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LaScala for this room


svberger

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30 minutes ago, svberger said:

I agree. Thanks.

BTW now after your experiences with the diodes what do you think about testing if the screw in the center of the little cylindric coil on your AA xover reacts to magnetism or not? Do you have a small kitchen magnet or something at hand? If the screw seems to react to the magnet just screw it out and have a listen again🤠 Nothing dangerous will happen as long as you do not move the speaker when the screw is out of place.

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17 minutes ago, KT88 said:

I am very curious about your impressions with the KH. Good that you keep the LS at least for a while before you would make a final decision. Both, LS and KH have their special good sides, mainly deep full room filling controlled bass vs. the very good connection to the midrange horn.

Won't even know for another week if I'll have the opportunity but ever since my good fortune with the LS's I've started to fantasize a bit about KH's. I've moved a couple things around today to give the LS's even more breathing room, and I think that there's enough space to at least give the KH's a try before making a decision.

 

And yes, no matter what happens the LS's will be staying. I have yet to own any speaker that I've enjoyed more, and because of your wonderful advice re: the diodes they have become even more then they were when I first got them. They are perfect in every way and therefore the KH's would have to be even better for me to replace the LS's with them in the main system.

 

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18 minutes ago, KT88 said:

BTW now after your experiences with the diodes what do you think about testing if the screw in the center of the little cylindric coil on your AA xover reacts to magnetism or not? Do you have a small kitchen magnet or something at hand? If the screw seems to react to the magnet just screw it out and have a listen again🤠 Nothing dangerous will happen as long as you do not move the speaker when the screw is out of place.

I did and as far as I can tell they are not magnetic. I don't have a magnet, per se, but I do have magnetic screwdrivers and they did not stick to them, so I'm assuming they are not magnetic.

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57 minutes ago, svberger said:

I agree. Thanks.

 

Wow, you are moving very quickly down the rabbit hole!

 

 

K Horns are not as easy to place as other speakers and need some additional planning.

 

K Horns will dictate your seat position as the drivers are fixed at 45 degrees from the corners. 

 

Be sure you are far enough away for the horns to come together. 

 

You also need to put backs on them or build one side of a false corner because of the windows behind the speakers.  Curtains will need to go or be pushed against the wall  / window. 

 

 

 

 

 

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7 minutes ago, tigerwoodKhorns said:

 

Wow, you are moving very quickly down the rabbit hole!

 

 

K Horns are not as easy to place as other speakers and need some additional planning.

 

K Horns will dictate your seat position as the drivers are fixed at 45 degrees from the corners. 

 

Be sure you are far enough away for the horns to come together. 

 

You also need to put backs on them or build one side of a false corner because of the windows behind the speakers.  Curtains will need to go or be pushed against the wall  / window. 

 

 

 

 

 

Tom will it not work if the bass is in the corner as it should but angle the high freq. section a bit out? Sorry I have not much experience with KH, may be this could weaken the sound because of destroying the coherence of radiated waves as a whole if it is not put in the same direction?

I am just asking because my LS works best if only toed in a bit.

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First order of business is to get the bass bin tight in a corner. 

 

1) if the aim of the top hat is too forward (in front of the listener), that is actually okay (within reason). In fact this was a trick that PWK advocated in the Dope From Hope as a way of creating a larger or more stable sweet spot.

 

 2) If you want to aim the top hat directly at the listener. It can be done with a slight amount of woodworking. Someone did this and documented the procedure about ten years ago. (Note: when I say ten it may have been closer to 15 - due to my aging brain). This modification has a tolerable but slightly odd look. Maybe someone else can remember who did this -it was one of the regulars. Part of this depends on whether you are getting a type C cabinet (no collar under the top hat) or a type B cabinet (collar and also a toe kick molding). 

 

Good luck,

-Tom

 

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51 minutes ago, tigerwoodKhorns said:

 

Wow, you are moving very quickly down the rabbit hole!

 

 

K Horns are not as easy to place as other speakers and need some additional planning.

 

K Horns will dictate your seat position as the drivers are fixed at 45 degrees from the corners. 

 

Be sure you are far enough away for the horns to come together. 

 

You also need to put backs on them or build one side of a false corner because of the windows behind the speakers.  Curtains will need to go or be pushed against the wall  / window. 

 

 

 

 

 

No rabbit hole really. Not going to go out of my way to get Khorns. I might(operative word at the moment) have an opportunity to at least try them. 

 

As for placement, I was told that the LS's were more difficult then the Cornwall's to place, but that hasn't been my experience. I've watched some videos and seen some pictures of Khorns in rooms that I consider not as potentially adequate as my space is that seem to do just fine with them anyway. As you can see from my last picture, there would seem to be a good area for them where the LS"s are now. Bigger, sure, but more or less the same area.

 

As I indicated my room is what it is, and either they'll come together enough for my enjoyment or they won't All of my speakers have had to deal with the windows and curtains behind them, and it's never been an issue for my listening needs. Neither has the wood floor, nor any other issue that might be problematic for others. Does it sound good to my ears or not? That's all that's important.

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IMHO, that room is too narrow to get the best out of khorns. I know a lot of people here will say otherwise. I’m not saying they won’t sound good, because they probably will. But you won’t hear all they can do. Can you even get them tight into the corners with those two windows.

 

Another thought is it’s a lot of trouble to move those in just to try them.

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4 minutes ago, Shakeydeal said:

IMHO, that room is too narrow to get the best out of khorns. I know a lot of people here will say otherwise. I’m not saying they won’t sound good, because they probably will. But you won’t hear all they can do. Can you even get them tight into the corners with those two windows.

 

Another thought is it’s a lot of trouble to move those in just to try them.

To me svbergers room does not look too narrow to try KH, and as he says if it is good to his ears then it is good. To transport the KH there are rolling carts and good friends.

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3 minutes ago, Shakeydeal said:

IMHO, that room is too narrow to get the best out of khorns. I know a lot of people here will say otherwise. I’m not saying they won’t sound good, because they probably will. But you won’t hear all they can do. Can you even get them tight into the corners with those two windows.

 

Another thought is it’s a lot of trouble to move those in just to try them.

Good points, but the same could probably be said(and I think has in the past) for both the Cornwall's and LS's. Not to mention a lot of other gear I have, or have had. Either the room isn't big enough, or I have not done taken enough acoustic measures, or the turntable shouldn't be sitting on a glass cabinet, etc etc. This is not to dismiss these comments, nor yours, but rather again to remind that what might not suit others could, and in many cases over the years, has me. Which is is why the opportunity to try stuff out and not simply accept the experiences of others is how I try to approach things when it comes to introducing new gear.  

 

Nothing is perfect. But then again, I don't expect nor pursue perfection. I simply want gear that makes me happy. The Khorns would reside where the LS's are now. That is as close to corners as I can get them. If they sound good, if they sound better to my ears then the LS's do now, then I'm pretty sure I will take them because the idea of owning them frankly thrills me. So my litmus test is easy. Everything could be better. According to a lot of folks I should not be using the LS's completely stock. The caps should be changed out, at the very least. A lot of folks can't believe I, or anybody else for that matter, even LIKES LS's. Or Klipsch speakers in general. A lot of folks couldn't understand my passion for legacy AR speakers either. Again, all ok for others to have this opinion, but at the end of the day it will come down to my own enjoyment.

 

That said, I appreciate yours, and everybody else's opinion. If I didn't, I wouldn't start these threads to begin with.

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Can't get them tighter then how you see the LS's now. That's it.

 

I'm not in the custom of moving speakers around much, if at all, once they are placed. As for moving my chair, it's a couch. I can slide it back and forth and to the sides some, and I can sit in different areas on it. I just don't think it will make much of a difference.

 

Anyway, let me try them out(assuming they become available) and if that happens, I'll then report back. Like I indicated, I won't take them if they can't give me something that I like more then the LS's. It's not like I'll be sorry if there's no point and I'm left with the LS's.

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Two things going on here.

 

Yes it will make a big difference where you sit. It always does with any speaker, but now you will with be sitting way off axis or on top of them.

 

But most importantly, if you can’t get that seal in the corner, and it sounds like you can’t, you are leaving a lot on the table. I tried bringing my khorns out just enough so I could toe them in towards the listening seat and lost almost an octave of bass. Failed experiment, back in the corners.

 

So try them for sure. But it doesn’t sound like a good fit to me. Good luck.

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1 hour ago, svberger said:

As I indicated my room is what it is, and either they'll come together enough for my enjoyment or they won't All of my speakers have had to deal with the windows and curtains behind them, and it's never been an issue for my listening needs.

 

With respect to the windows and curtains, you might find that K horns are different than other speakers.

 

Give them a try.  I have use them without full corners, but had to modify. 

 

You might have a different experience.  Fun journey is all that matters. 

 

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The major reason I still have La Scala's is the room.

 

I have heard K-horns both done properly in a proper room and I have heard them with people that have a not so ideal room for them and tried making it work. They were happy with the sound and I didn't want to be negative but they didn't sound as they should have. I knew then that unless I have an ideal room with corners without windows near by where the ideal sweet spot can fit a nice comfy couch I won't get K-horns.

 

It's still a goal of mine, I want to die with k-horns so I will get there but for now my La Scala's are more than sufficient for amazing sound. I do have a 2.1 system with a sub-woofer.

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51 minutes ago, tigerwoodKhorns said:

 

With respect to the windows and curtains, you might find that K horns are different than other speakers.

 

Give them a try.  I have use them without full corners, but had to modify. 

 

You might have a different experience.  Fun journey is all that matters. 

 

You're right. I  might. Thanks.

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6 minutes ago, captainbeefheart said:

It's still a goal of mine, I want to die with k-horns so I will get there but for now my La Scala's are more than sufficient for amazing sound. I do have a 2.1 system with a sub-woofer.

 

I was curious what sub do you have with the LaScalas?

 

Thanks

Rich

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8 minutes ago, captainbeefheart said:

The major reason I still have La Scala's is the room.

 

I have heard K-horns both done properly in a proper room and I have heard them with people that have a not so ideal room for them and tried making it work. They were happy with the sound and I didn't want to be negative but they didn't sound as they should have. I knew then that unless I have an ideal room with corners without windows near by where the ideal sweet spot can fit a nice comfy couch I won't get K-horns.

 

It's still a goal of mine, I want to die with k-horns so I will get there but for now my La Scala's are more than sufficient for amazing sound. I do have a 2.1 system with a sub-woofer.

Yeah I'm lucky I guess. I've never heard the Khorns in any room. But then again, I never heard the LS's before I got them. But according to a bunch of people, I could hear them be a lot better if I did _________________ (fill in the blank).

 

Or better yet, get rid of them and get a decent pair of speakers.

 

Lots of other things I could do to improve my current set up as well, according to lots of other people. I won't bore you with details.

 

""Half of the people can be part right all of the time Some of the people can be all right part of the time But all of the people can’t be all right all of the time I think Abraham Lincoln said that..."😉

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I look at this thread and it just reinforces my opinion about the "original Jubilees - home version".

 

These are sometimes called the "rogue" speakers, more recently they are called the "underground" Jubilees. Basically, the (original) Jubilee bass bin with a K-402 horn (if space/money  is tight then substitute a K-510 horn). These cabinets would work in so many implementations. They do do not need to be tight in a corner, you are free to toe them in. They have a great spectral response, great efficiency, you name and they got it.

 

They sound good !!!!! I know since I have owned them (I have also owned and enjoyed K-Horns, La Scalas, Cornwalls, etc). 

 

They were affordable but not high on the cosmetic issues, but .......

 

Well, they are gone. You cannot get them any more. They had retailed for about $7 - 8k and they were a great deal. They are gone and replaced with something that costs about 5 times more. I am sure the replacement version sounds wonderful (even if the cosmetics are questionable (IMHO)). But they are so expensive and out of reach for many. 

 

I look at the comments in this thread (plans and implementation issues etc) and I can't help but think "You know the original Jubilees would work great in this situation".

 

I am sure that Jubilee owners are nodding their heads in agreement.

-Tom

 

 

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