KP-302/3002 High Frequency Speaker - Intermittent & Scratchy Sound - Resolved, Bad Cap' Connection

[rszoke]

Hello All - reaching out to the forum wisdom regarding a peculiar situation with a KP-3002 speaker.  I recently picked up a used pair for garage usage and connected to my rebuilt Kenwood KA-9100 amp (via 1/4" mono plug).  One speaker plays perfectly fine - yeah!  The other has intermittent high frequency horn sound (say 80% time no sound) that when is outputting sound - sounds 'scratchy' and with diminished volume. 

 

Time to troubleshoot - here is what i have done:

• have swapped amp-to-speaker cables, no change
• removed & checked HF fuse, no apparent open or burnt fuse
• Ohm'd the original HF diaphragm and find 20-ish Ohms & for good measure, happened to have a spare diaphragm and swapped out, no change
• removed the woofer and while inside, visibly looked over connection wires from 1/4" plug to crossover board to high frequency horn, nothing obviously loose or open connections

 

I'm scratching my head on this and would greatly appreciate any forum ideas. 

• as a check to bypass the speaker plugs section - how about a simple direct wire the amp channel L/R into the crossover L/R?
• perhaps some flaky crossover passive component (everything is original by visual inspection)?
• or ????

 

Thank you very much for your time & feedback!!

 

Best Regards,

Rick

 

[jjptkd]

7 minutes ago, rszoke said:

Hello All - reaching out to the forum wisdom regarding a peculiar situation with a KP-3002 speaker. The other has intermittent high frequency horn sound (say 80% time no sound) that when is outputting sound - sounds 'scratchy' and with diminished volume. 

You're on the right track process of elimination really have you swapped the bad driver into the working cabinet? If it works in there it must be something with the crossover or wiring. 

[OO1]

@rszoke  ,   the issue would primarily look like a)  a faulty crossover or b)  a faulty capacitor or c )  a bad driver  or d)  a bad 1/4 inch socket or e)  bad wiring , now let's try  to isolate the cause of the problem -

 

1)     have you swapped the HF  driver ?  or  the crossovers ?   from 1 speaker to the other - are there any changes ?

2)  -have you tried bypassing the 1/4 inch plug , and wiring it  straight into the crossover  of the faulty speaker ?

[rszoke]

Thank guys for the quick guidance - I will try these tactics tomorrow & report back.  Starting with the easiest first - swap the HF drivers.  Thanks again!!

[Dave A]

Most of the pro gear I have had that had that problem had either loose female spade ends at the driver terminals, loose screws on the barrier strip or worn out banana plugs on the terminal cup. They can get loose enough to give you problems under some conditions.

[rszoke]

Hi All - happy Saturday and thanks for all the guidance!  So after swapping the horns and still having the the HF horn "intermittancy" - I swapped the crossover boards, where when using the known "good board" in the problem speaker - the problem went away.

 

So - problem seems to lie with the crossover board and upon taking a closer inspection - can see something peculiar with the 27uF capacitor.  One of the connector leads was 'broken' and also noted some sort of cheesy solder there - see pics below.  I have no idea what is going on there & what would necessitate such a "repair".

 

So - at this point, I will be placing an order with PartsExpress for some new capacitors (replace all 3 on both boards).  If anyone has recommendations for other source for capacitors, greatly appreciate that.

 

That should solve the issue and I'll be rocking soon - thanks again to this forum!!

 

Aloha,

Rick

[Blvdre]

It looks like the cap lead had broken in the past, dues to stress, and someone tried to solder onto the remaining nub. They also damaged the cap with excess heat. You're doing the right thing by replacing the lot. A few other sources for caps:

 

HiFi Collective

 

Sonicraft

 

Parts Connexion

[OO1]

2 hours ago, rszoke said:

 I swapped the crossover boards, where when using the known "good board" in the problem speaker - the problem went away.

great job -

[rszoke]

Thanks guys and @Blvdre, appreciate those other sites and looks like Parts Connexion will be the way I go for new capacitors. 

 

Thanks again & happy holidays!

[OO1]

37 minutes ago, rszoke said:

 looks like Parts Connexion will be the way I go for new capacitors. 

 

Thanks again & happy holidays!

 there is only 1 klipsch dealer that sells the klipsch original capacitors currently in your crossovers , and it's not Parts Connection -

 

@JEM Performance   https://jemperformanceaudio.com/   

[rszoke]

Thanks Randy - I will follow-up firstly with JEM Performance and see what they have to offer. 

 

Aloha,

Rick

[Dave A]

That's a new one to me. I have had one broken lead on an autoformer and a couple of melted capacitors and resistors that had gotten so hot they charred the board and unsoldered themselves. Never had a cap with a broken lead though.

[jimjimbo]

The Crites family has been providing outstanding customer service and parts to the Klipsch community for many years and should have everything you need.  They are easy to communicate with and will be happy to speak on the phone.

 

Parts Express is another good source as well.  

Both links below.

 

https://critesspeakers.com/crossover_repair_kits.html

 

https://www.parts-express.com/electronic-parts/capacitors

[jjptkd]

10 hours ago, rszoke said:

Thanks guys and @Blvdre, appreciate those other sites and looks like Parts Connexion will be the way I go for new capacitors. 

 

Thanks again & happy holidays!

Glad you were able to get this figured out lots of good advice on where to get caps already here I have personally used Crites almost exclusively in the past but have ordered some parts through Partsexpress as well. In the future may give JEM a try as they are Klipsch recommended. Keep us posted on how things turn out.

[rszoke]

Hi All - hope all is well with everyone!  In the spirit of providing updates to what is now starting to have some drama - spoke today with Jim @ JEM.  Very pleasant conversation where I learned that KP-3002 Professional speakers apparently have some Klipsch spec'd capacitors that are hard to source.  We discussed tackling this from another angle - where paralleling some available Klipsch capacitors to achieve a desired capacitance (e.g. 2x 13uF + 1x 1uF = 27uF).  Then for the 5.6uF Klipsch capacitor - sounds like that one is super hard to source or create via paralleling.  The good news is that at least have a ton of room on the crossover board/inside the speakers should go the paralleling route. 

 

Obviously would be desirable to simply drop in a single Klipsch capacitor, where certainly there are other non-Klipsch choices out there - but understand there is sonic impact, which given the nature of now these KP-3002 speakers are used may not be a big deal - dunno.  I have these in my garage, so not being used as or in any sort of  "acoustic accuracy" setup.  I am thinking to contact Klipsch directly but then again, if Jim/JEM can't get these - then I figure they don't have either. 

 

Pondering on this one - greatly appreciate any thoughts/guidance.  Thanks very much!

[OO1]

On 12/21/2021 at 12:54 AM, rszoke said:

I am thinking to contact Klipsch directly but then again, if Jim/JEM can't get these - then I figure they don't have either.

JEM   Parts  come directly from Klipsch Parts Bins , which mirrors the klipsch inventory -

JEM should be able to contact klipsch and tell you what is the closest capacitor value you can use ,  that klipsch carry in stock   , as well , you may only need to replace the defective capacitor by duplicating the quantity for the 2nd crossover , and therefore  not replacing the capacitors that are not damaged -

[jjptkd]

7 hours ago, rszoke said:

 where paralleling some available Klipsch capacitors to achieve a desired capacitance (e.g. 2x 13uF + 1x 1uF = 27uF).  Then for the 5.6uF Klipsch capacitor - sounds like that one is super hard to source or create via paralleling. 

 

Pondering on this one - greatly appreciate any thoughts/guidance.  Thanks very much!

Doubling or tripling your parts count is going to add up very quickly cost wise I'd do a search on the net for caps yourself save time and money plus fewer connections less chance of future problems such as the one that has already happened to these crossovers.

[jjptkd]

7 hours ago, rszoke said:

 desired capacitance (e.g. 2x 13uF + 1x 1uF = 27uF).  Then for the 5.6uF Klipsch capacitor - sounds like that one is super hard to source

 

Pondering on this one - greatly appreciate any thoughts/guidance.  Thanks very much!

Here's a link to a few options via Partsexpress:

 

https://www.parts-express.com/speaker-components/crossover-components/crossover-capacitors/metalized-polypropylene-crossover-capacitors/capacitance/27-uF,5.6-uF

[jimjimbo]

8 hours ago, rszoke said:

Hi All - hope all is well with everyone!  In the spirit of providing updates to what is now starting to have some drama - spoke today with Jim @ JEM.  Very pleasant conversation where I learned that KP-3002 Professional speakers apparently have some Klipsch spec'd capacitors that are hard to source.  We discussed tackling this from another angle - where paralleling some available Klipsch capacitors to achieve a desired capacitance (e.g. 2x 13uF + 1x 1uF = 27uF).  Then for the 5.6uF Klipsch capacitor - sounds like that one is super hard to source or create via paralleling.  The good news is that at least have a ton of room on the crossover board/inside the speakers should go the paralleling route. 

 

Obviously would be desirable to simply drop in a single Klipsch capacitor, where certainly there are other non-Klipsch choices out there - but understand there is sonic impact, which given the nature of now these KP-3002 speakers are used may not be a big deal - dunno.  I have these in my garage, so not being used as or in any sort of  "acoustic accuracy" setup.  I am thinking to contact Klipsch directly but then again, if Jim/JEM can't get these - then I figure they don't have either. 

 

Pondering on this one - greatly appreciate any thoughts/guidance.  Thanks very much!

Stacking together multiple caps to reach a desired value when there are sources that will provide a much simpler and more cost effective solution is ridiculous.  Here's one that has almost the exact values you need.

 

https://www.soniccraft.com/index.php/sonicap-gen-c-301_49_50

[billybob]

Have to like the idea and build of using less caps to achieve the desired spec.

Less complicated and more straight forward.