Got_Horns Posted March 28 Share Posted March 28 I'm going to tear into my tangent 500s. Should I just get new caps or xovers, since I'm in there? What are the benefits of either? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuzzzer Posted March 28 Share Posted March 28 53 minutes ago, Got_Horns said: I'm going to tear into my tangent 500s. Should I just get new caps or crites xovers, since I'm in there? What are the benefits of either? Thanks The forum admins have recently decided that discussion of non-Klipsch modifications should be done on other forums like Audiokarma or AVSForum. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Got_Horns Posted March 28 Author Share Posted March 28 1 hour ago, wuzzzer said: The forum admins have recently decided that discussion of non-Klipsch modifications should be done on other forums like Audiokarma or AVSForum How is it non Klipsch? It's a 30+ year old Klipsch speaker....that needs restoration. fixed the OP, happy now? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjptkd Posted March 28 Share Posted March 28 9 minutes ago, Got_Horns said: why am I buying 30+ yro speakers that need parts replaced to the point I should just be building my own speakers instead of restoration of old speakers. A lot of the older Klipsch speakers still hold their own performance wise when working properly either restored to factory spec or modified making them great options for those who cannot afford to buy new. Some people like to tinker or experiment like replacing easy bolt on items but not completely change the design then there are those that once they get started take it all the way. I'd have to believe most people just want to acquire, position and listen and they are going to buy what they can afford. I think Klipsch has done a great job at almost any price point from $200 bookshelf to $36k Jubilee with a ton of stuff in-between I can't remember ever listening to a Klipsch speaker that I did not like new or old just some sound better than others in certain situations so they offer something for everybody. Tweakers going to tweak, no matter what Klipsch allows here or not conversations will just be had on other platforms most the info you need is easy to find in the search bar or Google. If you find a member here that has experience in what you're trying to accomplish just send them a PM last I heard private conversations are still allowed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuzzzer Posted March 28 Share Posted March 28 47 minutes ago, Got_Horns said: How is it non Klipsch? It's a 30+ year old Klipsch speaker....that needs restoration. fixed the OP, happy now? Crites modifications. There are companies like JEM Performance Audio and forum member @Deang who are authorized by Klipsch to supply new components and new crossovers for Klipsch speakers. I’m just passing along information that has been posted on here by Klipsch employees who run this forum. Lots of threads that discuss non-Klipsch modifications have been locked and I just didn’t want that to happen to you. No good deed goes unpunished I guess. 🤷🏻♂️ 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoff. Posted March 28 Share Posted March 28 put the H3 kit in them sell the woofers and tweeters, maybe even the crossovers, for half of what the kit costs if you like what you hear, and you will, never look on another audio forum 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigerwoodKhorns Posted March 28 Share Posted March 28 5 hours ago, Got_Horns said: How is it non Klipsch? It's a 30+ year old Klipsch speaker....that needs restoration. fixed the OP, happy now? Don't get mad at Wuzzer, just take his advice to go over to AK to discuss mods. It is now forbidden here. Maybe this tutorial will help: 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Got_Horns Posted March 30 Author Share Posted March 30 Has anyone compared the JEM crossover vs the unspoken name, or another? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjptkd Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 32 minutes ago, Got_Horns said: Has anyone compared the JEM crossover vs the unspoken name, or another? Yes several have the only acceptable statement on this forum however is JEM all the way baby, yeah!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuzzzer Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 32 minutes ago, Got_Horns said: I already had a thread shut down and thought you were going to shut down this one. It was early, no coffee and such. Sorry my bad. Hey, it’s fine. I’m not a moderator and don’t have that capability but I just wanted to head of the topic before it got locked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuzzzer Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 1 hour ago, Got_Horns said: Has anyone compared the JEM crossover vs the unspoken name, or another? I have, direct A/B comparison done one speaker at a time. I felt the caps from JEM sounded much more natural, like actual music and instruments. Many others have posted on here the same results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted March 31 Share Posted March 31 You go to a third party vendor when OEM parts and sevices are not available. Since OEM parts and services ARE available, why not use them? Jim and me are a little more expensive, but we should be - we’re using authentic parts. None of the competing networks meet factory spec. They sell three versions and NONE of them are right. An amazing accomplishment! Yes, Klipsch has put their foot down on allowing their platform to be used to promote competing businesses, and in some cases - businesses that wouldn’t have existed had they not helped themselves to Klipsch IP. I am over at AK quite a bit, and I find it ironic that after all of the weeping and gnashing of teeth from the Klipsch collective because of the changes here - there are only like four or five people over there, discussing less than a handful of modifications, which have already been discussed here ad nauseum for a decade. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 Nm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiFi Heaven Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 Maybe some of our members could characterize the superiority of JEM capacitors vs. other brands on an objective basis with measurements of value, tolerance and ESR, rather than subjective jargon? I'm ready to recap 12 vintage Klipsch, looking for advice based on experience, not opinion. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 We’ve done that many times, but the data is scattered everywhere. I have some posts about capacitors that I copied to my page. One of them is pinned. I don’t think anyone is really interested in another capacitor thread, especially me. https://www.facebook.com/deangcrossovers Autoformer tests by @mboxlershow that the stock units provide parallel inductance which produce a 12dB/octave rolloff. I sent Mike 3636 autoformers, and they do not measure the same - because the inductance is too high. Later, Klipsch used inductors in parallel with the autformers to maintain that result. So, use any of the stated values from the schematics, and of course those networks will be wrong as well. Some of @mboxlerwork is on AK. I can’t remember what thread it’s in over here. Different part values just screws up the filter response. It’s only an “upgrade” if you think it is - but the math would disagree. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 Nm 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OO1 Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 11 hours ago, HiFi Heaven said: I'm ready to recap 12 vintage Klipsch, looking for advice based on experience, Chief bonehead Klipsch Employees 1.3k Klipsch Employees Posted January 6, 2021 One more time.....you HAVE to look at the network as a system. It provides a voltage transfer curve to the drivers in order to maintain the original frequency response curve. Changing a component of the system requires that the voltage transfer curve be checked. If it has changed then the original intent of the frequency response curve has changed and would require that the value of other components , including the cap be changed in order to get the original voltage transfer curve. Changing caps arbitrarily without checking the voltage curve is like equalization. Of course some caps are better for audio signals but once the choice is made For the cap and other components and the network is designed around those components that give the desired voltage transfer curve, changing one of those at random will NOT guarantee that you have the correct voltage curve. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted April 2 Moderators Share Posted April 2 16 hours ago, Got_Horns said: How about I replace them with the best part? I don't care if its oem or aftermarket. I want the best part, I can afford. FFS! Any Klipsch upgrade search, pulls up an ocean of threads, YouTube's, and reviews on Mr unspeakable. Then FFS why did you ask on here? Oh, it wasn’t to try and get relevant and informed input, but rather so you could vent about what the policy/rules of this Forum were Re: outside vendors/peddlers? The “best part”, in terms of restoring Klipsch crossover networks to their original glory are the ones that Klipsch has measured, tested and confirmed match the originals and are offered through approved vendor JEM Performance for DIY, and @Deang for rebuilds. On 3/28/2023 at 10:39 AM, Got_Horns said: How is it non Klipsch? It's a 30+ year old Klipsch speaker....that needs restoration. fixed the OP, happy now? An unfortunate case of shooting the messenger @wuzzzer who was only trying to make you aware of the policy change on reference to outside capacitor and/or crossover network peddlers. The original post before you “fixed” mentioned one several outside peddlers so he was trying to get you to understand there might be other Forums that would have the information you were looking for. Returning 30 year old speakers to their original sound is a restoration. Changing the parts of a speaker, regardless of age, without regard to their original sound is a modification and typically involves an outside peddler and so you need to go to the other suggested forums if that’s the direction you are looking for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Travis In Austin Posted April 2 Moderators Share Posted April 2 On 3/30/2023 at 4:22 PM, jjptkd said: Yes several have the only acceptable statement on this forum however is JEM all the way baby, yeah!! Comparison of JEM caps/DeanG rebuilds vs. a XO with an outside peddler caps? I don’t recall any. I recall several comparisons between the sound before and after they installed the new JEM caps. Some even went to the trouble to install the new caps from JEM into one XO to do an AB before doing the other side. I suppose there may have been a comparison between restored XO and a peddler XO, just can’t recall it. But it would only be a preference, and probably impacted by confirmatory bias. There are numerous posts in AK about changing XO caps, specifically in Klipsch Heritage. This was well before any controversy Re: this issue. I’m talking at least 5+ years ago. What those posts reveal is a preference. Some preferred peddler X replacement kit over their original 30+ old caps (not a surprise, they probably needed replacing), however, several people said they actually preferred the original and described the peddler caps as being “bright” or something else. I think if you factor out the personalities (people involved) and really looked at what people are saying, when it comes to replacing very old caps with tested caps from JEM they all note an improvement. I also feel that when you see reviews on AK of using replacements of high dollar caps in their speakers (regardless of speaker brand) they read like audio cable reviews. Every Forum has its purpose, background and culture. This one in a manufacturer’s Forum to provide a platform for enthusiasts to meet, discuss and exchange without infringing on their business, designs, IP. AK is a general audio forum 10x the size of this one, that is “Audio without the attitude” which is why I have always liked it. You can have an opinion, but you better respect the opinion of others there or you are gone. One XO peddler went there and lasted about a week when he refused to acknowledge/respect the opinions of others. How do you think these cap replacement/upgrade topics would fly over in the Audio Science Review Forum? I think they would say a subjective opinion is meaningless, only double blind testing is of any consequence, etc. I think a poster would be mocked and run out on a rail, or at least patted on the head and explained the difference between subjectivists and objectivists. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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