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Corona Virus Disease/(SARS-CoV-2) II


CECAA850

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18 minutes ago, Subway said:

Thanks:

The US government updated its pandemic plan[42] and public guidelines[43] [44] in April 2017. In January 2017 it had updated its estimate of resource gaps[45] [46] and a list of issues for the US government to consider (called a playbook).[47] The plan and guidelines were public. The estimate of resources and list of issues were not public, though they were not classified and reporters have obtained them and made them public.[45][47]

The military's estimate of resource gaps in January 2017 noted "Deficiencies and vulnerabilities... lack of infrastructure, and PPE... and limited laboratory confirmatory testing... Medical systems may be overwhelmed by a dramatic increase in patient numbers. Staff availability may also be limited as medical personnel become infected."[46] In the final year of the administration of George W. Bush, the Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority (a division of the Department of Health and Human Services) "estimated that an additional 70,000 machines [ventilators] would be required in a moderate influenza pandemic."[48]

The list of issues, or playbook, covered normal conditions as well as pandemic conditions. During normal conditions, there was no discussion of estimating and building up stockpiles for use in emergencies.[47] In the United States; the Strategic National Stockpile's stock of masks used against the 2009 flu pandemic was not replenished by the Obama administration or by the Trump administration.[2]

Interesting read for the whole article.

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On 6/2/2021 at 10:52 AM, Audible Nectar said:

 

This has been proven to prevent low (T)ransconductance.

 

And allows you to turn it up again!

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“The 2017 guidelines note that a vaccine for the 2009 H1N1pdm09 swine flu virus took eight months before it was available for distribution at the end of 2009.[43] A vaccine for the 2003 SARS virus took 13 years to develop, and was ready for human trials in 2016, which have not yet happened.[49][50] A vaccine for the 2009 MERS virus took ten years to develop, and began human trials in 2019.[51] Nevertheless, the guidelines said only six months would be needed to develop and distribute a vaccine for the next pandemic, telling schools and day cares they might need to close that long.[43] However the guidelines told businesses to expect only up to two weeks of school closures, saying employees might need to stay home two weeks with their children “.

If I recall correctly from what I read: USA has/had enough anthrax and smallpox vaccine stockpiled for every citizen as part of pandemic plan. These two were the only stockpiled vaccines listed.

 

Articles below

·         Disease ecologist Peter Daszak, 55, warned that a pandemic was coming

·         March 16, 2020 (001554) – Fauci is asked “Given the relative safety of all but the elderly and those whose immune systems are compromised, and that they are far fewer than the rest of the population, why not quarantine only them?” and responds by stating “Stay tuned.”

 

Doctor who warned that a pandemic was coming is now slammed for having a 'conflict of interest' | Daily Mail Online

 

ICAN OBTAINS OVER 3,000 PAGES OF TONY FAUCI'S EMAILS | ICAN - Informed Consent Action Network (icandecide.org)

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15 hours ago, CECAA850 said:

Its easy to predict something when you have insider information. 

Precisely.

 

Having information and data so that virologists can apply the scientific method to predict where the next one will occur, and what the likely bugs are. They go out and sample humans, domestic and wild animals for known and novel viruses. One half of the program is focused on avian populations.  Which is why the US started a program to do exactly that about 20 years ago. In 2009 the EPT created the PREDICT program to prepare the public health community to combat disease threats at the first stage of their emergence through an early warning system for detecting novel zoonotic diseases in disease hotspots regions. (Asia, Africa, Central America). PREDICT's focus was "aimed to characterize viral diversity in key animal species; identify high risk interfaces where virai spillover is most likely to occur;.and identify and assess novel viruses most likely to impact human health." 

 

It's all here: https://www.usaid.gov/news-information/fact-sheets/emerging-pandemic-threats-program

 

PREDICT Program at UC Davis: https://ohi.vetmed.ucdavis.edu/programs-projects/predict-project

 

If anyone is deeply interested in any of this there is an excellent book called Spillover: https://www.davidquammen.com/spillover That was written in 2012, and the promo material at the time stated:

 

Spillover is a work of science reporting, history, and travel, tracking this subject around the world.  For five years, I shadowed scientists into the field--a rooftop in Bangladesh, a forest in the Congo, a Chinese rat farm, a suburban woodland in Duchess County, New York-and through their high-biosecurity laboratories.  I interviewed survivors and gathered stories of the dead.  I found surprises in the latest research, alarm among public health officials, and deep concern in the eyes of researchers. I tried hard to deliver the science, the history, the mystery, and the human anguish as page-turning drama.

 

From what innocent creature, in what remote landscape, will the Next Big One emerge?  A rodent in southern China?  A monkey in West Africa?  A bat in Malaysia that happens to roost above a pig farm, from which hogs are exported to Singapore?  In this age of speedy travel between dense human populations, an emerging disease can go global in hours.  But where and how will it start?  Recent outbreaks offer some guidance, and so I traced the origins of Ebola, Marburg, SARS, avian influenza, Lyme disease, and other bizarre cases of spillover, including the grim, unexpected story of how AIDS began from a single Cameroonian chimpanzee.

 

The subject raises urgent questions.  Are these events independent misfortunes, or linked?  Are they merely happening to us, or are we somehow causing them?  What can be done?   But this book is intended to be more than a work of reportage.  It's also the tale of a quest, through time and landscape, for a new understanding of how the world works.

 

I also recommended last March the book by John M. Barry, The Great Influenza (2005) where he clearly stated that it wasn't a matter of "if" it was "when" the next pandemic would occur. It was a New York times best seller. 

 

The only thing we really know about animal viruses is that we don't know enough. We haven't even scratched the surface:

 

"SARS-CoV-2 is one of many potential viral threats to humans. There are just over 250 known zoonotic viruses—viruses that have previously spilled over from animals to humans and caused disease in people (4). While these viruses are of ongoing concern to human health, as repeated Ebola epidemics demonstrate, the yet to be identified viruses pose an equal if not more serious threat to humanity. Approximately 1.67 million undescribed viruses are thought to exist in mammals and birds, up to half of which are estimated to have the potential to spill over into humans (5). 

Quote from https://www.pnas.org/content/118/15/e2002324118

 

 

 

 

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13 minutes ago, dwilawyer said:

Having information and data so that virologists can apply the scientific method to predict where the next one will occur, and what the likely bugs are. They go out and sample humans, domestic and wild animals for known and novel viruses. One half of the program is focused on avian populations.  Which is why the US started a program to do exactly that about 20 years ago. In 2009 the EPT created the PREDICT program to prepare the public health community to combat disease threats at the first stage of their emergence through an early warning system for detecting novel zoonotic diseases in disease hotspots regions. (Asia, Africa, Central America). PREDICT's focus was "aimed to characterize viral diversity in key animal species; identify high risk interfaces where virai spillover is most likely to occur;.and identify and assess novel viruses most likely to impact human health." 

You realize that evidence is growing pointing to covid 19 being created in the lab through gain of function research right?  Those that were aware of this are the ones that have inside information as to how dangerous it could be and what would happen if it escapes.

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55 minutes ago, CECAA850 said:

You realize that evidence is growing pointing to covid 19 being created in the lab through gain of function research right?  Those that were aware of this are the ones that have inside information as to how dangerous it could be and what would happen if it escapes.

 

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9 minutes ago, CECAA850 said:

You realize that evidence is growing pointing to covid 19 being created in the lab through gain of function research right?  Those that were aware of this are the ones that have inside information as to how dangerous it could be and what would happen if it escapes.

No, what I realize is that this thread skirts the fringe of politics all of the time and why many have suggested to me privately that it has peaked in benefit long ago. It's supposed to be about the reliable information on current information relating to the detection, treatment and prevention of COVID-19. The origin theory has nothing to do with that, but it is still important with regard to how to manage the next pandemic, which could be novel, or H1N1, ebola, MERS, SARS 1, all of which are zoonotic without question.

 

"Evidence"? I'm not aware of any. I'm aware of numerous "clues" that point to either the theory of origin being either from an animal or a lab release. (I'm in the lab release camp myself, not that it matters). I can give you a list of all of the clues in favor of the lab release theory. However, there is no direct evidence to support either theory, there is no proof (yet). 

 

I'm aware that this publication, https://journals.plos.org/plospathogens/article?id=10.1371/journal.ppat.1006698 by researchers at WIV in 2017 kicked off the debate in reference to GOV research in conection with SARS2.

 

I also realize that "Gain of Function" means different things to different people and there is no precise definition of it - it's being used different ways by different people for their own purposes, including political. I remember there was a debate over a grant to a subcontractor, who gave a grant to the WIV which I think caused this thread to get shut down the second time over politics. I'm aware that there is a current POLITICAL debate over whether using scientific research to determine whether a bat virus could "spill over" into humans constitutes "Gain of Function" research. I'm also aware that GOF research has been a matter of scientific and policy debate since at least 2011. 

 

I'm aware that a top researcher in this field from Columbia has "unsigned" a letter/OP ED by many top scientists that the virus didn't come from a lab accident when he realized WIV only had level 2 safeguards in the area where this work was done, he was under the impression it was in the level 4 area. He now has "concerns" and favors further investigation. Nothing about GOF from him.

 

I'm aware that the top scientists/researchers in the US on this subject wrote a letter in mid-May to Science (considered to be the most prestigious scientific publication in the world) saying the investigation conducted was inadequate, and further investigation was absolutely necessary. They were clear that the possibility of a lab spillover needed to be taken seriously, but that politics had no place in science or the investigation. Stating:

 

"Notably, WHO Director-General Tedros Ghebreyesus commented that the report's consideration of evidence supporting a laboratory accident was insufficient and offered to provide additional resources to fully evaluate the possibility (5).

 

As scientists with relevant expertise, we agree with the WHO director-general (5), the United States and 13 other countries (6), and the European Union (7) that greater clarity about the origins of this pandemic is necessary and feasible to achieve. We must take hypotheses about both natural and laboratory spillovers seriously until we have sufficient data. A proper investigation should be transparent, objective, data-driven, inclusive of broad expertise, subject to independent oversight, and responsibly managed to minimize the impact of conflicts of interest. Public health agencies and research laboratories alike need to open their records to the public. Investigators should document the veracity and provenance of data from which analyses are conducted and conclusions drawn, so that analyses are reproducible by independent experts.

 

Finally, in this time of unfortunate anti-Asian sentiment in some countries, we note that at the beginning of the pandemic, it was Chinese doctors, scientists, journalists, and citizens who shared with the world crucial information about the spread of the virus—often at great personal cost (8, 9). We should show the same determination in promoting a dispassionate science-based discourse on this difficult but important issue."

 

Obviously none of the dozen or so who signed on to that letter at Science moderate an audio-loud speaker forum. "A dispassionate science-based discourse" - good luck with that. Maybe I should move it all to a new thread and see where it goes from there. 

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Dr. Tess Lawrie speaks out against suppression of treatments which were saving lives:

 

https://www.thedesertreview.com/opinion/letters_to_editor/dr-tess-lawrie-the-conscience-of-medicine/article_ff673eca-ac2d-11eb-adaa-ab952b1d2661.html

 

In my years of being tied to the medical community I have never seen such reluctance and refusal to try treatments which are being used successfully by those in the front lines.  
 

 

Maynard

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7 hours ago, Subway said:

If I recall correctly from what I read: USA has/had enough anthrax and smallpox vaccine stockpiled for every citizen as part of pandemic plan. These two were the only stockpiled vaccines listed.

 

 

"Compared to the small amount of money spent on recommended supplies for a pandemic, billions of dollars had been spent by the Strategic National Stockpile to create and store a vaccine for anthrax, and enough smallpox inoculations for the entire country.[81]"

 

Pandemic predictions and preparations prior to the COVID-19 pandemic - Wikipedia

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Subway said:

"Compared to the small amount of money spent on recommended supplies for a pandemic, billions of dollars had been spent by the Strategic National Stockpile to create and store a vaccine for anthrax, and enough smallpox inoculations for the entire country.[81]"

 

Pandemic predictions and preparations prior to the COVID-19 pandemic - Wikipedia

 

 

 

 

Terrorist considerations.  Biologicals are cheaper and easier than the nuclear option.  Preparing for a different problem.

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40 minutes ago, oldtimer said:

Biologicals are cheaper and easier than the nuclear option.

personally, I've never priced either; but I'll take your word for it. 

Peace my friend. 

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the WET market  was the origin of the pandemic

 

how did  the wet market get infected with covid 19   ?

was patient 0  infected by an animal  to  human transmission  ?  

was patient 0  infected by  a human to human  transmission  ?   

who was patient 0  ?

are there samples of patient 0 ?

 

 

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9 hours ago, Deang said:

If it got out of the lab, it was an accident, followed by a cover up.

Common sense tells me lab. Just coincidence the lab was located where virus started? Accident, not so sure myself. Last administration was hurting China's economy. Last I heard Fauci questions whether communist China would kill it's own citizens. No question in my mind they would if it benefited party. Stalin killed millions when he got in power before WW11. When it comes to what any party in any country would do to stay in power there is no limit for what they would do or say. Lose some people, peasants will just make more attitude. 

 

No proof or evidence in above statement. Just something to think about if not censored here. Get in trouble everywhere these days for not jumping off cliff with rest of herd. 

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As far as party killing citizens. I am sorta a history buff. When Stalin came to power Russia was way behind other countries when it came to industry. The only real commodity the Country had that was in demand was food. Ukraine is the bread basket for Russia. Stalin starved the Ukrainians to death taking most everything they produced to sell on the open market to finance his industrialization of Russia. Millions died but the reality is it worked and enabled Russia to produce the war materials needed to defeat Germany decades later. But at what cost. Maybe it was the right thing to do unless you were one of the unfortunate Ukrainians that died. Trust China, or any one party Country, never. 

 

As far as lab origin of virus one only needs to use common sense. In the 70's I asked an employee what the difference was between being drunk or high on pot. One can read books on the effects of pot from the so called experts. His common sense response was "when your drunk your drunk and when you are high your high."

At times the intellectuals are so intelligent that they become just fools and cannot see the snake on the ground without books to read about snakes on ground. I just see China as a snake.   

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