Wow. For now, my Forte III win over Altec M19

[Rotobadger]

I went through great pains to obtain a very nice pair of Altec Model 19s. First thing I did was a full recap. 
 

So, I’ve been trying speaker placement, different amps (tube and SS) and acoustic treatment. The Altecs are fantastic sounding…

 

BUT…I’ve made a huge effort to make myself love the 19s more than my Forte III. I have them set up for easy A/B auditioning. 
 

For me the Forte III win. They are more forward, detailed and, most of all, cohesive. 
 

I’ve read the 19s are the pinnacle of speaker quality but I have to remind myself the Forte III are modern $4k speakers (msrp). They are REALLY good. 
 

I’ve owned and compared dozens of speakers and the FIII are the best I’ve ever owned. 
 

Am I crazy?  Am I missing something with the Altecs?  It COULD be the room and placement but, as I said, I’ve done a lot of experimentation (not easy with 150 pound speakers!). 
 

Damn. I just love the Forte III. A lot.  They image and have incredible intimacy the Altecs seem to lack.
 

I’m listening to the F III now. Just magic.  
 

 

 

 

[Shakeydeal]

Go with your gut. Sometimes things aren't what we expect in this hobby.

 

 

[Rotobadger]

2 hours ago, Shakeydeal said:

Go with your gut. Sometimes things aren't what we expect in this hobby.

 

 

I think that’s good advice. I’m leaning towards doing just that, which would mean sticking with the Forte III. 

I thought “If someone put a gun to my head and said ‘one pair of speakers has to go now’ I’d have to say goodbye to the Altecs”. 
 

Not quite ready to give up on them just yet though. The do have a much larger and “open” sound than the Forte.

 

Maybe I should go audition a pair of Cornwall IV?

[Shakeydeal]

Quote

Maybe I should go audition a pair of Cornwall IV?

 

I think that's an excellent idea.

[Toz]

I can only compare other speakers to my Klipschorns and Cornwalls.  Altec Model 19's are the only speakers I liked as much. I like the JBL and Altec drivers a lot! It just seems that Klipsch is better at implementation so you end up with a great sounding system to my ear anyway.

[Rotobadger]

36 minutes ago, Toz said:

I can only compare other speakers to my Klipschorns and Cornwalls.  Altec Model 19's are the only speakers I liked as much. I like the JBL and Altec drivers a lot! It just seems that Klipsch is better at implementation so you end up with a great sounding system to my ear anyway.

See, that seems to be the consensus on the Altec 19. 
 

I’ve also had other people sit and pick which speaker sounded better. I just said “A or B” as I switched. 
 

My daughter’s friend liked the Forte more because they sounded “together” and not “separate” like the Altecs. 
 

My wife liked the Forte III because she felt the Altecs sounded “blurry”. 

 

To me, in my mind, this translates to sound smearing and/or resonance from the Altecs. I may try a temporary test of dampening the horns to see if that helps. 
 

Again, I WANT to like the Altecs more but the Fortes just sound better. If I could make the Forte sound as big as the Altecs…

 

And the only Klipsch Heritage dealer in town has every model on demo EXCEPT the Cornwall III or IV. 
 

 

[Shakeydeal]

Forget about the III, go straight to the IV.

[Rotobadger]

10 minutes ago, Shakeydeal said:

Forget about the III, go straight to the IV.

Well, I already own the III. I’ve got them hooked up to compare with the Altecs. 
 

EDIT: Oops. Were you referring to the Cornwall?  If so, I totally agree. I’d just go IV. 

Edited January 26, 2022 by Rotobadger

[Shakeydeal]

Yes I was talking about the Cornwall.

 

FWIW I owned the Forte III and the Cornwall IV. As much as I liked the Fortes, the Cornwalls are head and shoulders above. You can't go wrong there.

 

 

[Rotobadger]

6 minutes ago, Shakeydeal said:

Yes I was talking about the Cornwall.

 

FWIW I owned the Forte III and the Cornwall IV. As much as I liked the Fortes, the Cornwalls are head and shoulders above. You can't go wrong there.

 

 

Good to know. My hope is that Corn IV will be everything the Forte III are but with a bigger sound and stage. 

[DavidF]

A jump ahead to the conclusion may be that the smaller format Forte just works best in the room. A long time ago I heard the JBL L300 in both a smallish living room and again in a large room not long after. At that time and with that speaker model, the larger room made a big difference (for the better) in the cohesion of the sound and soundstage around the speakers. Listening distance was several feet further away. Ditto for the distance to room boundaries around the systems. 

[tigerwoodKhorns]

15 minutes ago, DavidF said:

A jump ahead to the conclusion may be that the smaller format Forte just works best in the room. A long time ago I heard the JBL L300 in both a smallish living room and again in a large room not long after. At that time and with that speaker model, the larger room made a big difference (for the better) in the cohesion of the sound and soundstage around the speakers. Listening distance was several feet further away. Ditto for the distance to room boundaries around the systems. 

 

From another thread here, I think that this guy is spot on.  Forte's would be good for a half bathroom??

 

 

 

 

[Rotobadger]

3 hours ago, DavidF said:

A jump ahead to the conclusion may be that the smaller format Forte just works best in the room. A long time ago I heard the JBL L300 in both a smallish living room and again in a large room not long after. At that time and with that speaker model, the larger room made a big difference (for the better) in the cohesion of the sound and soundstage around the speakers. Listening distance was several feet further away. Ditto for the distance to room boundaries around the systems. 

Absolutely. The room I’m in is a bit odd. It’s actually our dining room which my wife graciously allowed me to convert into a listening area (complete with an Eames chair I got for Christmas!).  
 

The room is somewhat narrow and puts the 19s about 7 feet apart (measured from center of speaker to center of speaker). 
 

The ceiling is sloped upwards and opens into our fairly large formal living room with ceilings that reach around 12-13 feet. 
 

I’m feeling like the walls on either side of the 19s is constricting the sound and causing audio smearing and some unnatural resonance.  The room is very live as well. I’ve bought some acoustic panels and will be adding more but there’s not much I can do with the large open space directly behind me when facing the speakers. 
 

I’m considering selling the 19s and going with the Forte’s and maybe testing some Cornwalls. However, although not perfect, they are in beautiful shape and are still outstanding speakers. Just may need a room better suited for them. 
 

So, if I don’t sell I’ll just park them for the time being. I don’t want to end up with seller’s regret but, at the same time, feel it’s a shame to let them languish. 
 

I have an extended business trip coming up so I’ll ponder for awhile. 
 

Attached pics show area. Room is not complete yet tho. 
 

Thanks for reading and thanks for the helpful comments from all!

[CWelsh]

If you really like the sound of the Fortes and feel the smaller size may be more suited to your room, you might want to keep an eye on the Forte lll Upgrade thread. The most recent comments from Paducah Home Theater give some insight into the differences between the lll and lV versions. While there isn't an official upgrade kit yet, maybe it isn't too far away.

 

https://community.klipsch.com/index.php?/topic/205630-wow-for-now-my-forte-iii-win-over-altec-m19/

 

[jason str]

You can use something to keep reflections from bouncing off the wall on the right side there.

[Rotobadger]

5 hours ago, CWelsh said:

If you really like the sound of the Fortes and feel the smaller size may be more suited to your room, you might want to keep an eye on the Forte lll Upgrade thread. The most recent comments from Paducah Home Theater give some insight into the differences between the lll and lV versions. While there isn't an official upgrade kit yet, maybe it isn't too far away.

 

https://community.klipsch.com/index.php?/topic/205630-wow-for-now-my-forte-iii-win-over-altec-m19/

 

I’ll take a look. I’m pretty happy with the sound of the III but, to be fair, have not really given the IV a listen. 
 

The local heritage dealer has been pretty friendly and has spent some time with me so I could audition the La Scala and the K-Horn (even though I made it clear brand new K-Horns we’re WAY out of my budget). 
 

Interestingly, when I asked him if they still sold the Forte III he said they did. He said, surprisingly, some customers preferred the III over the IV and bought them instead. So, he really wasn’t pushing the IV on me knowing I had the III. 
 

But, take with a grain of salt and all that…

[CWelsh]

16 minutes ago, Rotobadger said:

I’ll take a look. I’m pretty happy with the sound of the III but, to be fair, have not really given the IV a listen. 
 

The local heritage dealer has been pretty friendly and has spent some time with me so I could audition the La Scala and the K-Horn (even though I made it clear brand new K-Horns we’re WAY out of my budget). 
 

Interestingly, when I asked him if they still sold the Forte III he said they did. He said, surprisingly, some customers preferred the III over the IV and bought them instead. So, he really wasn’t pushing the IV on me knowing I had the III. 
 

But, take with a grain of salt and all that…

I bought a pair of llls back in November from a dealer who wanted to make way for the lVs. I felt the price difference was significant and loved the sound of the llls, so I jumped at it. At some point, I may want to go the upgrade path, but for the foreseeable future, I'm just going to enjoy my llls.

[Islander]

When you’re at a crossroads like that, the best thing to do may be to stop and think before buying or selling anything.  Do some more research, even if you have to travel a bit to hear the speakers you’re interested in.  My favourite speakers are modded La Scala IIs with a pair of subwoofers.

 

Believe it or not, the least expensive way to own speakers is to decide on the ones that you really really want, start saving, and then buy them.  That way, you don’t go through years of buying and selling speakers, likely losing money on every one, due to depreciation.  As well, you’ll get your dream speakers sooner and have more years to enjoy them.

[Mark in PA]

Those Altec Model 19s look nice, but I do dig the Forte IV. I heard the III's and aside from the plinth I like the IV's a bit better, albeit the midrange seems a bit recessed - depending on front wall placement, I think. In the store I heard them in two different setups: about 6" from the wall and 31" from the wall. At 6" the bass was nice but the midrange seemed recessed, at 31" there was little bass but the midrange opened up but yet seemed to be too midrange focused. 

In these rooms the floor was hard wood or concrete, I can't recall but it had a very thin carpeted. I think I will get a much better result in my home with paneled walls and thick carpeting and a low 68" ceiling. I have a feeling if I follow the Klipsch suggestion of moving these out from the wall between 2" to 10" I should be just fine...in theory.

 

Off the subject, I am still torn between getting the KLH Model 5 or the Forte IV. I know, they are two different beasts. But based solely on budget I am more confident in the KLH, but I will have to dish some doe into a decent integrated to power them, like the Atoll IN 200. I have a vintage Mitsubishi DAA15DC and DAP10 dual mono amp/dual mono preamp combo that would be fantastic w/ the Forte IV but I may run into problems pairing it up to the KLH Model 5 because of it's low minimum impedance of 3.5 ohms. Yeah so it's either upgrade to a better front gear and a lesser priced speaker, or get the Forte IV and pair it up with my vintage gear and run a Bluesound Node with it while ultimately seeking a phono or CD player later down the line.

 

 

[Mark in PA]

On 1/26/2022 at 12:13 PM, Toz said:

I can only compare other speakers to my Klipschorns and Cornwalls.  Altec Model 19's are the only speakers I liked as much. I like the JBL and Altec drivers a lot! It just seems that Klipsch is better at implementation so you end up with a great sounding system to my ear anyway.

I can not afford your Klipschorns or Cornwalls. If I see the Cornwalls on sale for half off, sure, and I see them hitting this selling point on the used market now and then from private owners but most require local pickup and are usually out of my state. So in the meantime, I am eyeballing the Forte IV. I like them. I should go with my instinct and get them, but I am often swayed from anti-Klipsch supporters (especially store owners) who's argument always seems to be: they are bright, non-resolving, poor at imaging, and sloppy at cohesiveness. Sure they may be at some of these things but that is what is expected when I place more emphasis on high sensitivity speakers, still I like them and I am willing to sacrifice "sound quality/audiophile sound quality" for "that" sound. But I do have to say in closing that in today's Klipsch Heritage (Forte IV speaking) I hear no brightness, like the ear shattering type I hear on Monitor Audio and Focal. Sorry for the rant. I am just trying to get some clarification for my feelings. Thanks