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Why buy a Mc 275 when you can have one of these!


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Wow!  And free shipping! AND there is an upgraded model for merely $200 more!

 

"If the huge thrust is powerful and demeanor, but it still retains the smooth texture of a vacuum tube machine, it has an open and wide sound field, listening to the large-scale orchestral music is especially wonderful, you can easily feel the hierarchical voices, the undulating dynamics in the music Thick and full sound bottom, rich and strong low frequency, near music is full of power and vitality."

 

Count me in!

 

image.thumb.png.b11dff42580a42e21f2bb77b0a5f6de0.png

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/125144938242?_trkparms=amclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D1110006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D238113%26meid%3D78468de3dd7f4be099d14db4849ee135%26pid%3D101113%26rk%3D12%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D185369394039%26itm%3D125144938242%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2563228%26algv%3DDefaultOrganicWeb%26brand%3DUnbranded&_trksid=p2563228.c101113.m2108

 

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On 4/9/2022 at 4:11 PM, michaelwjones said:

Wow!  And free shipping

 

   a clone  of the MC 275,      On Ebay the name is changed otherwise , they cant list it  ,    but on Alibaba ,  it's a Twin

 

2022 NEW 1:1 clone MC275 Mcintosh classic HIFI tube post power amplifier 75W,Harmonic  distortion: 0.5%|Amplifier| - AliExpress

 

 

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14 hours ago, RandyH said:

   a clone  of the MC 275...

What's interesting is there is no reason it cannot sound 99% (or more) of a Mc 275. The schematics and parts are widely available and if one was determined, the transformers could be duplicated as well. I just don't have an extra $2750 to find out. Plus if I liked gold trim, I'd have had a Manley for the last 25 years or bought that JPS Lotus Europa 50 years ago.
Just sayin'.

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  • michaelwjones changed the title to Why buy a Mc 275 when you can have one of these!
2 hours ago, michaelwjones said:

What's interesting is there is no reason it cannot sound 99% (or more) of a Mc 275. The schematics and parts are widely available and if one was determined, the transformers could be duplicated as well.
Just sayin'.

I guess someone should buy this amp , then  place it next to a real  MC 275 and see if they are identical

 

 

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31 minutes ago, RandyH said:

\ll potential knockoffs are subject to an inspection  at a US Port of Entry  ,  the MC275 is a Classic . if  these goods are allowed entry  , means it's not a  true knockoff..

or they are part of the 99% of packages and containers not inspected upon entry.

 

But that is not where I was going; I said the circuitry and parts are readily available. And while copyrights are no my area of expertise, I doubt the circuitry is so unique as to have a copyright or a patent. Its always been my understanding the transformers are key to a Mc. But again, I doubt they are patented or copyrighted.

 

Now the visual image of the amp may be subject to trade or service mark and I think that could lead to problems or a claim of counterfeiting, so I'd make it look like something else, the ubiquitous box (or a carver 275 :-0 ). The idea is to duplicate how it sounds, not to make a copy.

 

And as a real world example, there has not been a real Lotus Seven made in 50 plus years, but I can buy updated duplicates & copies all day long. The body mold for Intermechanica Porsche speedster kit was made from a Porsche Speedster body. So long as you don't say this is a Mc 275, you're "golden..." so to speak. 

 

As Cadillac used in advertising in the teens (the nineteens that is), imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

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It’s more important for these Chinese clones to look the part. Sound is an afterthought. The target demographic will likely have no idea that it doesn’t actually sound like a McIntosh amp. My $$ is on the fact that it sounds nothing like a Mac. Depending on who you are, that’s either a good or a bad thing…😆

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The Chinese (some) are like Trelain from Star Trek In "The Squire of Gothos". Trelain was looking at Earth, but the Earth of the past. He didn't realize that what he was "seeing" was not the present Earth. Anyway, Trelain recreated everything period correct, but the food had no taste and the wine no flavor. 

 

The Chinese usually do the same thing, it looks good until you look behind the curtain.

 

I was in a meeting once, with some Chinese fellows, we got on the subject of the Chinese stealing US military secrets and the Chinese guys said the "Chinese" were smart because if you could steal what you didn't have and learn from it and save time and money, that that was smart. 

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4 hours ago, michaelwjones said:

or they are part of the 99% of packages and containers not inspected upon entry.

they've been around  since 2010  , with the brand ..... McInlosh

2022 NEW 1:1 clone MC275 Mcintosh classic HIFI tube post power amplifier 75W,Harmonic  distortion: 0.5%|Amplifier| - AliExpress

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No one has transformers like McIntosh does. They are considered the best of the best but Mc amplifiers are real pricy desirably so. I like Chinese offerings in tube amplifiers but I would be reluctant to pay the offering price of the Mc clone. Seems to be one would be paying extra of the Mc look. There are other Chinese PP tube amplifiers that have excellent reviews for less money than the price of this one. This is not to say it may sound great but it is not going to be a Mc 275 just because it may look like one. 

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Quick answer would be to do a null test vs a real MC275, but I doubt anyone is going purchase one of these just to test that.

 

As for the McIntosh output transformers they aren't impervious to cloning, the Chinese have been reverse engineering US technology much more complex than an output transformer. As long as they are willing to dissect a real one carefully and honestly they probably don't even have to do that to get a close enough approximation. It's no secret how the unity coupled circuit works, in short the loading is distributed between plate and cathode, this reduces the winding ratio (hence why the output stage has very little gain) which greatly reduces leakage inductance and shunt capacitance, using bifilar winding technique the leakage inductance between primary sections is practically eliminated. These are the key takeaway points for winding goals. So just knowing how it functions allows someone to get darn close empirically without even having a real one in hand to unwind.

 

Is this ethical or legal? Depends on if the patent is in public domain or not. Even if the patent isn't up I'm sure you can get around it by changing some non-critical values of parts here and there that doesn't effect the performance.

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12 hours ago, mike stehr said:

Wow; that is fascinating reading. I don't think I'd replace the logo with McIntosh, though. Maybe "Porsche" to really confuse people...

Hopefully someone will send one over to ASR for review & testing.

Can't wait for the review on the C-22.

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  • 4 weeks later...
On 4/11/2022 at 12:01 PM, captainbeefheart said:

Gordon Gow explains why they came up with the Unity Coupled output transformer design for anyone mystified by it's function. Now you know how the McIntosh circuit is allowed to run so cold without crossover distortion at the output:D

 

The Unity Coupled, Balanced Differential Feed Transformer was a very clever invention way back then. Do you know if these are more commonly built and utilized in other modern amplifiers?

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On 4/10/2022 at 5:40 PM, Curious_George said:

 

I was in a meeting once, with some Chinese fellows, we got on the subject of the Chinese stealing US military secrets and the Chinese guys said the "Chinese" were smart because if you could steal what you didn't have and learn from it and save time and money, that that was smart. 

…..thats odd, I would call it thievery and nothing to be proud of. 
(wow)

Carry on with Audio…😁

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1 hour ago, PatP said:

…..thats odd, I would call it thievery and nothing to be proud of. 
(wow)

Carry on with Audio…😁

Not to stereo type, but over 20 years of dealing with Chinese vendors, they are (almost) all the same. They have a unique way of looking at the world and their government. Even the ones who came here very young and can call themselves US citizens seem to have a strange calling to support China in some way. 

 

I'll leave it there for now, but do some research and reach your own conclusions. 

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