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Corona Virus Disease/(SARS-CoV-2) II


CECAA850

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34 minutes ago, Zen Traveler said:

I didn't see the show and hope it's something they can figure out...That said, 6 cases out of 6 million shots given means you have a good chance of it not getting a blood clot but it's good to see they are keeping an eye one it.

 

Depends on how you assess risk and the data that are available, which is what they apparently are investigating now. The media is reporting the US cases affecting healthy women ages 18-48, so if you are in that demographic your risk likely would be much higher than say if you were a male age 74. However, IF the US data follows close to the AstraZeneca data in the UK, the first clot cases were reported were women, likely due to the fact that they were the first demographic to receive the vaccine (healthcare workers), and cases in men showed up later on as the data was collected. The risk analysis is a more complicated one - as you also have to factor in the risk of serious illness or death due to COVID. In other words, the risk to a healthy 20 year old woman likely would be different than a 76 year old man with multiple pre-existing conditions.

 

I'm not sure, but I keep hearing that 6M number thrown out, and if that includes all J&J vaccines given to date we likely would see more blood clot cases over the next two weeks, as the others showed up between 9-14 days after given the vaccine (e.g. if someone was vaccinated last week, they wouldn't present with the clot symptoms until this week or next week). It's also important for the CDC and the FDA to get information to health care providers because it's my understanding that the typical treatment for these types of blood clots in people that have received the vaccine could likely have adverse effects, or kill them.

 

Agree, that hopefully they can figure out what is going on. FYI - both the AZ and J&J shots use an adenovirus to deliver the DNA, but the J&J uses a human adenovirus (weakened), whereas the AZ vaccine uses one from a Chimpanzee.

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5 minutes ago, grasshopper said:

I feel like a Guinea pig again... all of a sudden.   Yeah... it's 0.00001%   but still ...

 

I promise to not go off on a big pharma rant


That number is the risk with most vaccines, or there about. Covid-19 vax is obviously getting all the pub from the year long news making pandemic to the extreme speed the final vax was developed. Any abnormalities from distribution to adverse reactions are surely to be magnified.

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45 minutes ago, Sam S. said:

It's also important for the CDC and the FDA to get information to health care providers because it's my understanding that the typical treatment for these types of blood clots in people that have received the vaccine could likely have adverse effects, or kill them.

I saw Dr Fouci address that this morning and is getting that message out. Congratulations on getting the vaccine and hope we all are able to get our lives back to normal soon.

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1 hour ago, CECAA850 said:
16 hours ago, Zen Traveler said:

If the vaccine doesn't work like they say it's working we'll know soon.

Correct.  They've already stopped using the J&J for blood clots.

They are definitely keeping an eye on it and lets see if any more cases get reported....So far 6 ladies out of 7 million doses given.

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50 minutes ago, grasshopper said:

I feel like a Guinea pig again... all of a sudden.   Yeah... it's 0.00001%   but still ...

Congratulations on getting the vaccine because it is effective against contracting Covid-19.

50 minutes ago, grasshopper said:

 

I promise to not go off on a big pharma rant

Believe me I get this as well--Start another thread and I may join in and agree with some of your opinions. :)

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3 minutes ago, Zen Traveler said:

They are definitely keeping an eye on it and lets see if any more cases get reported....So far 6 ladies out of 7 million doses given.

Really seems good odds for most if what they are saying is true. Never know when we are talking government even our own. 

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6 minutes ago, henry4841 said:

Never know when we are talking government even our own. 

Agreed. One of the things all of us are fortunate for is we are living in the Information Age. People can question government and there are ALOT of people trying to expose where there are flaws. Imo, keep an open mind and trust reputable sources over internet and media propaganda. In this case it appears the system is working.

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8 minutes ago, Zen Traveler said:

They are definitely keeping an eye on it and lets see if any more cases get reported....So far 6 ladies out of 7 million doses given.

Since the window of reported clots has been 9-14 days after the vaccine is given, many people are still within that window (e.g. say they just received their shot a few days ago), so we would expect those numbers to increase over the next two weeks. So far, it's women in the 18-48 demographic, but that was the same way the AZ data started, then later expanded to include men.

 

The other thing to keep in mind here, is that in addition to the clotting cases reported, the J&J vaccine had 2 clinics last week (one in CO and one in NC) close because of immediate side effects and some being rushed to the ER for treatment. In addition to the reports of the J&J contamination (up to 62M doses) at the Emergent Bitsolutions manufacturing plant.

 

I agree that the public health officials are doing the right thing, but.....aren't these sorts of data supposed to be uncovered in clinical trials?

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Just now, Sam S. said:

I agree that the public health officials are doing the right thing, but.....aren't these sorts of data supposed to be uncovered in clinical trials?

From what I understand is that the clinical trial used 20,000 people and the clotting issue didn't come up. Surely it will be more than 6 women, but if it rises to only a couple dozen to 100 more then they may target other populations and let the risk group for clotting take something else. That's my take.

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  • Klipsch Employees

 

Not sure if this is real or not...but there are folks out there that are "proving" that the vaccine stops the "x" version of the bug. But it does nothing to stop the "Y" version of the bug...and in fact, it blocks your natural antibodies from doing their job and trying to stop "Y".  Thus, letting "Y" through with no resistance. This could be VERY BAD for folks, as this will never leave your body.  I believe this report but hope they are wrong. I don't take Flu vaccines ..or otherwise. I won't and don't worry about a bug with a 98% or higher recovery and survival rate. 98% chance I will be fine or 50% chance the drug will be "OK".    As for hospitals and their ICU bed count...One would think that with ALL the folks needing ICU due to the bug, the hospitals would INCRESS the number of ICU beds....Looking at Indiana...and just looking at the amount of beds used, Most hospitals are at 60% full. (about avg for now). Most are at the same for ICU beds. However, I can not find anywhere that states that they added more ICU beds at any local hospital. I may just not be able to find it.  It has been over a year, someone surley looked at this.  I think that by not adding beds, the media can say, "we are running out of icu beds" when in fact, they never added more beds to handle the issue.  Again, I can not prove this, but it sure looks that way. Not to mention the extra covid money each patient earns the hospitals. A year in, it looks more like milking the covid *** than anything.

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15 minutes ago, Zen Traveler said:

From what I understand is that the clinical trial used 20,000 people and the clotting issue didn't come up. Surely it will be more than 6 women, but if it rises to only a couple dozen to 100 more then they may target other populations and let the risk group for clotting take something else. That's my take.

The stage 3 trials included 43,783 participants. They didn't disclose the sex or age breakdown, only that 34% were over age 60.

 

https://www.jnj.com/johnson-johnson-covid-19-vaccine-authorized-by-u-s-fda-for-emergency-usefirst-single-shot-vaccine-in-fight-against-global-pandemic

 

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25 minutes ago, Trey Cannon said:

 

Not sure if this is real or not...but there are folks out there that are "proving" that the vaccine stops the "x" version of the bug. But it does nothing to stop the "Y" version of the bug...and in fact, it blocks your natural antibodies from doing their job and trying to stop "Y".  Thus, letting "Y" through with no resistance. This could be VERY BAD for folks, as this will never leave your body.  I believe this report but hope they are wrong.

Do you have a link?

25 minutes ago, Trey Cannon said:

I don't take Flu vaccines ..or otherwise.

I never took the flu vaccine as well but am reconsidering with what I'm learning about covid.

25 minutes ago, Trey Cannon said:

 

I won't and don't worry about a bug with a 98% or higher recovery and survival rate. 98% chance I will be fine or 50% chance the drug will be "OK".   

The situation with Covie-19 and I am now considering with the flu is that we can be healthy and neither affect us much but if we carry the virus we could spread it to people that are in a higher risk group. 

25 minutes ago, Trey Cannon said:

As for hospitals and their ICU bed count...One would think that with ALL the folks needing ICU due to the bug, the hospitals would INCRESS the number of ICU beds....Looking at Indiana...and just looking at the amount of beds used, Most hospitals are at 60% full. (about avg for now). Most are at the same for ICU beds. However, I can not find anywhere that states that they added more ICU beds at any local hospital. I may just not be able to find it.  It has been over a year, someone surley looked at this.  I think that by not adding beds, the media can say, "we are running out of icu beds" when in fact, they never added more beds to handle the issue.  Again, I can not prove this, but it sure looks that way. Not to mention the extra covid money each patient earns the hospitals. A year in, it looks more like milking the covid *** than anything.

I can't comment on Indiana but they added quite a few ICU beds and have a wing in the hospital devoted to Covid patients. I learned this from one of my students that is a nurse in the ICU. 

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I found this for Denton County. @Trey Cannon

Denton County Adds 410 New COVID-19 Cases Monday; ICU Capacity Expands, 10 Beds Available (msn.com) From the link:

 

The county health department also reported a record 224 people hospitalized with COVID-19 in Denton County, up 31 from New Year's Day. Of those hospitalized with COVID-19, 41 are in ICUs and account for 43% of the patients in intensive care. As of Monday afternoon, Denton County ICUs are 90% occupied.

The county's COVID-19 dashboard listed 105 total ICU beds, which is an increase of 17 beds compared to New Year's Day. With the added capacity, Denton County ICUs occupancy dropped from 95% to 90%

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53 minutes ago, Trey Cannon said:

I think that by not adding beds, the media can say, "we are running out of icu beds" when in fact, they never added more beds to handle the issue.  Again, I can not prove this, but it sure looks that way. Not to mention the extra covid money each patient earns the hospitals. A year in, it looks more like milking the covid *** than anything.

Btw, this seems extremely cynical. I just had Hip Surgery and because of Covid there are ALOT of people who were put on hold so there are waiting lists for different surgeries that people put off because of Covid. Our hospital is at 80% capacity so I don't think anyone is "milking the covid" and those being admitted are truly in need of hospitalization. Folks don't like going to the hospital and my guess is alot of people recovered at home with the really sick being admitted.

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20 hours ago, Zen Traveler said:

Okay here is the current numbers for Denton County: Denton County GIS - COVID-19 Information - COVID-19Cases (arcgis.com)

If you go down to hospitalizations our percentage of covid patients on Aprill 22, 2020 was 3.2% and today it's 4.5%. They are still predicted it will go up so I think @billybob's assessment is correct if we don't get ahead of the virus by trying to get at least an effort towards Herd Immunity (somewhere between 50 to 70+% vaccinated we are in the middle of this pandemic. 

Think you will find that 70 to 90 percent is the numbers commonly discussed as providing decent herd immunity for the US population.

With only 5 percent of the global population being vaccinated at present, that is where the maelstrom comment came from.

 

Moderna on booster and the likely endemic trend which will continue to pose a problem as variants may continue for awhile for the reasons stated above:

 

https://www-businessinsider-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.businessinsider.com/americans-might-get-booster-shoot-for-moderna-vaccines-this-year-2021-4?

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21 hours ago, CECAA850 said:

Who said that covid isn't bad?  You said that we were in the "eye of the maelstrom" and the CDC chart doesn't agree with that.  it was much worse previously.

We don't know how those vaccinated will fare in the future either.  That's the thing about the future.

What isn't a coin toss decision?

Sorry, did not want to come off as combative, or put you on a defensive.

Not attacking you or your views.

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12 minutes ago, billybob said:

Think you will find that 70 to 90 percent is the numbers commonly discussed as providing decent herd immunity for the US population.

To clarify, I posted several links the consensus is 70% for Herd Immunity.  I used the lower benchmark of 50% to at least get our hospitals out of the danger zone. Imo, sometime within the next year I feel quite a few of the people on the fence will come around to getting the vaccine. 

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1 minute ago, Zen Traveler said:

To clarify, I posted several links the consensus is 70% for Herd Immunity.  I used the lower benchmark of 50% to at least get our hospitals out of the danger zone. Imo, sometime within the next year I feel quite a few of the people on the fence will come around to getting the vaccine. 

I do understand when you write the substance of your post.

I stand by my numbers however as to source.

This is a global concern and will try to differentiate that in future, as to not confuse local data/trends.

If I continue... thanks y'all!

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