Question for Bob G or Klipsch Lawyer ;-)

[Obsidian]

I was wondering if Klipsch had any policy regarding selling their products online?

Furthermore, can an authorized dealer sell their products over the web?

Are ALL the authorized dealers in your online database?

If a person buys their speakers from eBay and they are new (unopened) can the buyer still exercise the warranty?

Is there any place to find this information?

Im asking because of a horrible experience I had at an Audio King in Roseville Minnesota. The Klipsch sales rep there was either lying to me or was lied to by their Klipsch representative. Supposedly (according to this sales rep) Klipsch doesnt allow sales of their product online. In fact according to him Klipsch doesnt sell their products online at all obviously this isnt the case if youve ever seen the web store.

But, does Klipsch allow the sale of their product online? If there was a brick and mortar store that was selling Klipsch speakers via the web would this be illegal or against Klipsch policy somehow? Are there any Authorized Klipsch Dealers with web stores?

Oddly enough the Audio King that I was at isnt even listed in the authorized dealer listing. Does this mean they arent authorized dealers?

Sorry for all the legal questions

[dougdrake2]

Do a search on the entire forum using the keywords "internet policy" and you'll get about 6 threads dealing with the topic. I think this one:

http://216.37.9.58/ubb/Forum9/HTML/000757.html

even has a copy of the letter Klipsch sent to the dealers.

DD

[WMcD]

Okay, I'm not Bob G. or a Klipsch lawyer, or any representative of Klipsch.

But this comes up with some frequency (ahem).

My first question is whether there is a written warranty in the box; and if so, exactly what does it state?

After that, there may be other questions, and legal issues, particularly based on the Uniform Commercial Code. But why not start with any written statement shipped along with the product.

Can any buyer out there cite to the language?

Gil

[Mighty Favog]

Gil,

I'm not a lawyer either but I do work for alot of them. You may want to look at the Magnuson Moss Act of (I think) 1977 or so. This is only to bring up the point that manufacturers don't always HAVE to put warranty info in the packaging of their products. It may have some other useful tid bits to clarify things. They do, however, have to list the name and address of the manufacturer (I know, that's not a point right now). So it can be said that it has to be made available. Kinda like McDonalds is required to have a list of the nutritional values of their food. Sure, ask anyone there if they know where THAT is much less the acknowledgement of it's existance. I'm not bashing Klipsch for this but it does seem to have a lot of people confused.

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Tom

KLF-20 Mahogany

McIntosh C33

McIntosh MVP-841

Rotel RB-1080

Yamaha PF-800 Turntable/ Sure V15 Type V Cartridge

Ortofon VMS-30 mkII Cartridge

Stanton 999SS Cartridge

Yamaha K-1020 Cassette

dbx 1231 EQ

H.H. Scott 830z Analyzer

Monster Interlink 400mk II

Monster Interlink 300mk II

Studio Tech U-48RW Cabinet

Monster Power HTS-5000

Original 12ga. Monster Cable

Enough empty boxes for a fire hazard!

This message has been edited by tblasing on 08-24-2001 at 09:23 PM

[boa12]

from the volumes i've read on this here i thought it apparent that it really comes down to state law. but even there trying to get a manufacturer to honor an express warranty where certain of their conditions are not met could be costly. the best rule seems to be if the warranty is important to u then buy only from authorized dealers or those that have their own solid return policy.

i think the only online dealer that can sell new, fully

warranted klipsch outside of a specified geographic territiory & thereby authorized by klipsch is ubid.

[DoubleJ]

Obsidian:

The Audio King Stores, as I understand it, are Authorized Dealers but under their parent company, Ultimate Electronics.

I'm sorry to hear that you have had bad experience with Audio King. I have had nothing but great service at their Roseville location but you sure have to haggle alot to get them to come down in price.

Jon

[Guest BobG]

All Audio King / Ultimate Electronics stores are Authorized Klipsch Dealers in good standing. Great company and if you've had a bad experience, I am certain the store manager or regional manager wants to know. They run a really good operation.

Klipsch is working to list all authorized dealers on our dealer locator so potential customers can discern an authorized dealer from a pirate. The locator continues to receive updates and any missed listings will be promptly posted if you wish to identify them. This is a very big but also very important responsibility of Klipsch.

You will also soon see a clearly worded statement regarding internet dealers. It will be posted to this site and very easy to find. Should be up in a week or so.

[Obsidian]

I just wanted to thank everyone for the responses. I also wanted to say that I usually have great experiences at Audio King stores. In Minnesota they are really the only place that I can get my audiophile fix. I purchased my first pair of KLF-20s from that particular store seven years ago. I even spent $2500 a month ago on a nice Sony 36 TV. So its not like I let one argumentative sales rep ruin my experience there.

I needed a little more clarity on the internet sales policy. It looks like I should be able to get one in a few weeks with all the legal jargon that goes along with it. thanks Bob

Im not particularly worried about a warranty with Klipsch speakers. All of my friends own Klipsch speakers. Ive got two sets of them in my house now. Ive never had a problem with any of them. None of us have ever needed to replace a driver or repair any of them. It seems to me that the speakers are designed to outlast their relatively short warranty.

I ordered a KLF-C7 and RS-3s over the internet about a year ago. Ive had no problems with them either and I dont expect any. But it sounds like I wouldnt be able to make any claim under warranty anyway. But I got them for under half of retail price, and I couldn't ignore the oppertunity to get them at that time.

Im curious why an immensely respected company like Klipsch wouldnt stand behind their speakers even if they were sold via the web (provided they were only registered by one owner new). It seems to me that I should be able to buy a new Klipsch product from any place and have the company stand behind it. I dont know what the issue would be other than maybe delivery (but then the shipper is to blame for damage).

I understand the control-freak mentality over products if you are trying to gain some exclusivity and thus perceived prestige. It seems to me that volume sales would be more beneficial to all of your customers, and increase your market share at the same time.

Would it really cost Klipsch a lot more money to stand behind their new speakers with a warranty? I cant imagine such well build speakers would have so many problems within the 5 year period.

Thanks again for all the comments. I love Klipsch speakers and I really like Audio King. There is always that chance that you will run into that bad sales person or two

This message has been edited by Obsidian on 08-27-2001 at 11:40 AM

[Clint Phare]

Obsidian-

Dump Audio King and drive to Richfield and visit Audio Perfection instead. Granted they don't carry Klipsch, but they have real audiophile gear for real audiophiles! You could also go to Minnetonke to Great Plains. Audio King is a mid- fi Best Buy. Go somewhere who knows Klipsch- I don't know where that is, but know it's not Audio King.

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Just who is Dylan's Jokerman anyways?

[boomer9911]

I must agree, from everything that I have "bought", "owned", Klipsch is the first product(along side Adcom) that I have said, what warranty.................

[Saucey]

So I can buy my wide screen, A/V receiver, DVD, etc. online at great savings (all manufacturer warranties included). In fact I am able to upgrade to much better gear because of the money I save buying online. This makes me and my whole family very happy.

Now, I wouldn't even be able to afford Klipsch Reference if it wasn't for the online savings.

My plea to Klipsch: Please let me buy them and don't exclude online vendors. I'd much prefer having Klipsch over every other speaker (all other brands already offered online).

Thank You

[cc1091]

For what its worth, the Audio King that I am most familiar with (and the Audio King the also keeps the Klipsch products in the worst condition of any Audio King I've seen) is the Woodbury store. Klipsch speakers with twisted aluminum drivers, broken grilles, gashes in the edges, and wired using the cheapest wire they could find. To hear that the Roseville store is not much better is no surprise. In fact the Edina Store is not great. The Minnetonka store is about as good as they get. To hear BobG say that the Audio King/Ultimate Electronics franchise is one "in good standing" with Klipsch irritates me. Must be a shear volume of sales judgement. Yes, they are very similar to a Best Buy except they have maintained their focus on mid-fi stereo equipment and televisions. They seem very lax on their support for Klipsch though.

Audio Perfection is a true hi-end audiophile store. (possibly the only store in the country that carries the full line of Atma-Sphere triode amps) Their sales staff is too snooty for me though.

I would reccommend Hi-Fi Sound in downtown Minneapolis for sales staff alone. Unfortunately, they don't have Klipsch speakers either (and owner says,"I wouldn't allow a Klipsch speaker in the store."). Still somewhat snooty, but tolerable.

[Obsidian]

I'll have to check out Audio Perfection because I'm not going back into the Roseville Audio King ever again.

I went in today to the Roseville store in order to check out line conditioners and the prick sales representative was there. He told me that Klipsch would never sell their products online (and specifically not their computer speakers). At least he remembered me ... but it was just so he could be a dick.

It's like he doesn't know what the internet is, or that Klipsch even has a web site! Ever try telling someone that water is wet only to have them tell you it's not?!?

I don't get it. I thought he was just being an *** because he could ... who knows. Regardless, now there are at least three other people (my coworkers that were with me this last time) that are never going to buy from Audio King again. We're all web developers and we have all been to www.klipsch.com at some time or another. Two of us own KLF-20s and love them.

None of us could believe that this sales rep was such an ***. Since no brick and mortar store can beat the prices online they should be trying to win over consumers with kindness and customer service. ... oh well, maybe I'm wrong? Maybe people go to stores to be talked down to and told what they should buy? ... not me ...

It's a shame that one misinformed and condescending sales rep was responsible for loosing that much business for the store.

Could some one please talk to the Minnesota Klipsch Representative to inform these people? That's just horrible customer service.

This message has been edited by Obsidian on 08-29-2001 at 11:48 PM

[Clint Phare]

cc1091 wrote " I would reccommend Hi-Fi Sound in downtown Minneapolis for sales staff alone. Unfortunately,they don't have Klipsch speakers either (and owner says,"I wouldn't allow a Klipsch speaker in the store.")." Still somewhat snooty, but tolerable. "

I was at HI- Fi with a friend to lives, eats and sleeps Klipsch. I was buying a used Thornes turntable when the salesman asked me what speakers I had. I told him Klipsch Heresy's. The salesman told me I could do much better than that and at that point I thought world war III was about to break out! My friend and the sales guy were in a heated angry battle about Klipsch. I honestly thought fists were going to fly! I tried to get my friend to just leave, but no use. I went and put my turntable in my car and had a smoke and waited for my friend outside. So, if you go to Hi- Fi, leave the Klipsch name at home. They are a good store and I would say they are passionate about stereo gear!

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Just who is Dylan's Jokerman anyways?

[PhilH]

Obsidian:

I always emphasize that if a customer feels that they have been treated poorly by a salesperson, or something else is not right, THE CUSTOMER THEMSELVES must immediately inform the manager of that store of the situation. In my eight years in retail store management, there was nothing more effective than hearing about a problem right away by the customer who has that problem. No matter how hard you try as a manager, problems occur, and any good manager will want to hear about one as soon as possible so that it can be corrected properly. If the manager you talk to does not remedy the situation, you simply move up to his/her boss.

As BobG said (who also has tons of experience as a manager) Ultimate is a company in good standing who does care...let someone there know how you feel!!