aviserated Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 It does not get anybetter than this! Here's my future buy list: Playstation 3 (plays Blue-Ray DVD's, DVD's, SACD, and PS3 games in true 1080p) 1080p 40" LCD TV with LED backlighting 1080p HDMI Receiver HDMI cables Klipsch speakers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damonrpayne Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 Sounds like a nice setup, I can't wait to run my PS3 in 720p up to my projector for some 106" gaming action. Good luck getting one this year though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCOOTERDOG Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 Xbox 360 also now available with an external HD DVD drive. The drive is priced at 199.99 at most stores. Big talk over on the avs board about hooking this up though a htpc. What I would like to see is the pc drives for both fomats come way down in price. If MS was smart they would make there HD DVD Xbox system become seamless with a pc. Just think how many pc users out there would jump on this..I would scooter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviserated Posted November 13, 2006 Author Share Posted November 13, 2006 XBox 360 with external HD DVD delivers signal in 1080i. 1080i is inferior to Sony's Playstation 3 1080p signal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIbor Posted November 13, 2006 Share Posted November 13, 2006 I wouldnt say 1080i is inferior. I have seen 1080p and it wasnt that much better than 1080i. 95 percent of the people who will buy playstation 3 will never hook it up for 1080p or even able to. Most will hook it with a signle rca cable. I bet you couldnt even tell the difference in quality for a game between 1080i and 1080p I plan one making no jump to the hd dvds till the format wars is done. Reminds me of vhs vs betamax. my upscaling denon looks great to me in 1080i. Besides xbox is the way to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tommyboy Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 Sounds real good. All I need is the playstation 3. Might be a while though. I just dropped $600 on a new receiver, which does have the HDMI input though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrMcGoo Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 The idea that 1080P is superior to 1080i is Sony propaganda. The chipset in the PS3 deinterlaces a 1080i signal in the box. A disk is 1080P, the PS3 processes it as 1080i and the runs it back to 1080P. Many 1080P displays have a better deinterlacer, plus, the added steps do not increase quality. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviserated Posted November 14, 2006 Author Share Posted November 14, 2006 I plan one making no jump to the hd dvds till the format wars is done. Reminds me of vhs vs betamax. my upscaling denon looks great to me in 1080i. Who won the war between SACD vs. DVD Audio? Are they both dead now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJkizak Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 MrMcGoo: I don't know about Play Station 3 bluray but On the Sony XSRD 1080P HDTV with a Sony 1080p demo the difference between 1080i and 1080p is absolutely staggering. The same on the Mitsubishi 1080p and the Runco 1080p projection system. The 1080p HDTV's have 2.1 million pixels and the 720p sets (1080i) have 960 thousand pixels. So I guess you can say that my "eyes" do not agree with your statements. JJK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 "I don't know about Play Station 3 bluray but On the Sony XSRD 1080P HDTV with a Sony 1080p demo the difference between 1080i and 1080p is absolutely staggering. " Do not trust demo discs. You feed any digital TV a 1080i signal and it is going to deinterlace the signal back to 1080p. The quality of deinterlacing varies but any current 1080p sets likely will do a proper 3:2 pulldown to get back to 1080p flawlessly without artifacts and at full resolution. "The 1080p HDTV's have 2.1 million pixels and the 720p sets (1080i) have 960 thousand pixels." A 720p set is not a 1080i set. It simply accepts a 1080i signal, deinterlaces it and then scales down to 720p to display it. For digital displays (LCD, DLP, DILA/ LCOS/SXRD) there is no such thing as an interlaced display. They always display progressive. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erickoegle Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 I'm camping out for a PS3 to ebay it after thanksgiving. Hopefully Ill pull a pretty penny, they are on ebay now for about $2k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJkizak Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 Sfogg: My "eyes" do not accept anything you are saying. JJK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 "My "eyes" do not accept anything you are saying. " Read up on how a digital display works and you will know none of them display interlaced signals, they simply don't work that way. They convert anything interlaced back to progressive and then if needed scale to their native panel resolution. Your BluRay player isn't feeding native 1080p off the disc to the display either. The chips in the current BluRay players ca not support it. All they do is take 1080i, then deinterlace it internally and spit it out as 1080p. Any 1080p display will do the exact same thing with a true 1080i input. All that is different is where the deinterlacing occurs. That is why you can't trust demo discs. It is a propaganda. For all you know Sony threw away half the resolution on what they claim is the 1080i signal. Or they in effect send a 1080i signal to a display but frame it as 1080p (basically make it 540p) which would keep the display from deinterlacing the 1080i back to progressive and artifically inducing differences that wouldn't be there in regular use. When the Sony demo was claiming to show 1080i was the display saying it was receiving 1080i or 1080p? Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Professor.Ham.Slap Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 Actually, Sfogg is right. 1080i vs 1080p does not matter when you are discussing movies (and those demo discs are a bunch of propaganda BS (I mean, the "1080i section" is still being sent in 1080p. That's all computer simulated and gives the designers a lot of room to exagerate). Basically movies are encoded in 1080p at 24 frames per second. The two most popular 1080p flavors are 1080p @ 60fps and and 1080p @ 30fps. So now if you take that 1080p @ 24 signal and de-interlace it and send it to the TV at 1080i @ 60fps and realize that every two frames will give you one full progressive screen (which once again is what all digital displays MUST actually display on the screen) you end up with 1080p @ 30fps. Since 30fps is still more than 24fps, you are getting the full 1080p to the television. Hence, Sony's marketing machine is full of crap once again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelendral Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 The 1080p HDTV's have 2.1 million pixels and the 720p sets (1080i) have 960 thousand pixels. So I guess you can say that my "eyes" do not agree with your statements. To clarify you are not comparing 1080i and 1080p here. You are comparing 720p and 1080p 1080i and 1080p are the same 1920x1080. One is interlaced meaning only half the horizontal resolution is shown at any one time. Whereas with progressive all 1920x1080 is show with every refresh. On a 1080p television you will see very little to no difference between a proper 1080i and 1080p signal assuming the deinterlacing algorithm is any good and doesn't just drop half the resolution to arrive at the progressive output. Just because a 720p television accepts 1080i that does not turn it into a 1080 set. As others have also pointed out the PS3 and all current Blu-Ray players do not do true 1080p yet as they work internally process as 1080i and then convert to 1080p. The same can be said for the HDXA2 HD-DVD from Toshiba. Considering that most high-end 1080p televisions have much better quality scalers you would be better off with using the internal processed 1080i and then letting your 1080p television do the conversion from 1080i to 1080p. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJkizak Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 Kelendral: You are correct. I should have stated viewing 1080i on a 720p set verses a 1080P set. JJK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetJockey Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 1080P is NOT propaganda! I do not own one piece of Sony gear. What basis do you say 1080 p is not better? I know why, because you haven't seen 1080P on a 1080P Display. What nonsense! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetJockey Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 1080P is NOT propaganda! I do not own one piece of Sony gear. What basis do you say 1080 p is not better? I know why, because you haven't seen 1080P on a 1080P Display. If thats the case, then all these progressive scan dvd players which convert interlaced to full scan were propaganda as well. What nonsense! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damonrpayne Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 The 1080p debate is all over the internet right now, a little googling will reward you greatly. If a display is doing 3-2 pulldown then there will be no discernable difference between 1080i and 1080p. But, Sony has gotten a bad rap lately, many people are too busy player-hating on Sony to realize they are still producing some excellent technology. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfogg Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 "What basis do you say 1080 p is not better?" Better then what? 480i? Of course it is better. Better then telecined 1080i on a digital display? No, it isn't... not if 3:2 pulldown is performed on 1080i... if that occurs you end up with exactly the same thing. Learn how 1080p material can be encoded into 1080i such that when it is deinterlaced you are exactly back where you started. Your CRT likely displays 1080i in its interlaced state. Compared to 1080p on the same display (if it can handle it) 1080p is going to look better. Notice how all the talk so far has been about digital displays? That is because you feed a 1920x1080 digital display a 1080i signal and before it displays it it will deinterlace the signal to 1080p. "If thats the case, then all these progressive scan dvd players which convert interlaced to full scan were propaganda as well." When used on a digital display even if you feed them interlaced the signal ends up getting deinterlaced anyway. The difference is in the quality of the deinterlacers in the TV vs. in the player. Not the same thing compared to an analog CRT which will display 480i directly without the mandatory deinterlacing that occurs in any digital display. BTW... upconverting DVD players *can* be a load of propoganda too. My favorite is those that used them on native 480p digital displays and set their DVD players to 720p (or 1080i) output. In that case for 720p the player is deinterlacing from 480i to 480p then scaling to 720p and spitting it out. The display accepts the 720p and then rescales the picture back down to 480p. The more you scale the more likely to have artifacts as anyone that has setup 1:1 pixel mapping with external scalers will tell you. I can post screen shots I have made of some of the artifacts of double scaling if you like. Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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