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Tidal MQA vs. Qobuz, my impressions


KT88

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Just for fun, I subscribed to Qobus for one month for free as a test. I have had a Tidal subscription for many years. I always thought I was ok with it, with my Bluesound 2021 Node with MQA decoding for higher resolution recordings.
To be honest, I got curious because I saw on the net that people are not really happy with MQA. Neil Young found it manipulative and he withdrew all his songs from Tidal. It is claimed that even the recordings described as "CD" quality are not really flac files. So I tried Qobuz, they only offer flac, in CD quality and also in high resolution. You don't need a device with a special MQA decoder hardware chip.

My first impression is very positive. While Tidal can sound a bit too soft and a bit cloudy at times, I am surprised and amazed at the clear and impulsive natural sound quality of Qobuz. More good timing and simply good, whether CD, 24/96 Khz or 24/192 Khz. All heard with the same Bluesound Node in comparison. I thought the Node is the limiting factor to some degree but it is not (to some degree).

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Tidal is going to offer Hi-Resolution FLAC. I have had both services for a few years. It's hard to call but on most things I (and a few others unknowingly) think Qobuz has the edge. That's through a hifiROSE r250b if that matters. I have been meaning to cull one of them out but still have not done so. 🤔

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  • 2 weeks later...

I, too, have just signed up for a Qobuz trial. I've been using Amazon Music Unlimited for about two years, also with the Bluesound Node. I've been trying to do some A/B comparisons between the two to see I can tell any difference in the audio quality. Strangely, the only thing I've noticed is that the Amazon signal seems hotter. I haven't tried to measure the SPL difference, but it is definitely noticeable. So far, I haven't noticed a difference in availability of material for what I like listening to, but I've only been using it for a few days.

 

For those who use Qobuz, are there things you think I should look at to compare the two products.

 

KT88, I hope you don't mind me piggybacking on your topic.

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30 minutes ago, CWelsh said:

I, too, have just signed up for a Qobuz trial. I've been using Amazon Music Unlimited for about two years, also with the Bluesound Node. I've been trying to do some A/B comparisons between the two to see I can tell any difference in the audio quality. Strangely, the only thing I've noticed is that the Amazon signal seems hotter. I haven't tried to measure the SPL difference, but it is definitely noticeable. So far, I haven't noticed a difference in availability of material for what I like listening to, but I've only been using it for a few days.

 

For those who use Qobuz, are there things you think I should look at to compare the two products.

 

KT88, I hope you don't mind me piggybacking on your topic.

 

That's ok, on the contrary, it's supposed to be a discussion. CWelsh. I would guess that there is no difference in sound when one or the other service uses the same transmission. 24/96 flac shouldn't make a difference on Amazon or Qobuz with the same recording. OK, maybe SPL is a little different. My point is that I don't think Tidal MQA is quite as satisfactory as flac.

What I find as an advantage is that with the Bluesound Node I have the impression that even the normal CD quality seems to sound better on Qobuz than on Tidal. Exactly on this topic there were reports where it was suspected that the CD quality at Tidal does not correspond to flac but that it could be reduced MQA files ... so technically transmitted as flac but with a reduced MQA information content. Please only take it as a hypothesis, I only read it, I don't know if it's true. Only my sound impression tells me that Qobuz CD sounds better.

 

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I was a Spotify user for a long time - their pricing and curated playlists are solid, and cd quality streaming has never been essential for me since I have a healthy local FLAC library. The problem, however, was that I had planted a flag in Roon for my local music playback, and Spotify integration doesn’t exist. This made for some very cobbled together solutions and a disjointed listening experience.

 

I’ve tried tidal in the past and wasn’t a fan of their recommendation engine, nor do I care about MQA. But I wanted a streamlined approach for my ever changing whims and finding music outside my local collection. Qobuz fits that fine - the recommendation engine still isn’t as robust as Spotify, but it’s good enough, and the Roon integration is superb, along with the ability to purchase and download drm-free music.

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Tidal search engine is horrible. It amazes how bad it is. Qobuz is much more user friendly in that regard. With regard to Spotify until they do hi res, it's unlistenable to me but I stopped using it recently so maybe they have hi res now, I don't know but it was too compressed.

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Dumped Amazon HD as I finally switched from PC to streamer HiFi Rose 520… Picked up Qobuz and very happy. I few things I can’t find but I’m good with that and the sound quality is excellent. I still use Spotify for background music etc as the playlists are hard to beat.  I never even tried Tidal / MQA but very happy with Qobuz SQ wise in comparison with Spotify or Amazon HD.

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Mostly though I use two ten terabyte hard drives with about 15,000 all hi rez albums from 24/96 to DSD512 and everything in between. If anyone is interested in this like me they can PM me and I can give details and an extensive list of what took me four years to digitize. Streaming is amzing now days but the hosted files are far superior.

 

Charlie

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5 minutes ago, charlieboy said:

Mostly though I use two ten terabyte hard drives with about 15,000 all hi rez albums from 24/96 to DSD512 and everything in between. If anyone is interested in this like me they can PM me and I can give details and an extensive list of what took me four years to digitize. Streaming is amzing now days but the hosted files are far superior.

 

Charlie

Hosted files are far superior?  How so?  I'll argue 24/96 is 24/96.  However I bet how you stream (connection, service etc) makes a ton of difference as does how you host.  I'm just curious when you state "far" superior.  I have had some pretty good systems and have a decent one now.  "So What "at 24/96 sounds like it does streamed hi res.  But I don't really compare much so maybe it would be fun to try.  I'll jump from local to Qobuz to Spotify. There are definitely differences as I skip around but I guess I'll have to try a local hi res vs a Qobuz hi res. 

 

Is there something in the fours years you learned that really improved your hosted file experience?

I have not even tried DSD yet but hope to- I'll be interested in what I hear there as well.

 

Thanks.

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On 4/28/2023 at 8:47 AM, roninklipsch said:

Dumped Amazon HD as I finally switched from PC to streamer HiFi Rose 520… Picked up Qobuz and very happy. I few things I can’t find but I’m good with that and the sound quality is excellent. I still use Spotify for background music etc as the playlists are hard to beat.  I never even tried Tidal / MQA but very happy with Qobuz SQ wise in comparison with Spotify or Amazon HD.

I'm curious why you dumped Amazon HD for Qobuz. As I mentioned above, I'm currently trying Qobuz and haven't determined any real benefits so far, but I may not be looking for the right things.

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31 minutes ago, CWelsh said:

I'm curious why you dumped Amazon HD for Qobuz. As I mentioned above, I'm currently trying Qobuz and haven't determined any real benefits so far, but I may not be looking for the right things.

 

Qobuz gets the slight edge in SQ. But more than that, the user interface of Amazon Music is horrible. Or at least it was last time I tried it.

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33 minutes ago, CWelsh said:

I'm curious why you dumped Amazon HD for Qobuz. As I mentioned above, I'm currently trying Qobuz and haven't determined any real benefits so far, but I may not be looking for the right things.

Just trust your ears and do some comparisons.  Maybe file to file. You may not experience a definite advantage of one service over another. And that's totally fine...systems, rooms etc all play a part.  It's not like your comparing MP3 to DSD.  But many do hear benefits. 

 

I did not really "dump" Amazon. It was a good service. However I did switch from PC based streaming to a dedicated streamer. The streamer I have has opened up a ton of cool stuff for me and it certainly did not hurt SQ wise.  However only a couple streamers support Amazon.  Bluesound and I think now Auralic.  Amazon I think has played hard to get in this market.  My HiFi Rose does not support it so that prompted the switch.

 

I would not feel compelled to switch.  Try the free trial and go from there...

 

(Like Shakey said above- The interface is very different as well.... Good point)

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On 4/27/2023 at 5:18 PM, Thaddeus Smith said:

nor do I care about MQA.

MQA is a high distortion format being marketed by people who ignore the technical truth in search of ignorant dollars. We should all run like the wind away from it. Qobuz rocks.

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1 hour ago, Shakeydeal said:

 

Qobuz gets the slight edge in SQ. But more than that, the user interface of Amazon Music is horrible. Or at least it was last time I tried it.

 

It's still horrible.  I dropped them again months ago.  Now, I admit that I do like their various playlists which is something that Qobuz is lacking severely.  About the only time Qobuz has any songs I like on a playlist, it's on that My Weekly Q.  If I'm listening via Qobuz, I pretty much have to know what I'm wanting to listen to where with Spotify, which I have the Family Plan, I can just pick a playlist and let 'er rip.  Just depends on the mood I guess.  I just wish Qobuz would come out with a Connect feature that works as well as Spotify.  Oh well. 

 

Streamer wise, I either use the desktop apps on my Windows 10 PC or I use a WiiM Pro with their app on my phone, for Qobuz, and for Spotify, there's Connect.

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I'm going to play devil's advocate and take the opposite side of the "argument". And yes, this is probably going to sound arrogant on my part, but so be it.

 

FIRST OF ALL, as one of our late Forum Members, Dave Mallet used to say, "the recording engineer is king". (I'm pretty sure he said that, lol. If not, sorry Dave)

 

2. I have ask everyone of you, how many of you have ever done ANY recording of live (acoustic) music or sounds?

 

There is so much variation in "subjective" sound quality from recording to recording, even from the same performing artist(s), same recording engineer, same recording location that it's literally impossible to associate a "preference", and say that (for instance) MQA is $hit, one streaming service (Tidal vs. Qobuz) is better or worse, analog vs. digital, etc.

 

I mean, literally, how many of you have ever made sound recordings of something extremely familiar to you (like your own backyard), in both analog and digital simultaneously, from the same signal feed? I suspect not many.

 

When your audio system is finally "tuned" properly (in my world that means non-biased), you will be able to enjoy pretty much any and all recordings, no matter how old or recent they are, no matter what format they were recorded in. OTOH, I will readily admit that what I just said is easier said than done. Not everyone has the time, resources, dedication, or lack of personal conflicts to get to that point. After all, this literally is a "journey". And one tries to do the best they can with what is achievable for their self at any particular time.

 

There's simply too many variables along the way, in the recording process, starting with the performance, how it's captured, and what happens to it before we get to hear anything. I can tell you as a matter of fact, that those "magical" recordings don't just happen, but then again, they do. I know, because I've done it. Same recording facility, same mics & other equipment, same mic locations, and yet, "it sounds different". Often, "that magic", just happens.

 

We all have very little control over what we hear from any recording through our audio system - UNLESS - you are the recording engineer. Even then, it's often very difficult to achieve and maintain consistency.

 

Take MQA for instance. (first of all, it's NOT a FORMAT. It is a CODEC). "Artist Approved"? What the hell does that mean? Jimmy Page is often the producer for many of the Led Zeppelin recordings/reissues/re-masters. How good do you think his ears are now? It sounds good to him, he approves it. Don Henley might be driving around in a Porsche Roadster with the top down playing the test tracks from a recent recording, calls his mastering engineer and says "Yeah. I like that. Let's go with it". We have no idea. And quite frankly, he's probably listening for something quite different than we are. But it's MQA approved. So what. It all, unfortunately, has nothing to do with we're all looking for.

 

And then..................there's the listening room, influencing everything on its way to our ears.

 

It's really quite folly to believe in the "purist" approach - no tone controls or EQ, for fear of how it might pollute our precious "sound". Been there, done that.

 

If you don't like something you're hearing, on your system (which includes the room) - it's your system. Not the recording, not the format, not whether it's MQA or not, or something else.

 

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Quote

If you don't like something you're hearing, on your system (which includes the room) - it's your system. Not the recording, not the format, not whether it's MQA or not, or something else.

 Your argument was somewhat cogent until your last statement, which I must say is utter bull shite.

 

 

 

So by your proclamation, if someone had the "perfect" system and the "perfect" room, then it's still their issue and not the recording or the format?

 

Agreed about the importance of the room. But if one streaming service sounds better in MY system and MY room to MY ears, then that's apples to apples. Much different than hearing Tidal in your room and hearing Qobuz in my room and declaring one the winner over the other.

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