justin_tx_16 Posted April 8, 2003 Share Posted April 8, 2003 The amp just arrived... in an hour I will get to test it out! Right now it is just sitting next to me, keeping me warm. Man, I might have to get one of these just to keep the room warm in Missouri Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arfz28 Posted April 8, 2003 Share Posted April 8, 2003 Cant wait to hear what you think about your first tube amp Justin, All the hot chicks will be over to check it out, LOL.Are you going to Mizzou? Im 3 hours away and take in a football game once a year. If you travel 55 interstate you probable past right by my house, you should stop in and listen to my k-horns on one of Craigmisters scott 299a.Hope you like the tube amp sound it is different, and should go well with those heresys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted April 8, 2003 Share Posted April 8, 2003 Justin, Hope you have speakers hooked to it. There not suppose to be run without a load on the output Iron !! Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T2K Posted April 8, 2003 Share Posted April 8, 2003 You're gonna like it Justin. BTW, don't burn you're monkey on those hot tubes! Keith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Robinson Posted April 8, 2003 Share Posted April 8, 2003 Justin, forgive my ignorance ... What amp did you get? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justin_tx_16 Posted April 8, 2003 Author Share Posted April 8, 2003 I am officially tubed. And now I feel forced to get a beefier tube amp. So Craig, I guess your attempts to lure me into Tubonia (it is a two step process, very rigorous) has succeeded! Before coming home I decided to pick up a few CD's to play. Linkin Park - Meteora Megan Mullally - Big Berry Loreena McKinnet - The Visit All American Regects - The All American Rejects So far things I have noticed. Tubes are much smoother. The midrange is greatly improved over most solid state amps I have tried with the Heresy's (the HK430 is not far off from the Knight) Transitions from lows to highs are not overly emphasized one way or the other. In other words, the tubes don't seem to prefer lows to highs or highs to lows. When i have a song, such as ANY track off of Norah Jones's debut album Come Away With Me, the balance between her sweet voice and the bass in the background is superb. Some what better than the HK430. The ablility to determine all the different instruments and vocals is improved over most solid state amps I have tried. The HK430 allowed me to realize this and it seems that tube epitamize this. It does not get as loud as my HK430. The HK430 gets loud without any problems. When you begin to reach the max volume on the Knight, around 70%, you start to get a noise as if an equalizer has been maxed out. Albeit, this is at above a normal volume, it is not near the volume that the HK430 gets to. But, this is to be expected, having roughly 1/2 the power that the HK430 does. The bass is SLIGHTLY under done. This might not be a fault of the amp, but I believe that HK430 is just MADE for Heresy's, getting better than should be bass out of them. The bass below 60Hz seems to be testy when at low volumes. When connected to my subwoofer through the headphone output, in tracks such as Joshua Bell - I. Allegro ma non troppo, blubbery bass is shown during periods of lower volumes. Once again, likely not a fault of the amp but of something else, such as having to connect the sub through the headphone output. I will say, with Loudness turned on, this is not a problem what so ever. Boy does it get hot! I guess that is what allows for such a warm sound. Truly the midrange has improved, beyond what I had expected. My limited experience with tubes, this being the ONLY experience, leads me to the ASSumption that tubes work best with female voices. Norah Jones, Jewel, Loreena McKinnett, Megan Mullally, Charlotte Church, Sarah Brightmant, and Diana Krall all seem to have noticeable sweeter voice when played over tubes. Men sound very good as well, but I especially noticed the improvement over most solid state amps on my Heresy's with the women. The headphone output is what had me most excited. It would allow me to power my Sennheiser HD-600's via tubes. For those of you out of the know, these are $500 headphones that consistantly rate as No.1 throughout nearly every publication that has had the honor to review them. There are always going to be the exotics that get better ratings based on their price tags, but none has ever beaten the HD600 without being astronomical. Anywho, they sounded great on the tubes, but not any better than the HK430 or the Technics (which both sound better than once again, most SS amps I have played with). One thing I did notice was that the headphone output was approx. 10dB louder than the speakers. This may have something to do with the blubbery bass when not at a decent volume. The HK430 spoiled me to high quality sound at a low budget price. With each of these amps around $100, I feel they are equal contenders. Overall I think the HK430 suits me best right now with its extra power and better low end. However, this is not meant to compare the two head to head. Each has its own strength, and I hope that I conveyed that, and would like to note that this once again is NOT a comparision of the two. No matter how much it SEEMS like a comparision, keep telling yourself it is'nt one. Craig told me right off the bat that this was no HK430 killer, that it would not reach ear piercing volumes, and that is was certainly not the best tube amp out there. It has shown me the beauty of tubes and the wonder of high quality engineering. This tubular experience has lead me to believe that I have no choice but to invest in a nice tube amplifier! Hopefully the HK430 will suffice through college. I can see the beer bottles hitting the tubes as I type this! Ok, so how was that review? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted April 8, 2003 Share Posted April 8, 2003 Yea the little amp isn't to bad for a early 70s Japan !! The output tubes are 6BM8's which leave allot to be desired. Maybe I should send you the Heath Kit next LOL !!! You up for the shipping cost ?? This one has some Balls ! I also have a Stromberg Carlson that I believe would floor you. That amp is definitly a HK Killer !! I paid $95 for it. Of coarse I can garrentee you a Scott or a HF-81 would have you shelving the HK for good. Justin if your serious and can afford a better amp let me know I can hook you up. But the ones I posted today would need at least a few hundred in updates to be used daily. So you better figure $350 or more to get you setup right. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lynnm Posted April 8, 2003 Share Posted April 8, 2003 Master Bates !! Errum are you sure Chauncy ?? Well it was a natural mistake after all - Think dear boy he is 17 after all !! Very well ! I shall rephrase the salutation; Master Scott !! Welcome to world of tube sound but I suggest that you learn to listen to some real talents ! "Norah Jones, Jewel, Loreena McKinnett, Megan Mullally, Charlotte Church, Sarah Brightmant, and Diana Krall all seem to have noticeable sweeter voice when played over tubes." Really dear boy !! You need to hear Amelita Galli-Curcci to understand - Yassssss Chauncy I know that she died before this whole recording fad really got going but nonetheless.........Damnation those whitecoated facsists are coming down the hall at one hell of a rate so I will have to ring off for now.....Oh Dear!! ... They're here !! I do hope that dear old Dr. Wilcox hasn't taken that smack with his clipboard too personally. Those Haldol injections REALLY are a pain in the *** ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audio Flynn Posted April 8, 2003 Share Posted April 8, 2003 I have some Segovia, Martin guitar(Crosby Stills Nash and Young separately or together), Larry Coryell and other guitarists. You gotta listen to chicks sing(Anonomys 4) but real men playing awesome accostic giutar goes nice with tubes. I have a 3 LP set of Gershwin that woild knock ones piano lovin' socks off as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justin_tx_16 Posted April 10, 2003 Author Share Posted April 10, 2003 I will have to give some of that a try. About how much do you have to pay for a NEW tube amp that will get some big sound and still sound sweet? About how much do you have to pay for a USED tubed amp that will have some big sound and still sound sweet? Funny... Tubes are said to not be so great for hard rock music... but Klipsch is said to shine with rock music. Irony of ironies hehe. I am going to try out my new Linkin Park CD on the tubes, seems like it takes a might fine amp to handle their music because of all the crazy stuff going on. Same with the Transiberian Orchestra. I am loving this amp! It had to be tubessssssss, it had to be TUuuuubessss, wonderful tuuuubbbessss............ ok, i will stop singing there question. is it really true that you should let a tube amp heat up before you use it? i understand how that could be. about how long do you let them sit. should you turn the speaker output on or leave that off or does it matter when warming up? I'm a tubie newbie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Robinson Posted April 10, 2003 Share Posted April 10, 2003 Justin, very nice review! Trust me, you aren't a newbie. You get away with it because of your modesty. You may be new to tubes, but your ears and writing skills are plenty seasoned. New tube amps run from $100 (Waves) to $2000 (Welborne Labs) and even higher for the exotica. However, there is no need to pay those prices because there are always good deals in the "used" department. Craig is a very good source for vintage pieces; he won't steer you wrong. Audiogon is a good source for the more upscale used pieces. You just need to know what you're buying before you chomp. Last year I went through the tubevolution upon which you are now embarking. I started with the (new) AES Superamp push-pull amp and a 6SN7 pre-amp. The amp left me wanting more musicality. I sold it and lost half my investment. At Kelly's prodding, I went the vintage route with an Eico HF-81 which Craig updated, and now have about $600 invested. It is about 10X more musical to my ears than the Superamp. As an integrated amp as well, I don't need to bother with the pre-amp and phono stage as well. Bottom line: great sound doesn't positively correlate with the price curve. Great sound can be had for 1/2 of something that's both new and musically inferior. For my Klipschorns, when the -81 is sidelined, I run my flea-sized Wright 3.5W 2A3 SET's ... which I bought used for about $1000, NOS 2A3's included. Because they're monoblocks, you need a pre-amp which I still have from my Superamp acquisition. The 6SN7-based AES AE-3 preamp is very nice and mates well with the SET. So the SET/pre- combo used can be had for about $1300 used, but the sound is unbelieveable. They can also get plenty loud, but perhaps not into the 125db range that you may prefer. My old ears start to hurt around 95-100db, so I don't get much higher than that. But for musical details, bass and a LUSH midrange, SET is the way I go. My Eico is a close second, losing only in the "details" area and possibly in the bass (very close). DeanG, a/o, has enjoyed the Welborne products, and these get quite pricey. I wouldn't go there until you can upgrade your speakers to the bigger Heritage line (or Reference). Ask Craig to keep an eye out for a clean Eico HF-81 and let him tune it up for you. It will go well with your Heresies and it won't leave you wanting for much if budget tubes are what you're looking for. Scott is also a wonderful line and Craig knows a ton about that stuff. Question is just how much $$ you want to spend. BTW, it is good to leave tubes on whenever possible. Warm them up, if cold, at least five minutes before playing. But if your dorm is a fire trap, wisdom would dictate turning them off when not using. It would be easy to see how a dorm mate could drop a pile of papers on top of it, knowing nothing about tubes, and set things afire. That would s*ck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvel Posted April 10, 2003 Share Posted April 10, 2003 Justin, For acoustic music, just about any of the "Dawg" music albums would sound great. David Grisman has been pumping these out for close to 30 years now. I have an early one with David Grisman and Stefan Grapelli (I'm sure I spelled that wrong). The newer ones are just as good. Tony Rice on guitar. Way cool music. Also, the music of Yo-Yo Ma, Edgar Meyer and Mark O'Connor should sound awesome with that combo you have at the moment. I've also got a release of Rosemary Clooney and Duke Ellington whish is nice. Marvel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justin_tx_16 Posted April 10, 2003 Author Share Posted April 10, 2003 I love Yo-Yo Ma. Went to his concert here in houston around christmas time. Wonderful performance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted April 10, 2003 Share Posted April 10, 2003 Chris, Great advise you posted there !! I disagree on one point leaving a tube amp on 24/7 is insane !! The electricity wasted, The wear and tear on the amp amp tubes just isn't worth the added benifit of having them warm and ready ! The fire trap issue is also a point. If your going to be listening on/off throughout the day or weekend then yes but 24/7 is crazy !! Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foodshouldbefree Posted April 10, 2003 Share Posted April 10, 2003 haha, well, being a student i know how poor one can get. tube amps seem like they can be a supplementary heater when you cant afford the bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtice Posted April 10, 2003 Share Posted April 10, 2003 Justin, I just went through the same thing. I've owned Heresy IIs for 15 years and had never even imagined what pleasurable sound they were capable of until I bought a HF-81 on ebay. Sent it to Craig and it's just now breaking in--and it's very sweet. If you can swing it, you won't regret it. Even with rock'n roll. Four o'clock on the volume will yield sound that you can't talk over. I agree that female voice is notably improved with tubes and horns, but it's not limited to that. Violins, sax, acoustic guitar, piano and the male voice too--the music just opens up and reveals its texture. An album you might like--Mark O'Connor with Jane Monheit singing some jazz classics so you get the voice and violin... lots of texture, a nice album. Hey, isn't it about time for a new music thread? This vintage amp has me excited about all sorts of new (to me) music--probably the best testimony to its virtues. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deang Posted April 10, 2003 Share Posted April 10, 2003 Just think Justin, that's a very entry level piece of gear. Moving up to a EL-84 push-pull like the Scott or Eico could really satisfy you for quite some time. Good tube amps are like ice cream -- different flavors, but they all taste pretty darn good. There's the 'see through' quality of SET -- the ultimate in transparency, the warm, open sound of the vintage push-pulls -- that make you forget the gear, the rip snorting pounce and pace of the beam tubes like the KT-88 and 6550, to the big, fat, expansive soundstage and texture of the EL-34. All smooth All liquid In time, you may find you need more than one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Cornell Posted April 12, 2003 Share Posted April 12, 2003 Chris good buddy, you own so much gear your jamming the threads LOL I always have to wit till your replies download, then answer, its all good LOL! H/K just for heresys, well Justin i couldnt leave that alone, i have a H/K 430 on k-horns! Explosive sound buddy all the way! You would love my Cj MV-52 I have my tube system ,on the front with my 1975 k-horns, and my H/K 430 on the rear system, with my K-horns! 1980 I couldnt decide, so i just figured id use both, on the same speakers! I also know be carefull what you say on both issues? LOL! Listen to Dean, Lynnm, Mobile, and Craig, as a way to go, on what amp choice! Regards JIm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edster00 Posted April 12, 2003 Share Posted April 12, 2003 Congratulations on your tubes Justin, and very nice review!! I know you have a rockin' stereo going there. You are going to be the envy of the dorm. The title of your threas (Tubes are Glowing) got me inspired so I took a photo of my pre-amp last night while listing to some "Bat out of Hell" rockin' the house. Kewl huh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1stcav Posted April 12, 2003 Share Posted April 12, 2003 Sniff...I miss my tube preamp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.