How is a pro rig wired up?

[Coytee]

On a very simplistic level...

Take a single player, guitar guy...

He has a wire going to his guitar and another to his mic.

These wires go? (and this is my question?)

Do the wires go to HIS little amplifier and to HIS monitor? Is the sound THEN picked up by microphone at HIS speaker to re-amplify it out to the larger crowd?

Or, do the wires go from his guitar and mic, into a "Y" splitter which is THEN fed back into his monitors and the other leg goes to the main output?

I've seen microphones infront of speakers while the speakers are on stage so that infers to me the prior scenario...

Just what IS the signal path from say, guitar pick, to the performers ear, AS WELL, as the ear of an audience member?

[8-)]

[Trey Cannon]

Here you go...

ax to amp

from amp (via mic in front or DI box in back) to mixer

((DI box is a converter from un-balanced to balanced connection))

from Vocal Mic to mixer

Mixer takes all inputs and "mixes them together" and sends them back to amps

Most of the time 1 amp is for the mains / front of house and the other is for the monitors on stage.

[Trey Cannon]

http://www.prosoundweb.com/install/commentary/kc/ev/pabible/pab_01_p1whole.shtml

[Trey Cannon]

[mas]

Trey,

May I also add that it is also common practice to run an additional line from a mic for the guitar players amp in the example via the 'snake' to the mixer, where the signal from the DI is mixed with the mic'ed signal.

While this is not normally done in a small 'combo' setup, it is much more common (the norm) in larger SR productions and in the studio for recording.

[Trey Cannon]

very true

[Coytee]

Ok, so without you butchering me for my bad use of terms... then it's fair for me to look at it as a "Y" adapter ?

Meaning, the sound from all, goes to a single place (mixer) and then is split FROM the mixer back to the performer with the other leg, going to the audience.

Why is there at times, a microphone in front of an on stage speaker that might be BEHIND the performers? (aren't the only monitors in front of them?)

I can't specifically say where I've seen that but I know I have. I've never understood what was going on there. I am now presuming it doesn't have anything to do with my original question? (meaning, THAT location (mic in front of little speaker) isn't the pickup point for the sound to the crowd)

[Trey Cannon]

http://www.saecollege.de/reference_material/pages/Guitars%20elec.htm

[DrWho]

The mixer is not a Y-Adapter by any means....think of it as a routing

and mixing device. You can send the signal of any input to any output.

You also have the option of sending multiple inputs to any of the same

outputs which is where the and "mix- and matching" takes place. Every

channel behaves independant of each other as well as every output

behaves independant of each other.

They call it "live sound reinforcement" because the purpose of

the sound system is to 'reinforce' the sound of the band. Even a huge

Marshall stack or two isn't going to properly fill the acoustical space

in even a small venue - it may have the right timbre, but it doesn't

have the necessary dispersion pattern (unlike your Jubilees that have a

very flat coverage pattern). So along comes the sound guy to reinforce

the sound of the musician by capturing the sound on stage right in

front of the amp (where it sounds the best) and then spreading it to

the rest of the venue.

Rarely (I wanna say never but there's always exceptions) do you ever

run the mic'ed guitar amp channel into the monitors on stage - 99% of

the time his guitar amp is going to be too loud and the last thing you

want to do is introduce comb-filtering, which will only reduce clarity

and make it seem not as loud (causing him to turn up even louder....).

If he needs to hear more guitar, then tell him to turn up []

(scariest thing ever - so usually you try to turn everything down in

his monitor to achieve the same effect before telling him to turn up).

Mic'ing the singer however is a different story...no way in heck his

voice is going to carry even into the front row, let alone him being

able to hear himself. The vocals are usually the loudest thing in all

the monitors since that's where the focus of most music tends to reside.

Because the sound board can mix and match it's outputs independant of

the other channels, we can send the vocals to the monitors without

sending the guitars to the monitors. However, both the vocal and the

guitar are going to be sent to the "FOH" (Front Of House - the main

speakers for the big sound system). The relative volume of the vocal

and guitar are going to be fully adjustable without affecting the

volume in the monitors (prefade). Or if you'd like, you can have the

monitors change with the changes in the FOH (postfade). If you want to

be a bit more crazy you can assign whatever channels you want to a

subgroup where you can adjust the volume of all those channels at once

in the FOH (for instance you want to turn down the 8 channels of drum

mics all at once). Or you can be a bit crazier and use VCA's to control

the volume in the monitors with the subgroup faders.

Or my favorite setup....you can run a series of choir mics into a

subgroup with a parametric EQ on the insert that splits its output

between the subgroup return and an effects unit, while running a VCA

through another aux send feeding another seperate effects unit. Return

both effects racks to their own channels on the board, feed their

output into another subgroup with another parametric EQ on the insert,

and then it all gets mixed back into the FOH for a huge feedback free

choir. [][H] But we're not done yet...the choir and choir effects

subgroups are mixed into a matrix that gets sent to another rack of

processing, EQ, and then an amp that powers another mains on the sides

and back of the auditorium - all to add just a touch of fullness to the

sound.

I don't think you can do all that with a "Y-adapter" cable []

[colterphoto1]

I think he's using y-adapter in place of DI box.

The DI box is a box in stage that accepts the guitar's 1/4" plug, has output in 1/4" to go directly to the onstage guitar amp. Also has XLR plug for DIRECT input into the mixer. I'd say here that this direct/mic'd approach is used more with bass guitar and keyboard instruments.

WIth a guitar, there are many effects boxes, tubes in amps, and even the specific speaker cones that contribute to the 'sound' of the guitar. So this sound from the on stage amp is frequently mic'd and sent to the mixer board.

Especially for bass guitar, a blend of the direct signal from the bass and a mic'd signal gives some 'thickening ' of the sound, and is much richer than either direct or the sound coming from the stage amp.

As bands get better, they learn to rely more on the monitor mixer's abilities to provide each musician with his own custom mix through the onstage monitor system and rely's less on mountains of amps and speakers onstage to be heard. The guy mixing the monitors becomes an integral part of the band at that point.

M