durieux Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 Hi Need serious help here. I love tube sound but ready to switch to Solid State if I can't figure this one out!! Bought a Jolida 502 modified by Response Audio a couple years ago. From the start it started blowing tubes far too frequently (about once every couple months at least) After a while I finally had Response Audio replace it, and they kindly sent a new Bella Extreme Signature 3205i (A modified Jolida 302) This one blew fuse/tube after 30 minutes of play the first time I used it... I am living in a quite old building and wondering if the household power (spikes of high voltage) could be causing those problems. I do have a Tripp-Lite (which I understand is supposed to regulate those power spikes) but that's obviously not helping... Anyone has any idea/suggestion?? A. Durieux Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauln Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 Can you say more about what "blowing tubes" means - for example, are they arcing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itlldue Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 If you can get access to the breaker or fuse panel for the building, make sure all of the lug connections are tight at the breakers or fuses, including incoming power. Also, check the plugs in the room. After years of hot-cold, the wires loosen under the screws. Don't forget the grounds, too. If you're not familiar with electrical panels, have an electrician check it for you. Poor connections are the biggest cause of electrical problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 I use a voltage regulator on my tube gear becuase the voltage swing from the daily low to the daily high sometimes gets to 11 volts. That may not seem like much, but in a typical tube amp, that translates to 44 volts of a difference in tube plate voltage. Which is basiclly more than enough to change the bias levels. I sent you an email with a solution to your problem. Email me if you do not recieve it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itlldue Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 As a post-script - Most surge protectors do just that, but ignore low voltage. Low voltage can cause certain components to work harder to compensate, causing them to malfunction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
durieux Posted March 30, 2007 Author Share Posted March 30, 2007 By blowing I mean they go dead & fuse go as well. Only once one of them started glowing to red before going though... Just happens out of the blue once in a while, but VERY frequently. And with BOTH amps, which makes me think it's a power issue... Unles I am REALLY unlucky and got 2 amps with something like a trans problem. AD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscarsear Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 You may live under the same bad tube cloud I did at one time. Mine happened while using Cary gear. I did have a Balanced Power power conditioner in-line for all of my failures so my electrical input was spot on. Tubes just plain failed. All sorts of tubes. Power tubes, rectifier and main fuses as well. Had them die easily and had them light up like the 4th. Had them die when plugged in for their intial outing and had them die after 2 or 3 months. It ruined my stereo enjoyment. I was scared to turn the silly thing on. The wife was reeling over the constant replacement costs of tubes. Sold the tube and went back to solid state.......Accuphase. Love it. Happy. No worry, no failures. People here still tell me I was nutzo but this really happened. I even had Cary check the unit out and they said they found no problems. I was told by all whom I dealt with that I had bad tube luck. Could be my massively magnetic personality, I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seti Posted March 30, 2007 Share Posted March 30, 2007 Wow I have never had that problem with tube gear. That is very odd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJkizak Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 oscarsear: Just like Payden says in the movie Silverado----------------"bad luck"--------------------------- just before he draws down on the sheriff. JJK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryO Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 SF, Is your "cure" also preventative maintenance. I'm not having problems (knock on wood) but it's nice to have it in the memory banks for future reference. HarryO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted March 31, 2007 Share Posted March 31, 2007 HarryO it's the same old voltage check at the outlets thru out the day and determination if you need a voltage regulator instead or in addition to a line vonditioner. I didn't want to post the process and decision points on the thread due to the usual turn voltage regulators and conditioner discussions always takes....they even wind up taking about speaker wire....the minute that happens...you know who jumps in and soon things turn into an essay contest with entries by folks who do not even own any equipment. Key consideration point is the refernece voltage that the bias of the tubes are checked at. If you check them during peak power usage, the voltage at your outlets can vary like in my case by as much as 11 volts. In a typical tube amp, the plate voltage can be as high as 4 times the line voltage. So a 11 volt variation can translate to as much as 44 volts of tube plate voltage. Depemding on how you biased your tubes....you get put over the hump on the max recommended bias settings. Another factor is the source of tubes. Be careful with NOS tubes. A lot of folks will label a used tube as NOS if they pass a pre-dermined reading on a tester. So for example, if you have a 100w light bulb that is supposed ot last 7 years and is supposed to put out XX lums of light, at the 6 and a half year mark, the NOS folks will test it and if the bulb still consumes 100 watts and still puts out the same XX lums of light, it's NOS. You buy the bulb expecting it to last 7 years. One day you turn on the light, and it just flashes and does not work anymore. At that point, it won't pass the NOS test. Back to tubes. I have tubes that scored 65 to 75 on a tube tester that were sold to me as NOS by these small one man tube shops. The same tubes sold by the major players score 105 - 120 on the tube testers. Which do you think will burn out first? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
durieux Posted April 1, 2007 Author Share Posted April 1, 2007 UPDATE: I tried to switch tubes from EL34 to 6550 (This amp takes both). Now this time the fuse blew immediately the second I turned the amp on... Clearly a bad tube would not do that. As for the household power, I checked it and it actually seems pretty steady at 118/121. A. Durieux Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted April 1, 2007 Share Posted April 1, 2007 It sounds like you need to get the amp checked out by someone who can bring it up on a variac and check for proper voltages at the pre-determined test ponts, assuming you have the correct fuses in there by amp rating and blow type (slow vs fast blow), etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WopOnTour Posted April 1, 2007 Share Posted April 1, 2007 If it happened right after switching tubes, are you sure you dont have a shorted 6550? Or maybe one with a damaged alignment spline on the guide pin (and it's turned into incorrect pin orientation) Does they Jolida have a standby switch or use a "delay" relay ? WOT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jheis Posted April 1, 2007 Share Posted April 1, 2007 Wow I have never had that problem with tube gear. That is very odd. In my experience, it's not odd at all. I spent 3 years of my life trying to keep antiquated tube gear afloat on a full time basis. To each their own - if you're into tubes - more power to you, but you're not going to convert me. BTDT. James Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pauln Posted April 2, 2007 Share Posted April 2, 2007 Agree... this does not appear to be a tube problem, it is an amp problem - something is wrong with the amps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted April 3, 2007 Share Posted April 3, 2007 "Are you sure you have the right size fuse in there?" SIze and type (fast or slow blow, etc) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest " " Posted April 3, 2007 Share Posted April 3, 2007 whats the status of this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meagain Posted April 8, 2007 Share Posted April 8, 2007 If a fuse blows immediately upon turn on, it is not the tubes. You have a short in the PSU somewhere. And, if tubes are blowing upon startup..... how could that possibly be the voltage at the wall - right? If voltage swings are present, wouldn't the tubes blow at random vs. startup? I'd think so.... right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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