Heresy II upgrades

[palutena]

Hi everyone, I'm new here and I appreciate any help you guys can provide me. 

I recently emailed Crites and was left more confused than before, and that is the reason for my post. 

 

I am building some cabinets based off the size of the tangent 400's as a covid project with my friend, in order to have a custom look but mainly get more bass out of the drivers in my heresy II's.  

I figured while I have everything apart, I might as well make some upgrades if possible. The capacitors have been updated to new ones but other than that they are stock. 

 

1. what are my options to upgrade the tweeter, the reason I am looking for an upgrade is when running a frequency test the speakers cut off at 13khz, while my headphones cut off at 18khz (or my hearing does). I feel like im missing some top end, would getting titanium diaphragms help this or should I get whole new tweeter (and if so, which ones?) 

 

2. also, what midrange upgrades can I make? I am very interested in the a55g driver, would I be able to put this in without making any changes to the crossover? is there anything else you recommend over the stock drivers?

 

I asked these questions to Crites and was told there is no direct upgrade to the heresy ii tweeters, and that the a55g's would not work. what left me confused is that I've read on these forums multiple times of people upgrading the tweeters so now I am wondering how. also I have seen a user here use the a55g mids, but I do not know if he had to buy another horn or if he had to make crossover changes. 

 

thank you in advance to anyone that can point me in the right direction. 

 

[hanksjim1]

7 minutes ago, palutena said:

when running a frequency test the speakers cut off at 13khz

 

Are the tweeters working?

[palutena]

1 minute ago, hanksjim1 said:

 

Are the tweeters working?

I stuffed the squawkers with a blanket and I can hear sound directly coming from the tweeter (90% sure on this) but its very faint, and when playing music (not a frequency tone from YouTube) there is not much sound coming from them. I took the tweeter out and they read roughly 6.9 ohms on the multimeter 

[OO1]

8 minutes ago, palutena said:

. I took the tweeter out and they read roughly 6.9 ohms on the multimeter 

DCR 6.9 -------they should be very audible ---what -brand-models of tweeters are these --

[palutena]

35 minutes ago, RandyH000 said:

DCR 6.9 -------they should be very audible ---what -brand-models of tweeters are these --

 

they are stock tweeters out of a 1988 heresy ii, I believe they said k76k. 

[OO1]

1 hour ago, palutena said:

 

they are stock tweeters out of a 1988 heresy ii, I believe they said k76k. 

could be something wrong with the connections  or the crossovers  or the wiring or bad contacts 

 

1)-check the wiring  -connectors- 

2)  remove the k76  tweeter horn , separate the magnet from the diaphragm , check the DCR of each  diaphragm again , if the reading is still  6.9 ohms -----rebuild the tweeters and re-test--

[Deang]

All of the replacement tweeters have a sensitivity 6dB higher than the K-76. You can’t use any of them without rebuilding the network. 
 

You can’t use the A-55-G because your horn may be a bolt on, and the A-55-G screws on. I believe there is also a sensitivity mismatch.

 

Double check your work to the schematic on your recap job.

 

As for the frequency response of the tweeters - could you hear 13kHz on your headphones?

 

6.9 ohms sounds about right for an 8 ohm driver. 

[palutena]

2 hours ago, Deang said:

All of the replacement tweeters have a sensitivity 6dB higher than the K-76. You can’t use any of them without rebuilding the network.

thanks for this info, so maybe just the titanium diaphragms from Crites for my tweeters? 

 

2 hours ago, Deang said:

You can’t use the A-55-G because your horn may be a bolt on, and the A-55-G screws on. I believe there is also a sensitivity mismatch.

thanks. if it is not a sensitivity issue I wouldn't mind getting new horns for it since im building the cabinet from scratch. ill try to find some info on it. 

 

2 hours ago, Deang said:

Double check your work to the schematic on your recap job.

 

As for the frequency response of the tweeters - could you hear 13kHz on your headphones?

 

I double checked everything seems fine, all the connections look good. and these speakers had this "problem" since before I updated the crossover. very midrange forward and very light on the bass and tweeter. it sounds like the midrange is 2 times as loud as it needs to be compared to the other drivers. I was hoping upgrading the tweeter and putting the woofer in a bigger ported cabinet would help balance this out a bit. 

 

I could absolutely hear up to 18khz on both headphones I tried on 2 different source videos. I used the same videos and same laptop when I tried it on the heresy's. stops at about 13khz. when I play a 10khz constant tone from YouTube I can put my ear to the tweeter and absolutely hear it very clearly coming from the tweeter, seems like noise is coming through the squawker as well but predominately from the tweeter. 

[palutena]

2 hours ago, RandyH000 said:

could be something wrong with the connections  or the crossovers  or the wiring or bad contacts 

 

1)-check the wiring  -connectors- 

2)  remove the k76  tweeter horn , separate the magnet from the diaphragm , check the DCR of each  diaphragm again , if the reading is still  6.9 ohms -----rebuild the tweeters and re-test--

I will do this again and get back to you, thanks!

[OO1]

12 hours ago, palutena said:

I will do this again and get back to you, thanks!

-normally a  DCR of 6.9 means the diaphragm is not open -

 

questions -

 -- were the tweeters operational  ?

--  did you  modify the crossovers , or upgrade the caps ? 

-   did you check the wiring   /connections -connectors leading to the tweeters  ?

[CWOReilly]

11 hours ago, palutena said:

I stuffed the squawkers with a blanket and I can hear sound directly coming from the tweeter (90% sure on this) but its very faint, and when playing music (not a frequency tone from YouTube) there is not much sound coming from them. I took the tweeter out and they read roughly 6.9 ohms on the multimeter 

 

I had trouble with a tweeter (very low volume) on my HIIs after diaphragms and recap of crossover. Turned out to be something wrong with rest of the crossover. Longer story short I just replaced with Crites complete units.

[Deang]

8 hours ago, palutena said:

very midrange forward and very light on the bass and tweeter. it sounds like the midrange is 2 times as loud as it needs to be compared to the other drivers. I was hoping upgrading the tweeter and putting the woofer in a bigger ported cabinet would help balance this out a bit. 

A common complaint actually. All of these speakers are designed to be in corners to maximize room gain. When you pull them out in the room or on a short wall, they can be a little obnoxious.

 

You may have to use a different woofer to get what you are looking for.

 

@ClaudeJ1

[OO1]

ok -

[OO1]

3 hours ago, CWOReilly said:

 

 Turned out to be something wrong with rest of the crossover-

 that is 1 of the possibilities mentionned to the OP -

[ClaudeJ1]

3 hours ago, Deang said:

A common complaint actually. All of these speakers are designed to be in corners to maximize room gain. When you pull them out in the room or on a short wall, they can be a little obnoxious.

 

You may have to use a different woofer to get what you are looking for.

 

@ClaudeJ1

The best/cheapest "drop in" solution I have simulated is the Dayton PA-310-8, that I'll be using in an upcoming 5 foot tall cabinet, for about 1/2 the price of the Eminence offerings (I'll be using 2 per cab).

 

Since BASS seems to be the problem to solve in this case, this drivers favors the bass when you add the Bass PORT in the rear and don't change the Klipsch/Crites Heresy Crossover. See my Super Heresy 1.0 thread where another Klipschead asked me to model it. It simply WORKS. Also look to what I recommended for FIDO, which is: Port the box, but don't change the network. It's a plus/minus 3 db question that get further modified by room dimensions and placement.

 

But since you are putting it in a larger box, then the port MIGHT need to be different, or NO PORT might be just fine. You can do it all incrementally, one step at a time.

[Marvel]

The Heresy II parts in a SOLID Tangent 400 cabinet should sound excellent, and you don't have to go modifying anything. Even though my HII cabinets are in great shape, I have been really tempted to move all the parts into a freshly built Tangent 400 cabinet. I friend of mine has a pair and they sound very good, with better low end the the HIIs (even though I find the bass just fine on the Heresy IIs)

[ClaudeJ1]

21 minutes ago, Marvel said:

The Heresy II parts in a SOLID Tangent 400 cabinet should sound excellent, and you don't have to go modifying anything. Even though my HII cabinets are in great shape, I have been really tempted to move all the parts into a freshly built Tangent 400 cabinet. I friend of mine has a pair and they sound very good, with better low end the the HIIs (even though I find the bass just fine on the Heresy IIs)

Hence my frequent post amble comment: "You own the salt shaker and the taste buds."

 

[Budman]

5 hours ago, CWOReilly said:

 

 just replaced with Crites complete units.

 

brand new - very smart move. Crites has the best service on the planet

plus you can send them your original set for rebuild       

[jimjimbo]

14 hours ago, palutena said:

RandyH000 said:

 

remove the k76  tweeter horn , separate the magnet from the diaphragm , check the DCR of each  diaphragm again , if the reading is still  6.9 ohms -----rebuild the tweeters and re-test--

 

This is completely unnecessary.    Removing the magnet introduces the possibility of damaging the diaphragm.  Simply measure on the positive and negative terminals of the driver. 

[billybob]

18 hours ago, palutena said:

Hi everyone, I'm new here and I appreciate any help you guys can provide me. 

I recently emailed Crites and was left more confused than before, and that is the reason for my post. 

 

I am building some cabinets based off the size of the tangent 400's as a covid project with my friend, in order to have a custom look but mainly get more bass out of the drivers in my heresy II's.  

I figured while I have everything apart, I might as well make some upgrades if possible. The capacitors have been updated to new ones but other than that they are stock. 

 

1. what are my options to upgrade the tweeter, the reason I am looking for an upgrade is when running a frequency test the speakers cut off at 13khz, while my headphones cut off at 18khz (or my hearing does). I feel like im missing some top end, would getting titanium diaphragms help this or should I get whole new tweeter (and if so, which ones?) 

 

2. also, what midrange upgrades can I make? I am very interested in the a55g driver, would I be able to put this in without making any changes to the crossover? is there anything else you recommend over the stock drivers?

 

I asked these questions to Crites and was told there is no direct upgrade to the heresy ii tweeters, and that the a55g's would not work. what left me confused is that I've read on these forums multiple times of people upgrading the tweeters so now I am wondering how. also I have seen a user here use the a55g mids, but I do not know if he had to buy another horn or if he had to make crossover changes. 

 

thank you in advance to anyone that can point me in the right direction. 

 

Welcome to the forum!