kjohnsonhp Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 What do you think of the claim that the modified Technics SL-1200 Mk5 is the last TT you'll buy? It seems they claim the basis of this tt is better than what small companies can engineer and with mods it's class A. The weakness seems to be the arm which could be replaced. Audiophile Standard, features the KAB TD-1200 Fluid Damper, PS-1200 power supply installed, KAB USA Record Grip and Groovemaster II AE cartridge. This turntable sets the standard of performance for all others. http://www.kabusa.com/index_tt.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 Dont think too much of it. Surprised you do as well. IS it a solid TT? Yep. I used so many of these 1200 models, I see them in my sleep. Will mods help? They sure dont look too impressive nor life changing to me. Will it better the sonics of many of the better belt drive options ala Linn, VPI, Basis, et al? I really dont think so, even with the mods and clamp (I dont think record clamps sound better than sans clamp with some simple felt). I tweaked the death out of a 1200 MkII for home use with a better sorbathane mat and Sumiko Blue Point and the Linn LP-12 literally sounded an order of magnitude more natural and musical, not to mention quieter. IT was not close. The 1200 series is a competent direct drive table that will get up to speed in a blink, but your MMF-5 should be a more pleasing table sonically. Yes, there are upgrade paths from the MMF-5 but the Technics, in my view, is not one of them. kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjohnsonhp Posted September 16, 2003 Author Share Posted September 16, 2003 I never even thought about this creature until someone started the argument that it was a better option than the other $1500 and under options. Just thought I'd check. If I was to upgrade from the MMF-5 I think I would make a big jump...probably beyond the MMF-7. The VPI Scout is one option. The Linn LP12 is another but I'm not sure what Linn make-up (arm, power, bearings, etc.). It seems the Linn would require some careful buying giving all the different options over the years that make an LP12 range from a $800 unit up to a $3k+ unit of a different bread. I'm sure there are many other options and of course then there is the whole cart selection. My local Linn dealer gave me the strong sales pitch on buying his new $2500 unit vs used or any Music Hall product I haven't had my PHASE 1 system long so I'm just continuing my investigation of options for PHASE 2 which would most likely be the replacement of all the electronics in my PHASE 1 system going from modest priced vintage to more expensive recent vintage (although probably still used). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clipped and Shorn Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 KJ, How many high quality perfectly recorded near-mint quiet vinyl discs do you own and play on a regular basis? C&S Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 C&S, I suppose you are implying that only near mint, perfectly quiet, discs are good for your MMF-7 option while the majority of records sound better on the Stanton shod 1200 MkII. Strangely enough, although I dont have a MMF-7, I found the Linn LP-12 and VPI HW-19 Jr. to both have much quiter backgrounds than the 1200 Mk II although the cartridge choice and setup are critical. I used the 1200 Mk II for over 8 years in the studios, office, and in home as an alternate and respect it for what it does. On the other hand, I actually liked the majority of recordings on my Linn LP-12 and my girlfriend's VPI over the 1200 Mk II, this whether it was indie, rock, or especially jazz, where I thought the Linn really showed its mettle. But the quality Belt drives are just quieter plus having better tonearms more often than not. Not to say your 1200 isnt peforming well, but in comparing the various 1200's I had in service, I just found it not as open and musical a player. IT didnt have the same rhythmic swing as the Linn perhaps it's stronge suit, even over the VPI. Have you tried a felt mat on your MMF-7 (adjusting VTA)? MAn, I really like the felt mat sans clamp on the acylic platters I have tried. Also, do you like that Stanton a lot? WE used this cartridge some in the studio. Try a Blue Point on that 1200 Mk II if you have access. That was one of the better combinations on that table but surely not NEAR as heavy duty - care needs to be taken like your other table. kh C&S- The waves are now forcast to head between 25-30 feet at their peak! Insane. We have a place on the south side of the inlet jetty that will hold it, but it's almost 3/4mile offshore. Taking a longboard out there is a thrill with rides that are insanely long with huge sloping faces, the last 8-10ft vertical. CS- take a look at the last swell here: Hurricane Fabian Surf Action - Near my beach.mov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Landau Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 unless you have an SP10 MK2 or some other heavy duty direct drive table. http://de.geocities.com/bc1a69/index_eng.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjohnsonhp Posted September 16, 2003 Author Share Posted September 16, 2003 I have about 2500 lps and 500 cds. Most of my lps are rock related and VG+ or better. Some sealed (hard to play sealed so only about 10), many have only been played a few times but most are VG+ and NrMt rock lps. True I don't buy the $30 modern audiophile vinyl. I've also been looking at new digital front ends (many have commented on my CD player question). I would like to experience the benefits of both vs my modest TT and CD player as I'm not sure how much value to place on spending a $1k or so on each. I have noticed that some (few) lps have a raised lip and the first few revolutions will rub on the low riding MMF-5 Goldring cart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 Heh... I was wondering when you were going to chime in on this debate knowing you have the big ole SP-10. It takes a lot more to get a great DD than a great BD. Strangely enough, I often compare the good direct drive to the good belt drive as sort of a solid state vs tubes comparison. It's an interesting parallel that seems similar to me although the VERY best DD can come into their own. I had a very high quality Yamaha Natural Sound PD model from the mid-70s that was high-end DD of the day as well (not the SP-10 however). IT was built like a tank. Ultimately, the Linn had more soul but I did love that table until my girlfriend put a hammer through the tonearm and platter. IT would make its own post with perhaps a novella more in order. The good ole days....heh. kh ps- Which Goldring do you have, Ken? You have the downforce set to stock rec? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 http://www.progressive-engineering.com/klipsch/sp-10.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
synthfreek Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 I have been using B4 from Native Instruments for a while with great results. Click here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3dzapper Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 Kelly, you hurt me. I have had an SL1200 for about 25 years and still love it. Here is a little tweak that eliminates most motor noises from the platter. Does anybody know where I can get a new dust cover for this TT? The only one I have ever seen was on British ebay. Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Landau Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 Kelly, You certainly had some crazy girlfriends, heh . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clipped and Shorn Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 KJ, I also have a lot of old vinyl (10K+). Also CDs, some 78s and some 45s. I find the range of quality in sound (in my wide ranging collection) to be of a higher order of magnitude than the variations in quality that I perceive in high quality tts, arms, and cartridges, which is to say I use all three of my turntables in various capacities, one of whlich is the Technics 1200 which I like, not least for its rugged reliability and convenience. Some of my recordings are better off with this tt than with my MMF-7 which is a more delicate device somehow, I also enjoy the MMF-7 in various capacites as well. I also have a dedicated tt for 78s. I enjoy having these simultaneously available options and have not closed the door to other options as they might present themselves. Sometimes I will start out playing a piece on the MMF7 only to switch over to the Technics, sometimes vice versa, depending on the nature of the vinyl condition. This is my opinion and expereicne and it is valid for me (remember the bottom line is subjective appraisal, and I think this Technics tt is just dandy and is as musical as the music is musical, musically speaking). Considering its relatively friendly price I think it is a winner and perhaps a bargain. Likewise the MMF-7. Previously (for many years) I wore out a Thorens TD-124, and after years of maintaining its mechanics intimately to keep it going, I grew tired of its baroque engineering, and finally ditched it because replacement motors are no longer available anywhere. Perhaps one can find someone to rebuild those old motors, I couldn't, and finally decided to chuck it "as is" on eBay. I am also considering the KAB upgrades as well for the Technics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnysal Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 clipped has "no life"...lol, tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clipped and Shorn Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 Kelly, I have not been able to see the movie files you have been posting. What software do I need for this old iMac? Have you been going out in this surf, you madman? btw, has the film "Stepping Into Liquid" opened near you? Actually you must have enough of a spectacle out your front window these days. My brother is off to Chile to surf some out the way secret spot. An old Topanga bud of his is doing this these days: Mike Perry C&S Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 Havent checked the link to Perry but wanted to let you know that if you can see the .mov files if you download Quicktime via your iMac. It's a pretty cool little video made by a local loon here of some of the swell from Fabian. It's actually suprisingly good and, ironically enough, I think done on his MAC! heh... Download the latest FREE Quicktime player (from Mac) below: http://www.apple.com/quicktime/download/ For you Windows users, the above video will play fine on your latest Media Player. I think the music is ye olde Jane's Addiction and TOOL. kh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjohnsonhp Posted September 17, 2003 Author Share Posted September 17, 2003 Do you think it would be worth bumping up to the MMF-7 from the 5? I got the 5 30-days old like new for $350 so I couldn't resist and unloaded two of my older TT's. I've been selling stuff I dragged out of the closet (old car stereo, CDs and records in cut from the collection, kids toys and games, etc) and have built up some cash for either a CD player or TT. At the moment I'm actually leaning towards the CD player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobile homeless Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 I dont know if I would go the MMF-7 although for all practical purposes it's a big upgrade from the 5 supposedly. Still, there are some other fine tables out there. You sure have been looking for all sorts of things... I thought you were aiming at a CD player all this time. Which Goldring do you have again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 I've heard the MMF-5 and the MMF-7 and there is a difference. Not really sure what to attribute the difference to though. I would bet the biggest difference will be in the cartridge and is also the good % of the price difference . Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOSValves Posted September 17, 2003 Share Posted September 17, 2003 Kelly, What was your final verdict on the Table from Progressive engineering ? I ran into that guy at the asylum and we have been emailing back and forth. He is in the process of rebuilding a set of Mark III's and was asking my advise. He instantly ask me how I had known you since we both had are websites done by you. Craig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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