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Higher current/power amplifier with Klipschorns. What do yo use?


Khorn

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After 40+ years of using the same Klipschorns in my main system with many kinds and types of amplification I find my recent total amplification change to a  new tube pre and powerful SS amplifier has given me the best results I’ve ever had and by a substantial margin. 
Anyone else here found that a similar setup suits their preferences?

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22 hours ago, Khorn said:

After 40+ years of using the same Klipschorns in my main system with many kinds and types of amplification I find my recent total amplification change to a  new tube pre and powerful SS amplifier has given me the best results I’ve ever had and by a substantial margin. 
Anyone else here found that a similar setup suits their preferences?

 

What are the details on the new Pre (what tubes) and Amp? 

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38 minutes ago, Gypsy said:

 

What are the details on the new Pre (what tubes) and Amp? 
 

Amp is not very well known here  the Alluxity Power One stereo amplifier. Extremely good. 
 

The preamp is the ModWright LS100. 
Tubes are a prerelease evaluation of new USA production 6SN7 due for release later this year. 

 

 

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1 minute ago, Khorn said:
50 minutes ago, Gypsy said:

 

What are the details on the new Pre (what tubes) and Amp? 
 

 

Amp is not very well known here  the Alluxity Power One stereo amplifier. Extremely good. 
 

The preamp is the ModWright LS100. 
Tubes are a prerelease evaluation of new USA production 6SN7 due for release later this year. 

 

 

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My 1974 La Scalas were 32 years old when I bought them, and for a year I powered them with a 100 Wpc Yamaha AVR.  The next year, I just used its pre-amp, feeding a Yamaha MX-D1 500 Wpc dual-mono power amp.  By that point, I’d replaced the K-77 tweeters with Crites CT125 tweeters, which have a higher power rating than the K-77s.  That power amp really improved the sound, and added improved clarity all the way to the back of the soundstage, as well as more authoritative and lifelike bass response.  The year after that, 2008, I converted them from 3-way to 2-way, and bi-amped them with a pair of matching Yamaha 500 Wpc amplifiers.  The La Scalas worked great in all configurations.

 

Based on reports from other Forum members, who have used amplifiers as small as 5 Wpc, as well as my own experience, I conclude that La Scalas work fine when powered with anything from 5 watts per channel to 500 watts per channel.

 

In 2013, I replaced the La Scalas with La Scala IIs, and returned the original La Scalas to their stock 3-way configuration.  They’re now operating as Surround speakers, powered by a 140 Wpc Yamaha AVR.  The big Jubilee tweeters, with 50 watt rated drivers, were moved from the La Scalas to the La Scala IIs, which were then driven by the pair of 500 Wpc power amps.

 

Everything is still working great today.  I should point out that I rarely listen at very high volume, other than to Pink Floyd sometimes.  Years ago, I did listen a few times at full concert volume for no more than an LP side (not just to PF), and in my normal-sized living room (18’x19’), high volume never needed very high power, unlike if they were outside, for example.  That said, those amplifiers make sure there’s lots of headroom, so the dynamic range approaches that of live performances.

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The notion of needing lot's of power with Klipsch is BS. Continuation of the power wars started in the 70's. I am sure this is going to start a lively conversation with lots of disagreement but the more knowledgeable members know the truth.

 

Lots of watts with our speakers is like the little old lady in a Ferrari that never drives over 55mph. Nothing wrong with it but wasted dollars and power.  Anyone smart enough to say different should be smart enough to measure the average power they are truly using a multimeter and ohms law at the loudest level they listen at. 

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I’d rather have more than I need. Not that I trust meters, but I rarely go over 10 watts with my Onkyo M-504 with my Cornwalls or LaScala. Not that I’m in the room with them at that volume. That being said. Room size, placement, seating, music style, and preference. Using a small tube amp didn’t do it for me. A 40 watt tube amp wasn’t bad, but when you really wanna turn it up you can’t beat raw power. My opinion. My preference. I have Chorus I with a small Class A SS and it’s plenty at half to 2/3 volume. Different room and placement. Now the Carver tfm-35 powering Heresy II in a small room is too much. It was connected to something else before I brought them home. 
 

back to @Khorn I haven’t had the pleasure of Khorns yet. No corners or a good room for them yet. 😉 It’s been my experience with other Klipsch (CW LS Chorus) as well as other speakers using high current amps (mostly NAD and HK) they sound excessively bright with higher efficiency speakers and are less forgiving to flawed sources. My guess is the tube pre helps alleviate that brightness. 

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3 hours ago, henry4841 said:

The notion of needing lot's of power with Klipsch is BS. Continuation of the power wars started in the 70's. I am sure this is going to start a lively conversation with lots of disagreement but the more knowledgeable members know the truth.

 

Lots of watts with our speakers is like the little old lady in a Ferrari that never drives over 55mph. Nothing wrong with it but wasted dollars and power.  Anyone smart enough to say different should be smart enough to measure the average power they are truly using a multimeter and ohms law at the loudest level they listen at. 

 

Well, yes and no.  Some of the top Reference speakers are reported to sound better with over 200 watts available to each speaker, for example.  Those are outliers, though.  The Heritage Series speakers are some of the most sensitive Klipsch speakers, so they can get by with very little power. That said, though, there’s a difference between “get by” and “able to reproduce concert level volume accurately”, especially when referring to bands that play both very loud and very soft, so lots of dynamic range is required in order to get a listening experience that approaches reality.

 

PWK’s own test figures show La Scalas needing over 130 watts to reach their listed maximum volume of 121 dB, so powerful amplifiers are not always a case of wasted dollars and power.  Realistic transients also have momentary power demands that are magnitudes higher than those needed for the majority of the music.

 

Finally, many (if not most) audio equipment manufacturers reserve their best engineering and best component parts for their most expensive, i.e. their most powerful, amplifiers.  In those cases, you may have to pay for more watts than you need to get the sound quality that you want.  That’s what I was after when I bought those statement Yamaha power amps.  Even at low volume, they deliver all the sound quality that they promised.  When I got the second one, in order to set up the La Scalas for 2-way bi-amped operation, all the other parts hadn’t arrived yet, so for curiosity I hooked up that amp to drive the Surround Heresy IIs, which had been powered by the AVR.  The difference was not subtle.  The greatly improved clarity, the ability to pick out every instrument separately, all the way to the back of the stage, or just listen to the music in a smooth flow, and the solid no-nonsense bass response, give you just a basic and simplified idea of how much better the higher end amplifier sounded, compared with the power amp in the AV receiver.  There was not a dollar wasted.

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i dont have a tube pre... but have used 200wpc adcom GFA 555ii on K-horns as well as a 200wpc rotel, both are great "mid-fi" amps that get excellent reviews & compete with more expensive amps, they both sound excellent on high efficiency klipsch speakers.  currently using the adcom with chorus2 & SVS subs.  have also used an onkyo M504 @ 165wpc, very nice warm sounding amp. 

 

as mentioned above, high power amps can work great for high efficiency speakers, having reserve power for if/when you need it is much better than running a lower power amp close to its peak/clipping power.  reserve power/headroom is a good thing. 

 

 

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3 hours ago, Islander said:

PWK’s own test figures show La Scalas needing over 130 watts to reach their listed maximum volume of 121 dB, so powerful amplifiers are not always a case of wasted dollars and power.  Realistic transients also have momentary power demands that are magnitudes higher than those needed for the majority of the music.

What kind of idiot is going to listen at 121db at home? If you want that there is something wrong with you or too much listening at too high a level in the past. I knew this was going to be an interesting discussion but when I said 25 watts SS I meant real world in your house when most never listen any louder than 85db and that is loud for normal people. I have done measurements many times at my house and my average is in the neighborhood of a few watts and that was actually too loud. Most of my visitors tell me to turn it down where we can talk. 

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5 hours ago, CWOReilly said:

I’d rather have more than I need. Not that I trust meters, but I rarely go over 10 watts with my Onkyo M-504 with my Cornwalls or LaScala. Not that I’m in the room with them at that volume. That being said. Room size, placement, seating, music style, and preference. Using a small tube amp didn’t do it for me. A 40 watt tube amp wasn’t bad, but when you really wanna turn it up you can’t beat raw power. My opinion. My preference. I have Chorus I with a small Class A SS and it’s plenty at half to 2/3 volume. Different room and placement. Now the Carver tfm-35 powering Heresy II in a small room is too much. It was connected to something else before I brought them home. 
 

back to @Khorn I haven’t had the pleasure of Khorns yet. No corners or a good room for them yet. 😉 It’s been my experience with other Klipsch (CW LS Chorus) as well as other speakers using high current amps (mostly NAD and HK) they sound excessively bright with higher efficiency speakers and are less forgiving to flawed sources. My guess is the tube pre helps alleviate that brightness. 

In my case I’ve used many types of amplification and can state without reservation this is by far and away the best sounding power amp I have ever had. The tube preamp ads a touch of magic. 

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8 hours ago, henry4841 said:

The notion of needing lot's of power with Klipsch is BS. Continuation of the power wars started in the 70's. I am sure this is going to start a lively conversation with lots of disagreement but the more knowledgeable members know the truth.

 

Lots of watts with our speakers is like the little old lady in a Ferrari that never drives over 55mph. Nothing wrong with it but wasted dollars and power.  Anyone smart enough to say different should be smart enough to measure the average power they are truly using a multimeter and ohms law at the loudest level they listen at. 

I trust my own experience. Others can believe what they want. That’s them not me.  BTW it has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with steady state absolute spl levels. 

 

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