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Klipsch driver specs?


AuralTone
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4 minutes ago, AuralTone said:

Curious if anyone may know of an online resource listing klipsch specs by driver? For example, something that would help see the differences betwen similar drivers like: K-55-V,  K-55-M, K-55-X.

Surely someone has taken a swing at it, right?

Yep, Bob Crites, @ClaudeJ1 and @Dave A for a good start.

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58 minutes ago, AuralTone said:

Curious if anyone may know of an online resource listing klipsch specs by driver? For example, something that would help see the differences betwen similar drivers like: K-55-V,  K-55-M, K-55-X.

Surely someone has taken a swing at it, right?

you forgot the  K51V   ...................first off the Alnico K55X  is the same as the K55V except for solder lugs   , the K55M is a copy of the ferrite  K51V which is itself a Ferrite version of the k55V   and let's  not ignore  the A-55G which is a 12 Ohms copy of the K55M which is a copy of the K51V -  and in the end , guess what ?  , the 1961  ATLAS PD5VH or klipsch K55X will  still be used in the AL5-AK6  in 2022 -

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He sure put a lot of energy into that project for something he didn't think made any difference. K-55-V two piece, to K-51-V ceramic version, and then taking that driver over to Eminence to see if they good make one for less = K-55-M.

 

Most people I know don't have much trouble hearing the difference between the one piece and two piece phase plug versions.

 

 

K-55.jpg

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13 minutes ago, 000 said:

 in the end , guess what ?  , the 1961  ATLAS PD5VH or klipsch K55X will  still be used in the AL5-AK6  in 2022 -

According to Klipsch the k-55x is a "slightly modified" PD5vh with published frequency response 110hz-4.1khz-- probably why they changed the crossover point down to 4500hz.

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24 minutes ago, jjptkd said:

So the terminal connections are the only difference?

Jesse  , they also changed the diaphragm lead wire from flat wire to thin round wire  , you have to be very careful when soldering the new leads of new PD5VH diaphragms-

 

OLD 

k55m5

NEW

image.jpeg.5a776a5bdd63406442ec64d865c2ce10.jpeg

 

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3 hours ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

Based on my tests with all 3, I agree with PWK's quote: there's "not a dime's worth of difference" between them.


Thanks Claude! I'm glad I used that as an example, as it's one that often comes up.  At the moment, I'm thinking in encyclopedic terms. There are a few drivers I've needed to look up, and I find that still, some are tougher than others to nail down details.

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@AuralTone, if and when you come across the specific drivers throw them out on here.

 

There are a lot of members that have resources long gone from any internet searches I can find. And many times the images in this forum have disappeared, I blame the elites, anyone else gets you a slap on the wrist, lol.

 

The tricky part is getting those members to be actually reading the forum when you post.

 

But sometimes another member reading the post remembers which member has the goods and gives them a heads up.

 

Best of luck, and remember, you can’t be the only one who wants to know and the rest of us thank you.

 

 

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9 hours ago, AuralTone said:


Thanks Claude! I'm glad I used that as an example, as it's one that often comes up.  At the moment, I'm thinking in encyclopedic terms. There are a few drivers I've needed to look up, and I find that still, some are tougher than others to nail down details.

There are clear differences in drivers I believe what Claude is referring to in his "not a dimes worth of difference" statement is whether or not you can hear these differences. 

 

The original k-55v is a single phase plug design with the alnico magnet-- these were built pre 1980? Then for a short run a dual phase plug k-55v (soldered lug) driver was introduced '80 through '82? These had slightly extended response up to around 6khz vs the roughly 5khz of the single phase plug version plus I believe slightly lower distortion. The dual phase plug version is considered by many the better driver and typically sought after over the earlier version.

 

Around 1983 the k-55m was introduced it was a ferrite magnet dual phase plug version-- From what I've read replacement diaphragms are not available for this driver and some have claimed they have a higher sensitivity 1.5db or so but this seems to be disputed. These drivers were used until early 2001.

 

The k-55x currently being used was introduced in 2001 and is the single phase plug design.  

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16 hours ago, Deang said:

Most people I know don't have much trouble hearing the difference between the one piece and two piece phase plug versions.

 

I partially disagree with the original curves. I tested actual Production versions (2 vs 2) of dual phase plugs vs singe phase plugs on my Cornwalls. Yes the curves look different but unless you can do an A/B comparison, other than the obvious 9 Khz. anomaly of the single phase plug version, the curves were very similar on the K600 Horns of my Cornwalls. BTW the K600 Horn, mounted on the Cornwall actually rolls off at 500 Hz. However, I never tested them on a K400 horn, but I did own Khorns and LaScalas for over 30 years until I switched to the Pro stuff via MWM and Underground Jubilee-like Clones with K-402's and designed my Quarter Pie horns.

 

Most people here never bother to measure and provide their own data.  It's just emotional, non scientific "impressions" with some useful, but limited validity.

 

Besides, besides measuring stuff requires a lot of WORK, which is not as easy as simply providing yet another OPINION that has much less impact in revealing the truth about Audio performance. But I also must admit, that collectively all those opinions do matter if they all go the same direction over time, aye?

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1 hour ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

Most people here never bother to measure and provide their own data.  It's just emotional, non scientific "impressions" with some useful, but limited validity. But I also must admit, that collectively all those opinions do matter if they all go the same direction over time, aye?

 

It's certainly valid to those who make the claims-- I'm a cheapskate in that if I find a cheaper product sounds the same or better to me I'd be the first to point that out and try and save others some money but I also just don't take people's word for it either even if they post a bunch of fancy graphs or what not I like to hear things first hand with my equipment in my room with my ears. I guess I post my impressions and observations to add to the "collective" but also at the same time encourage everyone to try things out for themselves  when possible.

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25 minutes ago, jjptkd said:

 

It's certainly valid to those who make the claims-- I'm a cheapskate in that if I find a cheaper product sounds the same or better to me I'd be the first to point that out and try and save others some money but I also just don't take people's word for it either even if they post a bunch of fancy graphs or what not I like to hear things first hand with my equipment in my room with my ears. I guess I post my impressions and observations to add to the "collective" but also at the same time encourage everyone to try things out for themselves  when possible.

I was 23 years old when I got my first Khorns (KCBR). They were around $1,800 a pair vs. $3,000 for Walnut Ones (KBWO) which I eventually got used about 20 years ago. I was lucky enough to get the ones made of Baltic Birch after they quit using Fir Plywood. But overall, they sounded the same. Klipsch has always represented a great Sound VALUE for the dollar and the only reason the price number ever went up was to keep up with inflation and less valuable dollars over time, which is happening right now at 3 times the rate it ever did in 2021. So if you look at the price of the new Jubilee, it has more lumber, more drivers, more expensive drivers, a more expensive Treble horn, and, for the first time, Active Electronics require more amplification. However, since Khorns, historically, only needed 10 watt amplifiers to make low distortion reproduction of sound at any level a listener could stand (even listening to Ted Nugent music, which I heard live many times in my Jr. High to College years).

 

Even thought PWK only listened to Symphonic Recordings he made himself (a TRUE PURIST if there ever was one), he certainly practiced what he preached and vice versa.

 

So basically, it's not about being a "cheapskate" it's about not overspending where it doesn't make any sense (like PWK's Khorn beating the pants off the JBL Corner horn for less money)............or like buying some really "pretty" Direct Radiator, High IM Distortion Bookshelf speakers that can be heard at Axpona and owned for a mere $20,000 and touted by SteroPhool Magazine!

 

I'm hoping that Klipsch Marketing got to Chicago in 2022's Axpona with the Jubilee to show those clowns what a real speaker should sound like!

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 12/4/2021 at 10:06 PM, AuralTone said:


Thanks Claude! I'm glad I used that as an example, as it's one that often comes up.  At the moment, I'm thinking in encyclopedic terms. There are a few drivers I've needed to look up, and I find that still, some are tougher than others to nail down details.

The Atlas driver was designed to handle the human Voice, which has a range from 80-1,200 Hz. It was used in a BullHorn. This highest Fundamental frequency of the highest note on a Piccolo is 4 Khz. Anything above that is all Harmonics. It was primarily used in Outdoor Public Address Horns and portable Megaphones with a typical response from 200-3,000 Hz.   The rugged Phenolic Diaphragm is Mass Rolloff, limited so it makes sense to roll off the response with an Inductor to get rid of the resonance that PWK's curve (published in Dope from Hope and posted by Dean) by rolling off it's response at 4,500 Hz. Modern Horn tweeter drivers with metal, mylar, or polypropylene diaphragms can easily get down to 4,000 Hz. so there is no need for dual phase plugs in a driver that simply "runs out of gas" and produce distortion at the high end of their frequency range. It's a good engineering decision and it's cheap enough to do in production. Especially now that the Selling Price of the Products can afford it.

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