Kyler Cavers Posted April 21, 2004 Share Posted April 21, 2004 Pathetic, So today I go downtown to my local #&$*$@ Klipsch dealer and bring an ol'bass test cd to hear on the RSW-12 (which I've talked so much about). My original plan was to pick it up on friday after school but after what I heard today, I'm not so sure. Im assuming the dumbies there don't know how to hook up a goddamn system.... anyway I slap in the "2 fast 2 furious" soundtrack and he turns it up to about -50 to -38 db on a Pioneer VSX-41 with the low pass xover on the sub set to about 110 I think.. ( I didn't want to adjust it as the salesmen would have blacked thinking I don't know dink all about stereos). The very first thing I noticed was the unbarable noise it made. It was as though the sub was bottoming out at a surprisingly low volume, the whole box made a sick noise as though it couldn't handle it and was pushin way the heck over it's limit. My friend described it as if the cones were "slapping" beyond their max excursion. This was all on the higher frequency notes, I didn't notice anything on the lower extension, but after hearing this the sales dude turned the bass on the receiver from plus 6 to 0, wth for! This is a 2000 sub with a 625 watt bash amp and it's bottoming out way before my towers would even start to clip? Im upset, If I'm taken a brand new out of the box Klipsch (REFERENCE) sub and it makes what I would describe as being boomy without an irritating port noise which seems incorrect, then I'm going to lose some respect for Klipsch and go for a damn SVS B4 Plus and a Crown XLS 602!!! Someone on this forum such as "EAR" please tell me what you think with your detailed background on subs what the heck this was. Sure it was a floor model which had crappy cables and the crossover might not have been adjusted properly but I know what I heard and I wanted to puke. Of course I could be super deadly over reacting here because I've never read about the RSW-12 being a distorion full sub with no authority and I expect more for my grocery baggin money so please.............enlighten me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sivadselim Posted April 22, 2004 Share Posted April 22, 2004 ummm..........................wtf is the question exactly? was it connected and run with the proper settings on the receiver or not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAS Posted April 22, 2004 Share Posted April 22, 2004 My opinion is that they probably did have the thing connected/configured/calibrated wrong for the setup. After all, they probably had a switchboard that could connect any piece of equipment to any of the others, therefore you cannot properly keep any single piece of equipment calibrated/configured with the rest. But in my opinion, I've never really heard a Klipsch sub that impressed me at the dealer. I know exactly what you're talking about. That's what initially turned me off from Klipsch for subs. I obviously later heard many of them in propper applications and my opinion was changed slightly. There's just something a bit boomy and and weak about them that doesn't appeal to me; maybe it's the front firing drivers, or the small enclosure, or a range of characteristics. With the RSW-15 being the only exception, I just don't see much in them for the price I'd have to pay. Personally, I'd rather try to make my own. But I know I've offended a large number of people already so I'll stop here. Look around and surf the net. Listen to those who've purchased lots of different brands. You'll start to get a idea of where to go for what you want Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phatbass Posted April 23, 2004 Share Posted April 23, 2004 It was room acoustics and then the crossover being set wrong. Poor room acoustics will make any sub sound bad, no matter how good it is. Standing waves , room nodes and nulls are the worst for subs. And then the crossover was set to high, and you should have asked him to set it around 80 or to wherever you have yours set right now. I would still recomend the SVS over the klispch any day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
formica Posted April 23, 2004 Share Posted April 23, 2004 ---------------- On 4/21/2004 11:27:32 PM Kyler Cavers wrote: ... to hear on the RSW-12 (which I've talked so much about)... I'm going to lose some respect for Klipsch and go for a damn SVS B4 Plus and a Crown XLS 602!!! ---------------- Are those two subs really in the same category??? PRICE, SIZE, and OUTPUT seem to be very different between those two... So given that choice Id go with the B4 as well. On the other hand, RSW-12 is a decent sub compared to similar subs... and I suppose the stores setup was far from being ideal (or simply poor). I believe avoiding this is why Klipsch insists their reference products be sold by authorised dealers only... but there are always some which will slip through the cracks and become authorised. Its unfortunate that the experience didnt live up to what it could have... Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Posted April 23, 2004 Share Posted April 23, 2004 "There's just something a bit boomy and and weak about them that doesn't appeal to me; maybe it's the front firing drivers, or the small enclosure, or a range of characteristics. " The RSW's are rear firing with a forward passive radiator. Set-up must have been bad. I have the RSW-12 and it sounds great. I've had other subs that didn't hold up nearly as well. Like all subs, you have to move it around and play with the settings - all subs can sound like crap, only the good ones can sound good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garymd Posted April 23, 2004 Share Posted April 23, 2004 Something was either wrong with the setup or the sub. My RSW12 kicks a$$. I've owned a couple different subs and this is the real deal. Music OR movies. I'm not saying it's the best but it certainly isn't as you described. Try again or bring one home to try with your system. I'd bet the house that you'd come away with a different opinion. BTW - No need for vulgar language. We get your point without it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinipig523 Posted April 24, 2004 Share Posted April 24, 2004 ---------------- On 4/23/2004 11:46:45 PM garymd wrote: BTW - No need for vulgar language. We get your point without it. ---------------- one thing i noticed recently is that with all these newbies around - they are always swearing or being vulgar... wtf, wth... or what have you. i dont think it is appropriate for such an otherwise upstanding forum. i hate to say it, but i am frequenting HTF or HTS more so than here because of the lack of respect between members - especially the new ones. go down to the promedia section - it is sick down there. up here in the HT section, it isnt as bad but sometimes, i feel that it might be getting there. please refrain from using vulgar language - this is an upstanding forum, treat it with respect. now, back to the topic - the rsw should not sound anything remotely like that... something is either wrong with the setup, or the rsw might have been blown by previous demos. seems to me like you have newbies running the speaker store. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyler Cavers Posted April 24, 2004 Author Share Posted April 24, 2004 Alright well thanks for the reply's I didn't think that a reference sub would be as bad as that and I apologize for the swearing (It would be nice if I had someone local dealers who knew really what they were doing and how to set something up). I was angry because they think they can cheat me by saying "it's just those sp-1's going past their limit when in fact I heard the same noise after he disabled those litte powered 8"'s, they knew it was a crappy setup. They think a big 2300 dollar price tag just says take it without trying, pppfttt Thanks again guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinipig523 Posted April 24, 2004 Share Posted April 24, 2004 kyler - look into svs, they also make real good subs. unless u are set on the rsw, which has a lot of punch as well and is a sealed enclosure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fire pinch Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 "with the low pass xover on the sub set to about 110 I think.. " If this is the case, I find that the crossover was set really too high!!! The mid-bass should be handled by the floorstanders IMHO so all the power used by the subwoofer is more used for lower frequencies. Im pretty sure that this was due to the high crossover setting! When I turn up my low pass from 50 to 100 Hz for example with my Tumult subwoofer, I find that Im loosing the extra super punch I get around 40 Hz. This is because all the amp power is used for higher frequencies. I would go again to the store and try to reduce the crossover point (you or the salesman). Be sure that if the low pass is set at 60 Hz for example, that the towers will play down to 60 Hz too, very important if you dont want to miss the mid-bass punch from the towers. And dont be shy in front of the salesmans, afterall, they souldnt be agressive if their goal is to sale their subwoofers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndyKlipschFan Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 Go re read GaryMD post. We have a lot of trollers that just like to stir up controversry on here. You can't compare a sub say at 600-800 dollars to one costing 2300. Move up to the RSW15 at least to compare with the one 2300 worth. I have the RSW15 sub in my house, stated many, many times in here by myself and DeanG and others. This is just an unbelieveable great sub with fantastic lows, a clean and solid thump factor, no distortion, and is good with music and dvd's too. One thing to consider with all Klipsch speakers, if you do not like what is going in (if it is distorted because it is recorded that way too) it will sound like crap coming out too. I usually guess when this is followed by a SVS comment like the SVS did not do this or that, I become curious... SVS has no store to demo them side by side for one. They are mail order and how would you compare different models of SVS anyhow to know what it or any other SVS sub sounds like? I really doubt any stereo store would let you or anyone else bring a SVS sub into the store to do a A/B comparison anyohow as well. Even if you did, again, it might be highly controversial as to the results. It is not that I am bashing SVS, understand my point here... We have nothing to compare them too, except people that empty their wallets of cash often without comparing them to Klipsch.(They get married to the idea..often trading up or sideways with every new model too, wasn't your first SVS ok???) and sing praises without really IMO getting the also propper Klipsch sub to compare it to. I suggest the sub by klipsch was set up wrong at your store. IMO Or the source material sucked.. My 2 cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleve Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 Something is very wrong here - I've never heard my RW-12 'bottom' out on anything, no matter how loud I turn it up, and RSW-12 you were testing is a much better sub. Besides, music isn't nearly as demanding on really deep bass as DTS or 5.1 movies. In my system, the RW-12 reaches a maximum loudness, and just won't output any more (one of the niceties of integral driver/amp design), but it does so gracefully, with no sounds of distress. Oh, and to Pinipig523 - all the vulgarity in the ProMedia forums doesn't surprise me. That's just computer and gam3r 'd00d's' and hax0rs l33t speek for you. I usually don't read those forums, but I took a glance and got a chuckle out of the atrocious, profane language on display there - "OMFG, Klisph rul3z and ownz u all!!!' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fire pinch Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 This is why I am so sure that the crossover setting had something to do... Just at home, when Im testing different crossover points with my subwoofers (I have two different), if I set it too highly (100-120 Hz for example), I turn up the volume until the amp reach its limit and I dont get as much felt power, I can say that I get far less punch and TRUE bass (below 40 Hz). Don't you think all that this is quite logical? The amp in that case just waste too much of its power for mid bass and upper bass... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chops Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 If you want some truely musical bass that is perfectly fitting for both music and movies, I strongly suggest that you consider building a pair of these. Check out the link below........ http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=14179 This is a thread I started almost a year ago. I have learned alot from that little project and can honestly say that these are the best sounding subs I have ever heard, and I have listened to lots and lots of subs over the years. It would be a good idea to read the whole thing sometime when you're bored. And here's a link right to my website with even more pictures of the subs..... http://chops.tzo.com/index.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikekid Posted April 25, 2004 Share Posted April 25, 2004 I wonder if that "demo" sub was damaged in some way. I have heard more than one blown speaker/sub in demo rooms before........ Just a thought. Take care Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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