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Bose 901 VI


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Funny how a highly regarded speaker from the 70's becomes 07 trash on this forum..........They were considered some of the Best back then. I have seen used 901's with stands and equalizer sell for 450-500 dollars lately, that is a good buy in my book. We must remember, there are other people out there with their own opinions on speakers.............Hard to believe, some folks don't like Klipsch........

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Accuracy vs Pleasingness in general, and with Bose vs Klipsch, or any two speakers.

IMO, sound reproduction in a room different than the original performance venue is judged to be accurate if it has a high degree of fidelity to the imagined original. We imagine differently, and we may process the cues that lead us to believe that the original sounded a certain way differently at different times. Both my sound system, and the orchestras I used to play in, sound(ed) subtly different on different days. Even in the same room in "live vs recorded & played back" tests of the kind PWK used to do (with Klipschorns), there is the problem of the room acoustics being engaged twice.

Artificial (deliberate or accidental) sounding speakers can be pleasing, and can sometimes mask with pleasing distortion / veiling more unpleasant distortion on a recording. In my experience, speakers that do that don't match the imagined original when good recordings are being played.

I don't find "imaging" very important, although I'll take it if it is given.

Most important to me is what Holt used to call "triggering the musical gestalt," a deliberately vague term, that for me involves plausible reality, wide emotional swings (when appropriate to the music) and being transported. I know, still vague. These qualities led me past most "high end" speakers to Klipsch, probably for the well delineated dynamic contrasts, the "live" feeling, etc. But, irritatingly, occasionally (5 to10% of the time?), the BOSE 901s produce a more plausible gestalt, perhaps when spatiality being used as a cue more than clean and dramatic dynamic contrasts?

With the classical, jazz, and movie sound I listen to, bay far the weakest and most variable link is the recording -- otherwise, why would the perceived quality range from pretty good to execrable? An old recordist I knew told me that up until the early to mid 70s, the recording engineers used to spend days -- during rehearsal, in the case of classical -- getting the microphone placement the way they wanted it, and to engage the FM principle ("F...ing Magic"). In high budget (compared to the waning budgets for classical) Rock recording, the engineers had an opportunity to try (and develop) a great variety of techniques, both during the wine, cheese, and drug recording period (band shall remain nameless), and in the more than ample mix down time afterward. Jazz recording was often more improvised, but usually much simpler. For movies, the engineers had a few excellent rooms that they were intimately familiar with (such as the famed MGM scoring stage) that they used over and over again, often with the same, or mostly the same orchestras. His impression was that the budgets were high, and they could fine tune. By the time he changed careers (in about 1978), the money and painstakingness had been diminished dramatically. Unfortunately, either many of the fine old magnetic recordings of the 50s, 60s and 70s have been damaged by improper storage, or poorly transferred to CD, as evidenced by our old vinyl recordings often sounding better than the remixes.
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I know I shouldn't continue this but.....

considered " Some of the Best " .... by Who ... OB ..??

Actually by just about everybody in 1968 when they came out. The first negative review wasn't until 1971 and then Stereophile came out with a less flattering review. This was largely the start of a war between Bose and the high end industry which has continued to this day. Bose - for their part, have not helped matters with some of their other products, an aggressive legal department and massive success (which never helps popularity).

Remember many of these same reviewers pan the Klipsch sound too - and tend to recommend very expensive components that I generally find disappointing.

not by any Sound Guy, or , say Julian Hirsch

Now no - but one wonders how much of that is based upon the actual product.

you think + 50 dB EQ on the Bass ... is good practice ...??? .[:)]

a/ If it works - dont knock it.

b/ That was for the original 1968 speaker. Gain on the newer models is now much less as the efficiency has climbed and they ported the box from model 3 onwards.

c/ High gain EQ for bass has been used successfully to play back vinyl for 50 years or more.

d/ I cant help feeling something similar done with a single driver implementation might yield amazing results. There is a lot to be said for a crossoverless sound - despite Dean's protestations....[:P]

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With all the intress in the 901's VI, does anyone want to buy a set.   I'm told the set I have was purchased in November 2006.  I have the original boxes for the 901's, the stands, and an EQ.



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How much? PM me if you prefer. If I dont want them Tony (best friend) is certainly interested as he is bidding on a pair now.

EDIT - Erik you can have first crack at these if you want - just let me know.

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" They will be busy little beavers supporting the high maintenance requirements of the 901s."

to be fair...and I think I can be since I own the 901's, Khorns, LaScala's, 3 pairs of Heresy's, and had some cornwalls...I, like most other Heritage product owners have re-capped, replaced standard xovers with univesals, replaced universals with extreme slope, changed my mid drivers, changed my tweeters, changed my woofers, etc.....however, I have never had to do anything to my 901's....If I have been busy...99% of that busy time has been with the Heritage products.

This is an interesting way to see it.

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" They will be busy little beavers supporting the high maintenance requirements of the 901s."

to be fair...and I think I can be since I own the 901's, Khorns, LaScala's, 3 pairs of Heresy's, and had some cornwalls...I, like most other Heritage product owners have re-capped, replaced standard xovers with univesals, replaced universals with extreme slope, changed my mid drivers, changed my tweeters, changed my woofers, etc.....however, I have never had to do anything to my 901's....If I have been busy...99% of that busy time has been with the Heritage products.

Interesting that although you own a pair of BOSE 901s, you do not list them in your equipment list.

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" They will be busy little beavers supporting the high maintenance requirements of the 901s."

to be fair...and I think I can be since I own the 901's, Khorns, LaScala's, 3 pairs of Heresy's, and had some cornwalls...I, like most other Heritage product owners have re-capped, replaced standard xovers with univesals, replaced universals with extreme slope, changed my mid drivers, changed my tweeters, changed my woofers, etc.....however, I have never had to do anything to my 901's....If I have been busy...99% of that busy time has been with the Heritage products.

Interesting that although you own a pair of BOSE 901s, you do not list them in your equipment list.

embarASSment

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Roc:

Thanks for contributing those reviews of the Bose products. I notice that you selected particularly negative responses, and am just wondering if in your quest for support of your own view you found any positive comments regarding Bose speakers in general or the 901 system in particular? I've done some homework, too.

Honestly, since I joined this forum, an element that constantly amazes me is the level of egocentricity that frequently surfaces -- whether the subject happened to be capacitor type/brand, crossover slope, low power/high power, cathode resistor bypass/unbypass, and whatever else that we have hit back and forth over the years -- it seems that it is inherently difficult for some to comprehend the idea that what they prefer in terms of all of those factors (caps, amps, crossover networks, etc.) just might not be the same for someone else; and based on that will immediately write-off or deem ignorant any view or taste in sound that does not happen to gel with their own.

Erik

Hi Erik,

I didn't "select" any of the reviews. They happened to be the first ones that I came across.

Erik, my goal is to determine the truth. I am not one who convinces ones-self that what I believe is necessarily true or that what I believe necessarily remains true indefinitely.

I seek the truth.

However, I have discovered that on the subject of BOSE products, it is almost impossible not to fall into one of the two camps. BOSE believers or BOSE non-believers.

I am a BOSE non-believer.

It looks like you are looking for some positive BOSE reviews. Here they are in the next couple of posts.

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Bose 901 Series VI

MSRP: $ 1499.00

Rating
Reviewed by:
image.php?u=258934
opus1025

(AudioPhile)

Review Date
January 26, 2007

Overall Rating
5star.gif 5 of 5

Value Rating
5star.gif 5 of 5

Used product for
More than 1 year

Price Paid: $400.00 from local store

Summary:

Another perspective: I am absolutely fed-up with the adolescent rubbish that some would-be buyers have to wade through! Personally, whenit comes to audio, I'm not interested in anything but highest quality music reproduction - as a professional, and classically trained musician, this is mandatory for me.
I've owned literally 100's of pieces of audio gear, some extremely expensive and esoteric examples. All great fun, but especially when it comes to choosing speakers, I have long known that, like pianos, say, they all sound different. Yes, in spite of all attempting to do the same thing, they all have a distinct sonic "footprint". In my experience, there will never be a "perfect" loudspeaker for all listeners, as tastes, budget, and ears are all different.
To write an objective review is an impossibility: by definition I will use my own biases, as does EVERYONE. Having been exposed to so much live music over the years may give me a slight advantage, who knows?
To all those silly people who indulge in Bose-bashing, let me say 'NONSENSE'! To those who like to indulge in the childish 'No highs no lows must be Bose' refrain, again nonsense! Unless my ears and testing equipment are lying to me, these speakers, PROPERLY EQUALIZED and PROPERLY LOCATED, are nothing short of astonishing, In terms of bass, their ability to produce fundamentals at 30Hz and below, with clean accuracy is simply marvelous. Unless you really need to feel a 15Hz fundamental, there will NEVER be a need for an outboard Subwoofer. Never. Period. For a smallish speaker, this is remarkable. Highs are equally well tended to, and with careful EQ and placement, your pets will be bothered even when you're not!
My listening tastes run the gamut from organ music at realistic volumes (I am an organist, and I know what to listen for), to techno and just about everything in between. These rather remarkable speakers will take anything that's dealt to them, bearing in mind the need for decent amplification - anything less than 50 Watts will run into problems if you enjoy realistic listening levels. Even massed vocals, one of the most severe tests, and the downfall of many speakers, are handled with ease and transparency.
Much has been written on the use of paper cones, and the necessity of using an Equalizer. For the former, I don't care what the materials used are, as long as the sounds are correct. Any criticism on this basis is simply puerile; the final sound is all that matters. I must admit I don't care for the fact that the foam surrounds will probably perish after 15 years or so, but since replacements are so easily available this isn't too much of an issue. (Try refurbishing the single speaker from an Ohm Walsh in comparison!!) The equalizer is another issue. Whilst on principle I don't like to introduce more electronics into the chain than necessary, this little box earns its keep, hands down. Listening without any equalization is an unpleasant experience, to say the least. (Bose bashers and others please note). I have experimented extensively with using second-party equalization, and I will go on record as saying that if you have the patience and the tools, you are not limited to the Bose equalizer. I am listening as I write to a thrilling version of Also Spracht Zarathustra, at neighbour-threatening levels, using a second-party equalizer - simply marvelous!
In sum, and you might think surprisingly, these are a very difficult speaker to recommend unequivocally. If the user is not prepared to take a very active part in careful placement and equalization, perhaps they're best left alone. I am utterly convinced that it is these facts alone that have contributed to so much of the nonsensical nay-saying associated with the 901's.

Strengths:
When properly placed and EQ'd, the 901's are capable of compelling imaging. The speakers will disappear, just as they should.
Effortless dynamics, and a remarkably extended bass. Only the music remains.
Fast, involving, transparent.
Not for everyone - what audio component ever could be? - but for me!

Weaknesses:
The Bose 901 speaker has, in my opinion, been the butt of more vitriol and uninformed malice than any other piece of Audio equipment in the history of the hobby. Any kind of Fascism is offensive, but we're talking about MUSIC for Heaven's sake! Everyone has an opinion, apparently especially those who appear unable to read a manual! Very sad. So much mis- and dis-information.
To all the bashers, I would politely say you're welcome to hear them at my house. Then write a review, by all means. Friends of mine who count themselves knowledgeable and critical have consistently praised these humble-looking transducers, and not just to be polite!
Again, CORRECT PLACEMENT is absolutely essential, as is CORRECT EQ! This may be too much effort for some folks: if so maybe they should look elsewhere.
As this design radiates a great deal of energy to the rear, it's not a plug-and-play design: the stereo image can easily become too diffuse if the speakers are not properly placed. Complex room interactions can result in sound-smearing, and mis-timing of audible information, resulting in a muddle. This must be taken seriously.
Bose perhaps gloss over this difficulty: these speakers MUST be placed very carefully - sometimes a difference of a couple of inches is crucial.
Yes, you can make these speakers under-perform!
Perhaps the most confusing, mis-reviewed, speaker of all time.
IF, and only IF you are prepared to put in a little time, these speakers fully justify a 5 Star rating.

Similar Products Used:
Nothing similar that I know of.

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Bose 901 Series VI

Rating
Reviewed by:
image.php?u=259056
78vette

(AudioPhile)

Review Date
January 10, 2007

Overall Rating
5star.gif 5 of 5

Value Rating
5star.gif 5 of 5

Used product for
Less than 1 month

Review 3 of 233

Price Paid: $480.00 from ebay

Summary:
I have always been into audio, from my early teens when the Zenith Alegro was cool. Then graduated to a pioneer receiver with HPM speakers. Then Onkyo receiver, etc. etc. When I was in the military in Okinawa in the late 70's early 80's I dumped a bunch of $ on a stereo. I went full bore with a Yamaha m-2 amp, Akai reel to reel, Nakamichi cassette deck, Yamaha m-4 preamp, ADC equalizer and spent litteraly thousands and had a high end system. When it came to speaker choice, I was torn between the JBL L150 and the Bose 901. I chose the JBL, simply because it did not need a to be a certain distance from the walls to sound good, not because it was a superior speaker system. It was a good choice at the time as I was young and lived in apartments and other places it would have been impossible to make the 901s work. I have had the JBL's for over 25 years and they have served me very well. I have used them as front mains in a home theater and never regreted the choice I made.

Now that I am older and have a decent listening room in my home, I decided to purchase a set of 901 series VI. I don't know if it is my age, but these speakers sound truely amazing. I have them in a room that will work with them. There is no other speaker I have heard in my lifetime that sounds more real. Every note of every insturment is heard. And whoever it was that said they don't work well with home theater, you are wrong! You have to take care on how you install them as they require the EQ to sound right. I have a Yamaha htr-5790 the powers all surround speakers except the front mains. I had to preout the front mains to the bose EQ, then to my Yamaha m-70 amp which powers the 901's. It is simply stunning. The JBL speakers are gathering dust for now, even though I have very fond feelings for them and would never let them go. I will be using the Bose speakers from this point forward.

For those that think the 901 is a joke and that all of the new high dollar speakers are where it is at, more power to you!!! I have known for many years what the 901 could deliver, but never had the ability to utilize it. I am just glad that within my lifetime I have had the privilage to own and listen to these great speakers in my own home. It is not for me to tell anyone what they like to hear in a speaker, but if you say the Bose 901 does not sound awsome when used correctly I would say your listening with your oversized wallet and ego, not your ears. The 901's have been around in the same basic configuration for many years. Show me any other speaker that has been around that long! There has to be a reason they have withstood the test of time that no other speaker has been able to do!!!

Strengths:
stereo seperation
power handling
overall sound quality

Weaknesses:
none

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Bose 901 Series VI


Rating
Reviewed by:
image.php?u=258453
pierre

(AudioPhile)

Review Date
December 18, 2006

Overall Rating
5star.gif 5 of 5

Value Rating
5star.gif 5 of 5

Price Paid: $500.00 from audiolight

Summary:
Les Boses 901 VI sont les meilleurs speakers que j`ai utilisé a ce jour. J`ai eu des Eminent technology, klipsch ,Snell ,Kef et MCintosh. Et les 901 les surpassent toutes.
J`utilise un lecteur Micromega solo, un préampli B&K pro10 ainsi qu`un ampli Bryston 4b. Elles sont surtout impressionnantes avec de la musique classique. Les timbales et les pédales d`orgue sont vraiment réalistes.

Strengths:
Estétique indémodable.
Restitution réaliste de la musique.
Dimentions réduites des cabinets .
Sonorité de grandeur nature.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Sorry, this belongs in the French section.
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Bose 901 Series VI


Rating
Reviewed by:
image.php?u=257766
tony3d

(AudioPhile)

Review Date
November 30, 2006

Overall Rating
5star.gif 5 of 5

Value Rating
5star.gif 5 of 5

Used product for
More than 1 year

Price Paid: $1295.00 from Circuit City

Summary:
Hi,
I saw your question about the Bose 901 series 1 or 2 and thought I should share with you my own experiences with the 901. My first introduction to them was back with the series 1. I heard them at a friends house who happened to be an engineer at Fermi National Accelerator Labs. This guy was an absolute perfectionist when it came to his audio system. He wasn't satisfied with the low end of any speaker he heard at the time. So he built his own speakers using Electro-voice 30" woofers!. He built a ported enclosure, using the crawl space under his house to get the required cabinet volume behind the speaker so he could tune the port based on the free air resonance of the woofers. He finally finished the project 3 months later. The first time I heard it I was floored! He powered them with a Crown DC300 amp. One day I get a call from him and he told me to get over here right a away. He sits me down in front of these 2 weird looking boxes he had suspended from his ceiling and said, "well I finally found them". He put on a cut from the Missing Link direct disc and my jaw dropped. These speakers sounded so good I though I was dreaming. The low end blew away his 30" masterpiece's which he promptly removed shortly after. From that day on I was after those 901's.

At the time I worked for Jensen Sound labs curve tracing speakers. I have to laugh when I here these Bose bashers on all these websites rant on about things they know very little about. Most all of them say that Jensen made the drivers for the 901 series 1 and 2. Not quite right. Rola made the drivers for Bose in those days who also made the drivers for Jensen. Jensen stopped manufacturing drivers many years before that. Rola manufactured drivers for many other prominent speaker companies of the day. The 901 series 1 and 2 were an excellent speaker in there day, but had real difficulty reaching down below 50 hz. They were also very inefficient. The series 3 was a new rebirth for the 901's. Those so called cheap, junky, toy like drivers are actually extremely high quality transducers! The advent of the helically wound voice coils and oh yes those plastic baskets brought the 901 drivers into a whole new level of precision. Everybody rants on about the cheap plastic baskets, but do they realize that is the only way that Bose could hold the very tight tolerances required for that driver. You can mold plastic to much tighter tolerances than a stamped metal basket could hope to hold. I know this is true because I was a machinist for 25 years. It is stronger, and much less resonant than a stamped basket. When I use to curve trace Jensen drivers you could feel that metal basket flexing all over the place. This brings us to the cheap plastic matrix enclosure. Bose was brilliant making that out of plastic. Again almost resonant free, and plastic gave them the opportunity to make a very complex chamber to route the air flow. Just put your hand on the 901 cabinet while pushing 50-60 hz and tell me what you feel. I'll admit that the ports are not totally silent, but the only time I can here them at all is when I'm driving 250 watts peak power into them on pipe organ music, and then only on the very lowest notes! So the ports actually do a great job raising the efficiency of the speaker while re-enforcing the low end to bring the range down to about 35 hz! There is plenty of output that low.

Back to those cheap drivers that can't reproduce bass very well. The 901 can move enormous amount of air, and because of the matrix enclosure there movement has been greatly reduced thus reducing the distortion from the very large excursions of the previous non ported systems. By using the 9 cones back wave to re-enforce the forward motion of the drivers, Bose doubled there bass output. Setup properly and given enough clean power, the 901's are capable of very impressive tight clean bass output. And I'll tell you, these speakers will put that amp to bed before running out of clean undistorted sound. The 901's are not the finest sound speakers on the market, but they are certainly one of them. So many people bash this speaker, and say some of the most ridiculous things about them, that quite frankly I'm embarrassed for them. They are an embarrassment to this board and the community.

Remember that engineer friend from Fermi Labs. He could go on with more facts about what Bose did right with the 901's than you or the Bose bashers would care to listen to. He just sold his 901 series 1 for the series 6 about a year ago. He sees no reason to look any further. So go for it. buy the series 6. There are many good worthwhile improvements in them. Just remember to set them up properly and feed them as much power as you like there practically indestructible! How many people can say that about there speakers? Must be those cheap plastic drivers. I am in no way affiliated with Bose. These are purely my opinions. Good luck!

Strengths:
Extemely dynamic. Handles power with authority! Excellent sound stage. Can be listened to for many hours without fatgue. Powerful low end to about 45hz.

Weaknesses:
Bass below 45hz needs a subwoofer to eliminate cone doubling, and port noise.

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Now no - but one wonders how much of that is based upon the actual product.

Are you serious? Sound guys make their living based on how good it sounds....to claim any of them (let alone a highly regarded one) will disregard a product based on its name is crazy. You might turn your argument around to the consumer market that has bought into their marketing hype...where in their own 'maturity' try to find favor with buying into hype without reasons of buying into the hype. I don't see how bragging about finding ways to enjoy every system in the world is a good thing.

Some food for thought...think of speakers similar to the 901, but of a different brand. Nobody is talking up how good they sound!

you think + 50 dB EQ on the Bass ... is good practice ...??? .[:)]

a/ If it works - dont knock it.

I agree. And since it doesn't work it should be knocked. [Y]

c/ High gain EQ for bass has been used successfully to play back vinyl for 50 years or more.

That's nowhere near the same thing...though ironically is subject to some of the same distortions - speakers just happen to have crap loads more. You do realize that any EQ will boost not only the intended direct sound, but also the distortion of the speaker? And since drivers are nonlinear devices, the distortion actually gets boosted by a larger amount. Yikes! It doesn't matter how fancy your driver is. Sure, fancier drivers might reduce the suck factor, but that's not happening when you're spending 50 cents per driver...

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