darkside Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 Ok, this will take a long time to explain, so everyone please bear with me as I really need some help on this one. The Equipment: A harmankardon HK 3380 and two RF-15s The Situation: One RF may be blown and the speaker one amp may be shot TheExplanation: A little background. On the 3380, there are two seperateamps, "Speaker 1" and "Speaker 2" each with its own left and rightchannel connections (wierd right?). The first RF (We shall call RF-1)was connected to the left-Speaker 1 connection and the second RF (RF-2)was connected to the right-Speaker 2 connection. Everything workedfine. So then, I physically move RF-1 across the room and it stopsworking. The receiver was running at about -30dBs and so I turned it up3-4 notches to get some more sound and I noticed that RF-1 was notworking properly. Upon further investigation, I found is still worked,but was playing extremely quietly, meaning it couldn't be heardover RF-2. Baffled I switched connections on the receiver (RF-1 was nowleft-speaker2 and RF-2 was right speaker 1) and nothing improved (thereceiver was off). Thereceiver then decided to go into protect and shutitself off. Damn. Once i had it back up, the situation was still thesame, so I switched wires running to the speakers themsleves (RF-1 nowconnected to right speaker 1 and vice versa for RF 2) and nothingimproved and I gave up for a little while. Later I came back andswitched the wires on RF1 from the bottom binding posts to the top andVIOLA! it worked. There's a catch though, it still didn't play as loudas RF2 on the same vol. and balance in the middle. So i decided thatwasn't good and I left it alone. Next day, I had to move mysystem and so I set it up as it was originally, and same results. So Ithen switched RF 1 to right speaker 2 and RF 2 to left speaker 1 andgot the same results as switching the binding posts. However, I ampositive something is broken, I just don't know what or where. Thefinal catch is that when RF2 is off and I turn up RF 1, i get nopopping, nothing. No bad distortion, nothing. Just low volume klipschsound. I haven't had time to try another amp/reciever or take anythingapart, though I should this weekend. Please help. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelA Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 Ok, this will take a long time to explain, so everyone please bear with me as I really need some help on this one. The Equipment: A harmankardon HK 3380 and two RF-15s The Situation: One RF may be blown and the speaker one amp may be shot The Explanation: A little background. On the 3380, there are two seperate amps, "Speaker 1" and "Speaker 2" each with its own left and right channel connections (wierd right?). The first RF (We shall call RF-1) was connected to the left-Speaker 1 connection and the second RF (RF-2) was connected to the right-Speaker 2 connection. Everything worked fine. So then, I physically move RF-1 across the room and it stops working. The receiver was running at about -30dBs and so I turned it up 3-4 notches to get some more sound and I noticed that RF-1 was not working properly. Upon further investigation, I found is still worked, but was playing extremely quietly, meaning it couldn't be heard over RF-2. Baffled I switched connections on the receiver (RF-1 was now left-speaker2 and RF-2 was right speaker 1) and nothing improved (the receiver was off). Thereceiver then decided to go into protect and shut itself off. Damn. Once i had it back up, the situation was still the same, so I switched wires running to the speakers themsleves (RF-1 now connected to right speaker 1 and vice versa for RF 2) and nothing improved and I gave up for a little while. Later I came back and switched the wires on RF1 from the bottom binding posts to the top and VIOLA! it worked. There's a catch though, it still didn't play as loud as RF2 on the same vol. and balance in the middle. So i decided that wasn't good and I left it alone. Next day, I had to move my system and so I set it up as it was originally, and same results. So I then switched RF 1 to right speaker 2 and RF 2 to left speaker 1 and got the same results as switching the binding posts. However, I am positive something is broken, I just don't know what or where. The final catch is that when RF2 is off and I turn up RF 1, i get no popping, nothing. No bad distortion, nothing. Just low volume klipsch sound. I haven't had time to try another amp/reciever or take anything apart, though I should this weekend. Please help. Thanks I would make sure that the brass jumpers are secure on both RF15's. I would then try hooking your speakers to just either the Speaker 1 or Speaker 2 connectors of your receiver. I believe you have Speaker1 left and right connectors, and also Speaker 2 left and right connectors. So try hooking RF1 (+, - ) to the the receiver Speaker1 left ( +, -). Then connect RF2 (+, - ) to the receiver Speaker1 right (+, -). You may also need to select the option on the receiver to select Speaker1 option only. Also, is the louder speaker(RF2) loaded in a corner or close to a wall, while RF1 is farther away from a wall? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkside Posted December 5, 2006 Author Share Posted December 5, 2006 I didn't want to push both speakers off 1 amp, so I have't tried that. Also, RF1 is inbetween some book shelves surrounded on both sides and about 4 inches away from the wall, and is still quieter. Also, the jumpers are fine on both speakers, so I don't know what the problem is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WMcD Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 Well, I'm going to tell you what you already know. That is, go back to basics. I think you have a problem at the speaker connection cup and something is loose. I doubt you fried the amp given the protection circuit. I doubt you killed the speakers. You haven't described doing anything naughty. Disconnect all feed wires from the amp to the speakers at both ends. This is a good time to mark plus and minus with masking tape if you have not already or that is not clear. Maybe even mark left and right pairs. (I find that doing mindless tidying up is fertile ground for inspiration.) I'm not familiar with the receiver. But. If there is a headphone jack, try listening with headphones. I don't know which of A or B feeds headphones. At least try that. Maybe the use of FM radio as a feed will eliminate a feed problem into the amp and a fried amp. Make sure both A and B sets of amps (you seem sure about this) are switched on. I've seen a Yammie switch off one or the other for no good reason. The indicators may be hard to see. Yes you don't have Yammies. Leave off all Dolby and just find a straight through setting. I don't know why you are using A left and B right (or like that) but it just injects a level of complexity you don't need. Just use A or B until things get solved. I'm not familiar with the speakers. These have the shorting bars? Check the back of the speakers with no wires connected. Is everything in proper position and snug? Something is hinky here, perhaps. My guess goes in this direction. Do you have another amp to test the speakers? Try connecting up just one speaker in any case. Does it work? Try moving the same wire end to the other speaker. Does the second speaker work the same? This will control for a bad speaker. I know you've given us a lot of info to chew on but it is a little complex. Let us all know. Best, Gil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkside Posted December 5, 2006 Author Share Posted December 5, 2006 You too have given me a lot to digest. Gimme a few days to try somemore ideas, as i wont have time likely until the weekend, though illtry my best to do some work before then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuzzzer Posted December 5, 2006 Share Posted December 5, 2006 There aren't 2 separate amplifiers in the HK, and the fact that it lets you connect 2 pairs of main speakers isn't 'weird.' I don't want to come off as sounding like a jerk, but virtually all 2 channel and many surround sound receivers have outputs for 2 pairs of main speakers. Run both of them off either Speaker 1 or Speaker 2. The way you have things hooked up isn't how HK intended them to be. As others have said, more than likely a wire got crossed at the speaker connection or the amp connection to cause the HK to go into protect mode. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkside Posted December 6, 2006 Author Share Posted December 6, 2006 No, you didn't com off as a jerk wuzzer, but that shows me what I know []. I didn;t know that they are supposed to be run of either speaker 1 or speaker 2. I will certainly try that, though the possibility of wires crossing is out as one wire strand is copper colored and the other is silver colored on the wire i use, so i always go red to red, which is impossible to forget. However, none of this explains why RF1 is quieter than the other... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkside Posted December 7, 2006 Author Share Posted December 7, 2006 Just some quick questions... Can you theoretically run 4 speakers of the receiver? How does that explain the switch to turn off "speaker 1" or "speaker 2" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkside Posted December 7, 2006 Author Share Posted December 7, 2006 Alright, I just hooked up both speakers to "speaker 1" and went through some familiar songs. The speakers sounded fine, but i think the reciever is broken. The mid/higs didn't have the same clarity as they normally do unless they were EQ'ed all the way up. Also, the general sound was muffled, as if it were being played through a wall, especially the bass. You know what I mean? Granted, I have yet to try them on another system, which i will get to tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuzzzer Posted December 7, 2006 Share Posted December 7, 2006 Just some quick questions... Can you theoretically run 4 speakers of the receiver? How does that explain the switch to turn off "speaker 1" or "speaker 2" Yes, that is how my speakers are hooked up. My friend's KLF30s are hooked up to Speaker 1 and my Forte IIs are hooked up to Speaker 2. I've only listened to both pairs at the same time for a few seconds. Usually I listen to the KLF30s when I'm rocking out and mainly looking for tons of decibels. I use the Fortes for watching TV and movies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuzzzer Posted December 7, 2006 Share Posted December 7, 2006 Alright, I just hooked up both speakers to "speaker 1" and went through some familiar songs. The speakers sounded fine, but i think the reciever is broken. The mid/higs didn't have the same clarity as they normally do unless they were EQ'ed all the way up. Also, the general sound was muffled, as if it were being played through a wall, especially the bass. You know what I mean? Granted, I have yet to try them on another system, which i will get to tomorrow. You probably have already, but make sure that the jumpers on the speakers are connected correctly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkside Posted December 7, 2006 Author Share Posted December 7, 2006 If you mean the straps between the binding posts, yeah, those are fine. I think something might have fried in the reciever. I have another unit i can test the speakers with tomorrow... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkside Posted December 8, 2006 Author Share Posted December 8, 2006 Update. I was running my system off the receiver for about 10 minutes, and then the right channel (off RF-2) went out to very low volume... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkside Posted December 10, 2006 Author Share Posted December 10, 2006 I think i have now figurwed out the problem. The failures have occured when I was running my system off my ipod, which i run through the front video 3 connectors, which are RCA. Well these connectors are broken. When one of the plugs (left or right go figure) gets turned in the plug enough, that channel will cut out. I also noticed that both speakers work fine when im using the radio. Well, needless to say, I feel like a fool[:$][:#] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WMcD Posted December 10, 2006 Share Posted December 10, 2006 Awww. That's okay. Don't feel bad. This sort of thing is a type of right of passage. Now that you're a member of the crew here, you are first in line to field similar questions from newbies. Smile. Gil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkside Posted December 10, 2006 Author Share Posted December 10, 2006 Thanks. Now all I have to do is figure out how to get those connectors fixed... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted December 10, 2006 Share Posted December 10, 2006 lol, for what it's worth you're not the first to make this mistake... I work part-time as a live sound board operator for a venue on campus. There's about a dozen of us that operate the sound boards, but I'm the one that gets called when there's problems. We had an issue where there were some cold solders in the snake going between the mixing position and the amprack behind the stage. It took me a week working inbetween classes to trace down the problem and fix it. The following week I get a phone call from a tech saying that it still wasn't working - freaked out they pull out a secondary portable system to replace the installed flown system - the sound was awful, but at least they had sound. I came in the next day and couldn't find anything wrong with anything. I was really worried that I might have screwed up a solder, but I wasn't about to do another week's worth of work to find it. [6] That evening I got another phone call about it not working and this time they fixed it by running the amp inputs in parallel (yikes, more crap sound). The next day I come back in to test things and I'm mixing that night...the guy from both the previous two nights was working with me, proclaiming that it wasn't working and he did everythign exactly the same as I had it hooked up. He then plugs in his iPod and the left channel is dead, "See, I told you it wasn't working" - to which I reply, "hey idiot" (we have a very loving relationship) "look at your main out meters...you've got nothing being sent out the left channel. It's probably your iPod". Sure enough, we swap out the cord and everything was fine. It's kinda funny because word got out and since then we've noticed 2 more faulty cables. 90% of these guys have absolutely no experience so I don't blaim them. But I can tell you they will never be making the same mistake again [] Talk about a scary problem to be having though...glad to hear it was a simple problem and not something blown up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkside Posted December 10, 2006 Author Share Posted December 10, 2006 Yeah, I have no problem being the first with this problem. Yeah it's simple and turns out it is thecable. HAHA! What's the saying? Live and learn? Yeah, just need to findanother one of those cables and we got hundreds of em' Just 1thing doc...where do you go to college? I want to know what kind ofplace has its own venue...even though i still have 5 more semesters ofhighschool.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrWho Posted December 10, 2006 Share Posted December 10, 2006 http://www.uiuc.edu/ We've got a pretty intense music industry down here on campus. I work in the only student run school venue and love it cuz there's no smoke and overkill sound equipment [Y] But there are plenty of bars and other venues on campus. Champaign even has a few high-end recording studios you can probably poke your nose into. If you come down here, then be sure to look up the AES...a group of audio freaks. We have a pretty active group on our campus (which means lots of fun toys). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuzzzer Posted December 10, 2006 Share Posted December 10, 2006 Glad you figured it out! I've had a few "duh" moments with my stereo equipment through the years as well. [] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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