic quarantining) was done at the hands of their government, not at the advice of science. 

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20 minutes ago, Jeff Matthews said:

 

It's not at that stage over here, but at least we have seen a glimpse of how bad it can get.  No panic on my part, but I'm not scoffing at it, either.

 

Panic is useless as it causes irrational decisions and undue stress.  A little fear will motivate and is a good thing if it causes you to think about a situation and develop a workable plan of action. 

 

Note I didn't say a solution, but a plan of action.  Take this seriously and do the best that you can.

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2 minutes ago, Chad said:

You could also assume most of that (beyond basic quarantining) was done at the hands of their government, not at the advice of science. 

I can't assume that.  Are you aware of any scientists who advised the government not to take such actions?  I assume, probably correctly, that there are a number of qualified scientists who work for their government.

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42 minutes ago, Jeff Matthews said:

I assume real, actual experts were involved in quarantining much of China, shutting down factories, welding doors of infected people shut so people can't come and go, removing infected people involuntarily from their homes, etc.

 

It's not at that stage over here, but at least we have seen a glimpse of how bad it can get.  No panic on my part, but I'm not scoffing at it, either.

I saw those videos too but then the Chinese govt turns around and says out of 1.3 billion people they report (https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/) less than 100,000 and 3,158 deaths. So who is telling the truth and where does one find the truth? For something that is supposed to be a huge threat to the human race there is an unprecedented amount of pure misinformation and smoke screens every where. If this is a deadly threat to the world why not clear the air and make the facts known. Some day there will be a real pandemic and these people who obfuscate the truth for whatever reason are not doing any of us a favor. I get tired of being lied to by everyone and tend to dismiss hyperbole until I see proof.

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34 minutes ago, Jeff Matthews said:

I can't assume that.  Are you aware of any scientists who advised the government not to take such actions?  I assume, probably correctly, that there are a number of qualified scientists who work for their government.

The Chinese physician who 1st recognized this virus and several of his colleagues attempted to sound alarms in China. The group of doctors were gathered together, told they were wrong and censured for causing a public panic. At least one of those doctors died from this disease. 

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My biggest issue with this is our communities and government not taking this seriously enough. Yes the chance overall of dying is low, but there are a lot of people above 60 in this country and with underlying health conditions that this can be devastating. We are not going to stop the spread but if we get on the ball now we can slow the transmission rate and allow our hospitals to be able to handle those that need the help. People act like it is going to kill them to hunker down for a month or so. I'm all for going all Italy immediately if it saves peoples lives.

As long as you can still get the essentials (groceries ,household items) and make it to and from work. Some of us work in essential industries that have to function no matter what. 

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1 hour ago, Jeff Matthews said:
1 hour ago, Chad said:

You could also assume most of that (beyond basic quarantining) was done at the hands of their government, not at the advice of science. 

I can't assume that.  Are you aware of any scientists who advised the government not to take such actions?  I assume, probably correctly, that there are a number of qualified scientists who work for their government.

Why couldn't you assume that? Also, if your assumption is correct, one could also assume some amount of government corruption would be involved if a scientist that is an actual expert on these things would suggest such inhumane things as welding doors shut to keep infected from leaving.

 

42 minutes ago, Bosco-d-gama said:

The Chinese physician who 1st recognized this virus and several of his colleagues attempted to sound alarms in China. The group of doctors were gathered together, told they were wrong and censured for causing a public panic. At least one of those doctors died from this disease. 

Ah, well there you go.

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2 minutes ago, Chad said:

Why couldn't you assume that? Also, if your assumption is correct, one could also assume some amount of government corruption would be involved if a scientist that is an actual expert on these things would suggest such inhumane things as welding doors shut to keep infected from leaving.

 

Ah, well there you go.

They actually arrested him.  Might have been house arrest, but they chose to stick their heads in the sand and kill the messenger.  Same thing happened in Iran.  Now our country is taking the same path.  If you don't test then there are no cases, right?

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1 hour ago, Bosco-d-gama said:

The Chinese physician who 1st recognized this virus and several of his colleagues attempted to sound alarms in China. The group of doctors were gathered together, told they were wrong and censured for causing a public panic. At least one of those doctors died from this disease. 

I am aware of that.  It doesn't mean the Chinese government doesn't listen to scientists.  It is anecdotal of what can happen when the government makes a mistake.

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Even American epidemiologists admit that forced quarantines, though cruel as they might be, are the most effective way to constrain the spread of a virus.

 

There is a fine line between the politics of individual rights and preservation of the majority.  Many of you seem to suggest it's rather simple.

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1 minute ago, Jeff Matthews said:

Even American epidemiologists admit that forced quarantines, though cruel as they might be, are the most effective way to constrain the spread of a virus.

 

There is a fine line between the politics of individual rights and preservation of the majority.  Many of you seem to suggest it's rather simple.

 

This is extremely complicated from a legal perspective.  We can solve this now, but will have to wait until it is very serious to take drastic steps. 

 

Always the pound of cure. 

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The whole country of Italy is under quarantine since yesterday. Public life is no longer taking place. Night curfews, borders with neighbouring countries are closed. Nearly 10,000 infected and over 1,000 dead. Germany currently : almost 1,000 infected and only 3 dead .The German government is taking all possible precautionary measures to prevent a pandemic.The spread of the virus obviously depends on general medical structures and care. Nevertheless, nobody can predict more precise estimates

 

 

 

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