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Klipsch the Fives with Tidal: Requirements for best possible quality


Marko

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Hello team

 

I am new to this community and also new to the HiRes sound topic. I decided to ditch my soundbar for the Klipsch The Fives and heaving better and clearer sound instead of surround soun. I bought the speakers a few day ago and I'm not regretting anything. The Fives sound very nice. I am now also testing Tidal and would like to have the best possible experience with the sound quality. As written I am pretty new to this topic and not sure what I exactly need to have the best possible quality. Currently I won a OnePlus 7 Pro phone which supports aptX HD and LDAC but when streaming over Bluetooth I honestly have to say that Tidal is not much better than Spotify. It's louder but when I adjust the volume to the same level I think it's the same quality. But I also think that even with aptX HD and LDAC the bluetooth connection is not really transmitting the CD quality. Or are the difference not so big as I thought? 

 

In the internet I read a lot about network streaming, DAC and so on. Therefore some questions. (I have to mention that I like my setup as clean as possible)

Based on the specs The Fives have a built in USB DAC. Does this mean I can connect and old phone directly to the USB and use my current phone with Tidal LINK to remotly control the phone on the speakers and I will have the quality I want? 

 

Another case I am thinking of is buying the Fiio M9, connect this directly to The Fives and also control the M9 with my phone and Tidal LINK. Will this scenario give me better sound? 

 

Thank you for your help. 

 

Regards,

Marko

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Ditto what wetowne said about the Chromecast Audio (CCA), it works well with The Fives for Tidal and pretty much any of the other streaming services. It doesn't support MQA but honestly I doubt that you would be able to hear the difference on The Fives. If you want MQA support then I would recommend a BlueSound Node 2i.

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  • 3 months later...

Hi everyone,

 

Hope i'm not to late to the party, also a newbie here trying to bring up the best posible sound out of the fives in general, and especially with tidal.

 

On 1/8/2021 at 3:44 AM, Marko said:

Ok, thank you guys. I'll try the Chromecast

 

Do you finally go this way? how does it work?

I use a fiio m11 pro as a main digital source. I got it connected to the original brand dock and from there to the usb port in the fives but i'm not satisfied with this solution. As this configuration seems to be using the five's dac, mqa shouldn't be able. The thing is it doesn't seems to improve a lot using the rca line conection.

I found a real quality difference when I stream tidal to a regular chromcast in my tv, and from it through hdmi to the fives. Boy!! the power in that is a real game changer, also seems to be a most fuller and detailed sound. Even though, i'm not sure mqa is really unfolding this way. 

Any one can share more info about this? 

 

On 1/7/2021 at 11:21 AM, techguy52 said:

If you want MQA support then I would recommend a BlueSound Node 2i.

I'm considering this option, but i'm worry I get the same disapointing output of the fiio dap (it got an impressive mqa support dac set on papper) via rca line. Maybe i'm doing something wrong.

 

Thanks in advance!

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  • 3 weeks later...

If anyone is still interested, I put in contact with klipsch's support team and they told me that the fives do not support MQA in any possible way, even when your source could be able to full decode this files. This would be because any signal feeded to the fives, by any of its inputs, its always processed for the built in DSP/DAC system. It can't be bypassed in any way.

If anyone have different info about it, would be so nice to hear. 

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I don’t have the Fives but I have a high end tube integrated and Forte IVs and I tried MQA streaming thru my Node 2i and could not tell a difference in sound quality of MQA files versus CD quality files. I think MQA is mostly just marketing hype. Most of the music I listen to does not even come in MQA versions. I ended up dropping Tidal and now use Amazon HD and a Denefrips DAC with the Node 2i and it sounds fantastic and more analogue than Tidal sounded thru the Node 2i with its built in MQA capable Dacs.

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1 hour ago, Fido said:

I ended up dropping Tidal and now use Amazon HD and a Denefrips DAC with the Node 2i and it sounds fantastic and more analogue than Tidal sounded thru the Node 2i with its built in MQA capable Dacs

This is a very fair point. I do think we're maybe too obsessed with MQA and get the best out of Tidal, that our gear options begin to be very constrained. Thanks for this advice, and I definitely will taking it into consideration.

Now regarding the fives and Tidal use, the main question of this thread seems to be not a subject at all. Any source you're feeding the fives, or any input you do it throught, the signal will be processed by the internal DSP/DAC built in on it. So, according to what was said by Klipsch's support team, there's no "better way" to use Tidal on this speakers, let alone to unfold MQA files.

You can use chromecast audio, your PC, a dedicated streamer, a cheap or an expensive DAP, or even put a highend DAC in between. Everything will deliver the same sound in the end.

I also got a bluesound node 2i on the way, so i'm kind of disappointed it will make no difference at the final output sound that a crappy device could do. 

 

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13 minutes ago, Fidelio said:

This is a very fair point. I do think we're maybe too obsessed with MQA and get the best out of Tidal, that our gear options begin to be very constrained. Thanks for this advice, and I definitely will taking it into consideration.

Now regarding the fives and Tidal use, the main question of this thread seems to be not a subject at all. Any source you're feeding the fives, or any input you do it throught, the signal will be processed by the internal DSP/DAC built in on it. So, according to what was said by Klipsch's support team, there's no "better way" to use Tidal on this speakers, let alone to unfold MQA files.

You can use chromecast audio, your PC, a dedicated streamer, a cheap or an expensive DAP, or even put a hignend DAC in between. Everything will deliver the same sound in the end.

I also got a bluesound node 2i on the way, so i'm kind of disappointed it will make no difference at the final output that a crappy device could do. 

 

Again Tidal is not the end all for high quality audio streaming. Do the Fives have “no way” to bypass their built in DAC. I have KEF LS 50 wireless speakers with built in dacs and they sound amazing but I don’t know if the dacs can be bypassed 

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2 hours ago, Fido said:

I ended up dropping Tidal and now use Amazon HD and a Denefrips DAC with the Node 2i and it sounds fantastic and more analogue than Tidal sounded thru the Node 2i with its built in MQA capable Dacs.

That's the Denefrips for you.  It's an amazing DAC.

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I'm guessing Klipsch "The Fives" are great sounding powered speakers that are compatible with a variety of sources. My system is designed around analogue and hi-rez digital sources and I use Roon as a hub for the digital sources (Tidal, Amazon HD, Silenzio server, etc.) through a Benchmark DAC 2. To my ears, Tidal and A HD sound almost identical. Side note: Roon's interface is kinda cool in that it let's you know what resolution is sent to the system at any time. Maybe attempting to get "analogue" sound out of powered speakers and digital sources is not an easy task.

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2 hours ago, Fido said:

Do the Fives have “no way” to bypass their built in DAC

It's seems so, even if your feeding in a signal through RCA line input. At least this is what Klipsch's support team told me.

In my case, I do find differences feeding the Fives from the same source throught RCA line input, optical or USB inputs. 

I'm totally newbie in this hobby, but up to now i've found out that "external DACs in powered speakers with DSP" seems to be an open to debate subject, leaning towards "no way to bypass build in DSP/DAC system".

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25 minutes ago, ChrisK said:

Maybe attempting to get "analogue" sound out of powered speakers and digital sources is not an easy task

I totally agree with this. The fives do sound good, but not great out of the box IMO. They need to be improved, adding a sub to clean up the midrange and allow the trebel details to show up. They also need EQ to sound great, as many users has been doing. The difficult to get analog sound as you mentioned, it's another caveat. They do sound kind of metallic sometimes. 

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I've been trying to figure out the DAC bypass question as well. I absolutely agree that an external DAC improves the sound greatly, versus just outputting form my iMac, for example. I thought this more or less proved that the Fives' DAC must be getting bypassed via the analogue inputs. If it isn't, I'd love to know the reason why the sound is so greatly improved since I would think the Fives' DAC would cancel out the external DAC. Is it then that the external DAC is more or less acting like a filter/eq/gain booster or something?

 

I only stumbled across this thread trying to figure out why the Fives weren't playing back MQA. So if it's also true that the Fives' don't allow this (for reasons you cited), this reflects my experience so far as well, where my MQA enabled DAC will play into headphones but not the Fives. The Fives' DAC limitations make a clear explanation as to why, but I'm still curious why we're getting such big gains from including external DACs into the chain. 

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On 5/15/2021 at 11:26 PM, Jetmo said:

where my MQA enabled DAC will play into headphones but not the Fives

This is interesting. How do you know this? did you listen clear difference on the sound or did you messure both?

How external source did or did not affect the Fives sound it's really beyond me. My bluesound 2i finally arrive, so I tested today via optical to the fives and it sound amazing. Although doesn't change much the tonality regarding my former source via RCA (wich lead me think it's the built in DAC working for both), it does make a real change in terms of soundstage. The volume it's also stronger, it's sound more powerful but not only that, the resolution it's way better on higher volume. I could walk arround the house listening really good, with a lot of details, wich it wasn't the case with my former source via RCA (a Fiio M11 pro DAP).

I noted that in Zeos youtube review of the fives, he also used the optical input and his speakers and it sound so amazing, very far from the sound I got out of them at first right out of the box.

I found a this thread where it discussed a similar experience: https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/59238-external-dac-into-powered-speakers/

I'm a total neophyte on the audio world, so a lot of what was said in there its beyond me. But it seems to be that it's not so much the DAC what make the diference, but the filters/gain/EQ as you said. 

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