Jubilee thd @ 115db/1 meter ?

[ClaudeJ1]

On 7/16/2022 at 10:20 PM, Camplo said:

115db @ 1m is a standard for some.  Transients can be 20db or more over average, hence the desire for headroom... distortion must be low for the transient peak level spl, to ensure the fidelity of the peaks.

 

This is considered "Stupid Loud" in a home environment. What "standards" do you speak of here. Supply a link.

[ClaudeJ1]

15 hours ago, Camplo said:

using Dsp how?  with a high pass at 100hz?

Probably 60-70 Hz. where the Ports Take over after the 4.25 foot horn portion cuts off when NOT in a Corner and where the BR ports feeding the horn (a very tight low bass "corner" at this point) fully take over even before any PEQs.

[ClaudeJ1]

14 hours ago, Camplo said:

.I am seeing more 10-15db over average.

Paul Klipsch told me "make it 17 db" and he strictly recorded symphony orchestras, so I "make it 20 db" adding an extra 3 and being even more conservative. RECORDINGS that get even close to this number are almost non existent.

[ClaudeJ1]

12 hours ago, Camplo said:

I've stated several times that the Jubilee design is pretty awesome....So your complaints of me dogging them are not holding water....I cannot tell you what to do....but if you don't post in my thread any more. I'm ok with that.

I understand where you are coming from. I've been here since 2006 and lots of info. was shared about the Underground Jubilees. Curves included. I was privileged to be invited the Chief to hear them and I learned a lot from it.

 

All this was before the sale of the company to a large conglomerate vs. privately held by PWK's cousin. So this may have an impact on reluctance to share data. Especially when most "Audiophiles" (the target market by price) that attend Axpona each year don't know anything technical and don't really care to know. So in a way I don't blame Klipsch for their reluctance in letting data out to strangers. Not saying it's a bad idea, but you have to learn to accept no for an answer and wait for someone who does what you are looking for in the future.

[Camplo]

5 hours ago, Dave A said:

Probably beyond your pay grade but yes, design and machining data as I mentioned would allow another owner of design software and CNC machining capability to build an exact duplicate. I never mentioned curves anywhere in my comment.

You cant reverse engineer a speaker by looking at Fr and thd alone lol!... I make enough to buy my own pair of Axi2050s, so my paygrade is fine lol

 

I can look at the damn thing and copy it... its not complicated once the design has been made obvious. The K-402 is designed already... just buy one... or design your own constant directivity horn using Ath4 lol.... you can design a a woofer horn/cabinet like the jubilee in horn resp I think 🤔  I'm sure you're familiar with those programs, they are free ☺️
 

The design isnt super complicated... its smart rather, or clever... but not rocket science, if you are familiar with loudspeaker design.... big if lol

Edited July 18, 2022 by Camplo

[Camplo]

1 hour ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

This is considered "Stupid Loud" in a home environment. What "standards" do you speak of here. Supply a link.

You understand how transient peaks work... you are obviously mistaken it with average.

[Camplo]

50 minutes ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

Paul Klipsch told me "make it 17 db" and he strictly recorded symphony orchestras, so I "make it 20 db" adding an extra 3 and being even more conservative. RECORDINGS that get even close to this number are almost non existent.

I first spoke of 20-30 and the designer said thats not realistic... I know better and so do you I guess. Its the idea of being conservative... no such thing as too much headroom

[Camplo]

4 hours ago, Marvel said:

That's not what that pic shows at all. I will make the assumption that you know the woofer in a La Scala has a 3x13 inch compression slot. That pic doesn't show anything ported.

"This design" was referring to the jubilee...

[Camplo]

1 hour ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

Yes and they sell ridiculously overpriced Direct Radiator speakers too. I guess most modern recording studios can afford the higher distortion too, since all they produce nowadays is Compressed Garbage recordings with a 2 db dynamic range on a good day.

Well we definitely agree here lol

 

We design our own so no worries 😉 

[Islander]

21 minutes ago, ClaudeJ1 said:

You should be saying this to RandyH. Camplo is not trying to contribute, he just wants data.

 

I don't agree with your judgement here, basically telling this guy to "shut up and go away."

 

Especially for a guy who believes that putting a K-402 or K-510 on top of a LaScala bass bin qualifies it to be called a Jube. You should get the Paul Klipsch BS button for all the above.

 

But hey, I usually base my "opinions" on Facts, and curves to tell a pretty good story, much better than false labels on products not sold "officially" by Klipsch.

 

First, Claude, was there anything inaccurate in that post of mine?  This guy comes on the Forum, requests that any of the "many" Heritage Jubilee owners get the necessary gear, perform the extreme 115 dB test that he's requesting, and then share that data with him.  All this just to satisfy his curiosity.  And when the one present owner is not interested in doing that, he starts mocking Roy's achievements.  Don't you think that could be called trolling?

 

Of course, you're entitled to your opinion, so if you think that guy is making the Forum a better place, well good for you.

 

As for that JubScala thing, I thought we had settled that years ago, then you decided to start flogging that dead horse again.  First, I didn't invent the JubScala name, nor the speaker combination.  Roy very graciously performed the tests that made the combo possible and supplied the necessary DSP settings.  The outfit is certainly approved by Roy, so you'll understand if I place his views above yours.  As for curves, well, the speakers work well, and I don't need to be reassured by measurements, since Roy already did that, and I have full confidence in him and his work.

 

So what's "unofficial" about K510 and K402 horns, as well as K-69-A and K-691 drivers?  I didn't smuggle them out the back door of the factory at midnight, I bought them all from fellow Forum members, who had bought them directly from Klipsch.  Just what are you on about?

 

Second, the original production Jubilee (not the single one or two with the K403 horn) came with either the K510 or the K402 horn for the tweeter.  Since those tweeters were used on the Jubilee, that makes them Jubilee tweeters, right?  So when someone calls a La Scala with a Jubilee tweeter a JubScala, that seems accurate.  That that designation really grinds your gears is your problem.  Nobody else seems to have an issue with it.  And calling me a bullshitter doesn't help your credibility at all, although you seem to think that you are the top dog here because of your Super Heresy and other speakers.  They may sound great, but practically the only Klipsch parts on those speakers are the cabinets and the badges.  Coming from there, how can you call an approved speaker combination that uses all Klipsch parts falsely labelled, when you use your own labels on non-Klipsch speakers?

 

Really, I'm tired of this foolishness.  Can you not stay fixated on what other members (not just me) call a certain speaker combination?  That's all there is to it, and it's really pointless.

[KT88]

1 hour ago, Camplo said:

Well we definitely agree here lol

 

We design our own so no worries 😉 

We?

[billybob]

Dang, thought had lost momentum here. Yes, who is this we speaker speaker copying consortium anyway?

Lol...

[Camplo]

Are you guys serious....did I not quote the person I was talking to? wow
As for a speaker copy consortium...I wouldn't go that far....More like a bunch of cooks who analyze other cooks recipes.....replace cook, with loud speaker engineer....whether hobby or pro.....I take it you don't study loudspeaker design? its very fascinating if you are into science and love loudspeakers....

[Camplo]

3 hours ago, Islander said:

As for curves, well, the speakers work well, and I don't need to be reassured by measurements, since Roy already did that, and I have full confidence in him and his work.

what in the heck does THD measurements have to do with confidence other than if one was confident in his product, he would be very transparent lol.....Your approach is not very scientific....more like a groupie 

[Tom05]

On 7/15/2022 at 11:21 PM, Camplo said:

Hi guys... has anyone measured the Jubilee with Axi2050 at 115db and 1 meter? Preferably in the outdoors or better?

 

This would give a picture of what the transient performance is like....

 

This is my Axi+horn, some voicing and a 200hz xo....

 

A 115db/1m measurement of the Axi2050+K402 horn might be appropriate...

If you really want the data ,then test them yourself, only you can reliably capture it ,and only you can verify  that  the same calibrated test equipment was used for both speakers including microphone  ,  location  exactly the same , test procedure exactly the same , all test variables exactly the same . Data from another source would be highly unreliable, only you can verify  that your test procedure was fully followed. Unfortunately  any test data that  you would receive would likely be of questionable value and not  very useful for direct comparison to other tests  done elsewhere , good reliable test results require scientific controls . Let’s face it speaker specs are notoriously unreliable.Test it your self , report your findings.🤓

[ClaudeJ1]

4 hours ago, Camplo said:

You understand how transient peaks work... you are obviously mistaken it with average.

If you are trying to assess a full on 125 db curve you are not talking about "Transients." 

[ClaudeJ1]

4 hours ago, Camplo said:

I first spoke of 20-30 and the designer said thats not realistic... I know better and so do you I guess. Its the idea of being conservative... no such thing as too much headroom

Hmm, well it's not a practical test past a certain point for home listening, which is what the Jubilee 75 was built to do.

[ClaudeJ1]

4 hours ago, Islander said:

First, Claude, was there anything inaccurate in that post of mine?

I wasn't questioning the accuracy of your post, just your telling him to go away just because he asked for data. Obviously he tried more than once to justify his ask. But clearly the answer is NO, or just wait until someone does it next year somewhere else, right?

[ClaudeJ1]

4 hours ago, Islander said:

Don't you think that could be called trolling?

Yes it could, but you didn't call it trolling in your original post.

[ClaudeJ1]

4 hours ago, Islander said:

Of course, you're entitled to your opinion, so if you think that guy is making the Forum a better place, well good for you.

I never said he was making the Forum "a better place" and neither did you. There's no issue here.