Moving from receiver to integrated with RF7II

[Tobias]

Hi.

 

I always listen stereo music in a receiver combination, my last two receivers are: DENON AVR-A100 in use, and DENON AVR-7200WA (in use, trying to sell).

 

I'm happy owner of a pair RF7II (RC-64II, RS-62II) but i'm tired when I crank the A100 sound "shouty". Loud but not beefy or feel slam on my chest. At 0db is more like an scream.

 

So now I'm looking for an integrated amplifier, It will be my 1rst integrated, so I have no idea.

 

I was watching reviews about: Musical Fidelity, M6 500, Technics SU R1000, ROTEL 1592II, even McIntosh. but i don't know wich is better.

 

I want power, sound quality. I don't stream. Don't have problems with neighbours, so loud music is not my problem. I wan clean loud volumen and feel bass as loud as possible.

 

By the way, right now can't change speakers, here in my country the offer of Klipsch is very limited, RF7III or La Scala, never came.

 

Thanks in advance!

 

[Schu]

only you can determine which of your choices are 'better'...

[jjptkd]

13 minutes ago, Tobias said:

Hi. I always listen stereo music in a receiver combination, my last two receivers are: DENON AVR-A100 in use, and DENON AVR-7200WA (in use, trying to sell). I'm happy owner of a pair RF7II (RC-64II, RS-62II) but i'm tired when I crank the A100 sound "shouty". Loud but not beefy or feel slam on my chest. At 0db is more like an scream. Thanks in advance!

 

 Sounds to me like what you need is a separate amplifier for your main speakers, let the Receiver power the center and surrounds. Quick internet search tells me the A100 has pre-outs, have you considered this as an option?

[Tobias]

14 minutes ago, jjptkd said:

 

 Sounds to me like what you need is a separate amplifier for your main speakers, let the Receiver power the center and surrounds. Quick internet search tells me the A100 has pre-outs, have you considered this as an option?

Thanks for your answer.

No, I want only stereo in my living room, multichanel in anohter room, that's why I'm selling the 7200WA. I will use A100 as multichanel with RP8000F.

 

I think there are a lot of RF7II users, and some of them tried diferent combinations I could share their experiencies, meanwhile I continue reading posts on the internet.

 

 

 

 

[MicroMara]

38 minutes ago, Tobias said:

Thanks for your answer.

 

I think there are a lot of RF7II users, and some of them tried diferent combinations I could share their experiencies, meanwhile I continue reading posts on the internet.

 

 

 

 

You see ..I´m  using my RF 7 EvoTec ( moddyfied RF7MKII ) SS as well as hybrid as well as tube amp combination. Using my moddyfied MARANTZ SA11-S3 SS is a dream with these speaker. The MF M6 is a good idea , I had an audition with the origin MK II and the M 6 ..pretty pretty nice ! McIntosh or Rotel, you´ll have to choose ,budget wise,  but I would say 98% from alle available SS in the World market will sound pretty with the RF7MKII. Don´t forget modern Class D Amps with Hypex nCore or Purifi Modules , they´re  cheaper and save a lot of current consumption in times where prices raising and raising.

 

If you want to see a litle bit how my EvoTec do look like ....

 

 

[Shakeydeal]

Well there's little doubt that a good quality integrated amp will be far superior to a receiver. But your examples are all over the spectrum in respect to price. What is your budget and are you dead set on a SS integrated? Any interest in tubes? We already know you like to listen at high volumes, but what size is your room?

 

 

 

 

 

[Tobias]

Mi budget is from U$3.000/U$5.000 (or euros). But por example, Musical Fidelity at U$7.500 (here in mi country) or TECHNICS R1000 at €7.500 is jawdroping sound, can wait.

 

My room is 8x5 meters. A100 sounds loud, but no the way I wanted, I don't know how can I express in english... it has no impact, and is like a person screaming in my ears, but not deep bass. I want loud without distortion, if it is possible with this speakers of course. It's only when I do partys, 1 or 2 days a month, but that's what I want.

[Shakeydeal]

Well as efficient as your speakers are, you shouldn’t be wanting for power. It’s just that with a receiver, the quality of that power is lacking. I still suggest looking at a 50-100 watt per channel tube amp.

[MicroMara]

27 minutes ago, Tobias said:

Mi budget is from U$3.000/U$5.000 (or euros). But por example, Musical Fidelity at U$7.500 (here in mi country) or TECHNICS R1000 at €7.500 is jawdroping sound, can wait.

 

My room is 8x5 meters. A100 sounds loud, but no the way I wanted, I don't know how can I express in english... it has no impact, and is like a person screaming in my ears, but not deep bass. I want loud without distortion, if it is possible with this speakers of course. It's only when I do partys, 1 or 2 days a month, but that's what I want.

thought about a pre and two mono amps ?

[jjptkd]

29 minutes ago, Tobias said:

Mi budget is from U$3.000/U$5.000 (or euros).

That's a decent budget If I were to buy new Solid State gear I'd take a serious look at what Parasound has to offer either the Hint 6 Integrated or P6 Pre with matching amplifier "A" series amplifier.

[Khornukopia]

31 minutes ago, Tobias said:

if it is possible with this speakers of course.

 

Depends on how loud you play them during your parties. I would get some extra speaker wire, remove the metal jumper strips from the speaker binding posts and passive bi-amp your speakers and Denon system. Perform the Audyssey set-up with the microphone on a tripod in the middle of the room. Then I would use the Denon EQ menu to boost the bass. This can be done for the price of some inexpensive speaker wire.

 

You didn't say if you have a subwoofer, so you may want to buy a GOOD subwoofer for less money than a new amplifier and you will then have a great party system.

[Khornukopia]

I just read up about your Denon AVR-A100. That is nice!

 

I would be able to get good sound from a pair of RF7 II with the A100, and Audyssey calibration and some EQ adjusting. (Maybe some room acoustic treatment, also).

 

The limiting factor is how loud the speakers are able to play.

[stoka]

I would check if you can get a used Harman HK990, sound's like what you are looking for 😉

[Emile]

3 hours ago, Tobias said:

here in mi country

Where are you located?

[Tobias]

Argentina

 

Anyone has tried 4 speakers combination? like A+B? an alternative is try 4 RP800F instead (I already have a pair)... I'm searching info on the net.

 

Thanks to everybody for your replies/ideas.

[garyrc]

14 hours ago, Tobias said:

My room is 8x5 meters. A100 sounds loud, but no the way I wanted, I don't know how can I express in english... it has no impact, and is like a person screaming in my ears, but not deep bass. I want loud without distortion, if it is possible with this speakers of course. It's only when I do partys, 1 or 2 days a month, but that's what I want.

10 hours ago, Tobias said:

Anyone has tried 4 speakers combination? like A+B? an alternative is try 4 RP800F instead (I already have a pair)... I'm searching info on the net.

1. You might run into comb filtering with two or more speakers playing exactly the same sound.  Or not.  The attached article will explain comb filtering.  https://www.sweetwater.com/insync/what-is-it-comb-filtering/ Some people seem to get away with it,  at least when the doubled speakers are woofers only ... but there are exceptions.
2. Your Denon AVR-A100 has tone controls (they only appear and only work when Dynamic EQ and Dynamic Volume are OFF) ... you could get 6 dB Bass Boost with the Bass tone controls.  Playing as loud as you do, Dynamic EQ won't be usable, anyway.  Have you tried the separate Bass control? 
3. Do you use Audyssey?  Have patience with it.  You should really get a subwoofer (perhaps instead of getting any more amplification). Almost everyone who uses Audyssey, and plays loudly, turns up both the Bass control and turns up the subwoofer trim in the AVR AFTER running Audyssey (using all 8 microphone positions, but, in your case, out in the room or wherever your party goers will be).  See Mike Thomas' https://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-subwoofers-bass-transducers/2958528-guide-subwoofer-calibration-bass-preferences.html  GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES Section II-C: Where And How To Add Bass.  This will tell you how to add sub bass without clipping the line driver in the AVR, which may happen without advice like Mike's.  Clipping it will sound "hashy," perhaps like "screaming." Once you are there, you may want to read Mikes entire guide.
4. At Main Volume at 0, if you have used Audyssey to make 0 the official reference volume, you should get 105 dB instantaneous peaks, which, unless you have a huge room, will sound even louder, and a bit distorted, due to early reflections and modulation distortion.  For home sized rooms, THX recommends a maximum of 100 dB (or 110 dB through a good subwoofer) in any plausible living room, including a home "Great Room."  Before putting these levels through a speaker, make sure it is rated for that high a level in dB and that power in watts.  A (powered) subwoofer would take some of the burden off of the RF7II by doing some of the heavy lifting.  If you cross over at about 60Hz, you will still get tight, clear bass above 60Hz, and "beefy, impactive, slam" below 60 Hz, but you must set your main two channels (LF&RF) to SMALL and 60Hz crossover to the subwoofer to make this work.      
5. Best of luck!

[jjptkd]

16 hours ago, Tobias said:

Anyone has tried 4 speakers combination? like A+B? an alternative is try 4 RP800F instead (I already have a pair)... I'm searching info on the net.

 

Thanks to everybody for your replies/ideas.

 

 If you're not getting good bass response from your setup doubling the load on your amplifier isn't going to help. If bass is all you're missing maybe looking into a good subwoofer or two as mentioned above might be the better option. 

[Southern]

My experience with RF7 1's is to give it pleanty of solid state power for the chest thumping bass. 

 

I have an A/V receiver (Pioneer Elite) that delivers 140 WPC that works for me even without my subwoofer (SVS PB12+2).

 

A low powered tube amp will not produce the chest thumping bass which I have also tried with my Dynaco ST-70.  

 

My music source is a Blu-Ray player, I don't stream my music.

[Southern]

I looked up the specs on your Denon AVR-100 and it is similar to my Pioneer Elite AVR, which I get pleanty of low frequency slam.

 

I am now wondering if both your woofers are working properly on your RF-7's?  Or maybe the music doesn't have the low frequencies? 

 

I listen to heavy metal and Metal Church has that chest thumping bass.

[Khornukopia]

1 hour ago, Southern said:

 

I am now wondering if both your woofers are working properly on your RF-7's?

That is a good question when someone has a lack of bass. It is also important to check that the polarity of all the wires are correct.