Tillerman Posted June 27, 2001 Share Posted June 27, 2001 I am finally planning on adding a subwoofer to my system. Here are the details: -Klipsch Chorus Mains (96dB sensitivity) -(1) VMPS Larger Subwoofer w/ carbon fiber woofer option (92dB sensitivity) -16x17x8' room -Initial hookup will be biamped using the VMPS passive crossovers in lowpass mode only (90 Hz and below) with the mains receiving a full range signal. -Future hookup might be biamped with an active crossover. -Current amps would be an Adcom GFA-535 at 60W/channel for the L and R of the 1 subwoofer. An old 70's Sony integrated at 30 W/channel would be used for the Chorus mains. Hookup will be run through my Carver C1 preamp; preamp out 1 to the Adcom/VMPS and preamp out 2 would go to a high level input on the Sony integrated/Chorus. Using the Sony in this way will allow for volume control of the Chorus in order to match downward their level to the less efficient VMPS. What do you think, will this work? I would appreciate comments about this proposed setup. Also, do I have enough amp power for what I am trying to do? FYI, I rarely listen at levels higher than 100dB at ~12' from the speakers. The VMPS Larger subwoofer is listed as -3dB at 17 Hz. Scott ------------------ Definition of an idiot: Noun; Someone who doesn't know something you learned yesterday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted June 30, 2001 Share Posted June 30, 2001 I will take a shot at this one; I personally do not know the VMPS woofers, but I am a fan of the powered sub-woofers sold on clearance (both Klipsch) especially if they are big and ugly (you can get great deals on big and ugly speakers), I think that you will need way more power for the low end, try to find out how low the VMPS will go and if you can what frequency it is most efficient/effective at, the Chorus have good Freq. response down to about 45Hz (in my guess) so that you want a powerful sub that can reach down lower than that, you need very little response above 100 Hz, in my guess, yet that is where a good many moderate price subs extend there frequency range, instead you want most of your sub output to be lower than 100 Hz - that means a powerful and deep reaching sub I am far happier with my 500 watt LF-10, (which has a bump in its freq. response near 40Hz) with my big old horns than I am with my KSW200 (which has 200 watts and a bump in output near 60Hz). The more powerful sub does the better job - it goes deeper and plays more solid, with 700 watts RMS (not counting peak power). I am happy with the sub-woofers that I have. I use a SPL meter and a Test Cd to dial them close to flat response from 250 Hz, down to 25Hz I would look at powered subs with cheap SS amps that can give oodles of cheap power quickly - the output is not as important to me (I never play the stereo much over 100 dB/3 meters) but the depth of the sub-woofer is important: there is a lot of signal down below 100 Hz that requires a lot of amp power - gop to the HSU and SVS sites to see what I mean ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DwK Posted June 30, 2001 Share Posted June 30, 2001 Man do I got the Sub for you... I was at Hillcrest today, and listened to a 15 and 10 inch Veladyne Subwoofers. As the guy I was talking to said.. when I asked how the KSW-15 or the new 15 inch Rference Sub would compare to the Veladyne's , "It would eat theyer lunch" And is was SOOOO right. That 10 hit harder than any other sub I have ever heard.., and the fifteen!!!! MY GOD!!!! The 10 will run you 1500 new And the 15 I think is about 3000 new.. If you got the money, just order it.. No need to try it out. You'll get it, hook it up, and be in AWWW ------------------ Living Room: Yamaha Natural Sound A-500 Stereo Amplifier 2 Klipsch Heresys on A switch 2 Fisher STV-873 on B switch My Room: Klipsch Pro Medias 2 Fisher Surrounds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougdrake2 Posted July 1, 2001 Share Posted July 1, 2001 quote: Originally posted by DwK: Man do I got the Sub for you... I was at Hillcrest today, and listened to a 15 and 10 inch Veladyne Subwoofers. As the guy I was talking to said.. when I asked how the KSW-15 or the new 15 inch Rference Sub would compare to the Veladyne's , "It would eat theyer lunch" And is was SOOOO right. Hmmm - wonder if he is one of the rare few outside of Klipsch that have actually heard the RSW-15?? Wonder what the odds of that are? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DwK Posted July 1, 2001 Share Posted July 1, 2001 Well, I know that as soon as the RF-5 RF-7's and the new RSW arive there, I'll be there listening Then, I can see if the Velodyne is realy better than the RSW. ------------------ Living Room: Yamaha Natural Sound A-500 Stereo Amplifier 2 Klipsch Heresys on A switch 2 Fisher STV-873 on B switch My Room: Klipsch Pro Medias 2 Fisher Surrounds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilH Posted July 2, 2001 Share Posted July 2, 2001 It will be fun to see how many lunches get eaten in the next two months or so... PhilH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DwK Posted July 2, 2001 Share Posted July 2, 2001 Are you mocking? Or.. hinting to us that the new RSW will blow us away? ------------------ Living Room: Yamaha Natural Sound A-500 Stereo Amplifier 2 Klipsch Heresys on A switch 2 Fisher STV-873 on B switch My Room: Klipsch Pro Medias 2 Fisher Surrounds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Garrison Posted July 2, 2001 Share Posted July 2, 2001 Scott, Hummm... no one here seems to have addressed your question, which was how the VMPS Larger would work in your setup in your room. There is at least one person here who uses the VMPS Larger's in their system - John Albright. You can try emailing him at colt4530@home.com or do a search on this board for posts by him, and get a good idea of how well the VMPS Larger Subs work in his setup (he has four La Scalas, last time I checked.) I used to have two of the Larger subs myself, but when I moved the new place didn't have a large enough room to fit 'em. At 16 X 17, you're kind of pushing it... do you know how BIG that thing is? Uh, I don't mean pushing it acoustically - it'll sound GREAT. I mean, you gonna have room for a chair? Another point - the VMPS, being a non-powered design, is going to be limited by the partnering amp. The various powered designs, Klipsch, Velodyne, whatever, will sound as good as they can sound right out of the box. Going with the 535 might be hamstringing the VMPS initially... I was using a PAIR of GFA-555 bridged into mono, one for each sub. That was barely enough (at that time I had a pair of B&W 801F original series, also being driven by bridged 555s.) While 100dB at 12 feet may not sound like a lot (at least, not in this forum ), getting 100dB at, say, 25 Hz in your room with the VMPS sub is going to take some serious current. Not sure the 535 will be up to it. Try chatting with Clark Johnsen at the Listening Studio in Boston. He's an old hand at VMPS. Ray ------------------ Music is art Audio is engineering Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tillerman Posted July 2, 2001 Author Share Posted July 2, 2001 Ray, Thanks for your reply. I have the VMPS ordered. I am going to try the GFA-535 for the time being. I should be able to determine amplifier performance by monitoring the clipping indicators on the amp. If more power is indicated, then I will start shoppong on eBay. I have the perfect spot in my room and wife approval! For the others who do not know, the VMPS Larger is 23x32x19" (HxWxD). It is -3dB at 17hz, 92dB sensitivity. It is a passive subwoofer that I will initially be running with 2 VMPS passive crossovers with a 90hz low pass. It has a 12" and a 15" active drivers and a 15" passive radiator in a BIG cabinet. No denying the laws of physics here! I ordered it with the Mega woofer option which means that the 12 and 15" drivers will be the carbon fiber drivers with stacked magnets. This increases power handling and reduces the -3dB point to 15hz. Scott ------------------ Definition of an idiot: Noun; Someone who doesn't know something you learned yesterday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete C Posted July 2, 2001 Share Posted July 2, 2001 The Classic specs show more efficiency for the Chorus loudspeakers. 96dB is the Heresey, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tillerman Posted July 3, 2001 Author Share Posted July 3, 2001 The factory lists the Chorus efficiency at 101dB. The Stereo Review article tested them at 96dB if I remember correctly. Scott ------------------ Definition of an idiot: Noun; Someone who doesn't know something you learned yesterday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnA Posted July 3, 2001 Share Posted July 3, 2001 Time for me to chime in, it seems. I have 2 of the older Larger Subwoofers in the vertical cabinet. Due to a past session with my air guitar, they now have a set of Mega woofers in them. Mine are powered by an Acurus A-250, capable of about 450 watts per channel into each sub (@ 4 ohms). That's not too much power. Scott, you'll eventually want to get lots more power, for the time being, it will work. I'd also recommend getting a pair of 40 of 50 Hz low-pass F-mods from Harrison Labs to use as your "electronic" crossovers and bypassing the internal crossovers. F-mods plug into the amp's inputs and the interconnect plugs into them; they're neat. 90 Hz is too high for the Chorus so you'll have a big bass hump where the two overlap. "Mr. Scott, I need more power!" Start saving for a gorilla amp, like that 555. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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