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dkalsi

Altec Model 19 vs . Klipschorn

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I can tell you this though, those Altecs have been in a closet under his stairs ......

Must be a Big closet ! [:D] Yes sound reproduction is very subjective and subject to many variables including the type and quality of musical recording being listened to. IMO, both of these systems when set up and properly functioning would be very satisfing and far above the average listening enviroment. However, some will prefer one over the other.

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Does he want to sell those 19's that are sitting in that big closet? This has been a fun discussion/debate. I'd say anyone who has either speaker in their home listening environment is

doing pretty good! So......do any of you guys believe in super tweeters? And if so, any recommendations on a decent one that won't break the bank. I really love the "air" 18k-20k and above and I think a super tweeter added to any older designed horn based system might sound really good? Yes I am aware of human hearing constraints that don't really go above 20khz, but considering that most all speakers start to roll off quite a bit at 15k and super tweeters cover 15k-50k or more..they can still be quite useful. The townshend super tweeters are tempting...but they are too expensive for me at this time. And...I have had my hearing checked and I still have good hearing up to 20khz. (just wanted to add that in before someone commented about the fact that most can't hear past 16k) Thanks for any help in advance!

Other reasons super tweeters seem like a good idea:

HF is so directional and its hard for the air above 16k to reach the sweet spot of a listening room, not to mention how most drivers roll off above that pretty fast anyway.

Scientific studies have shown that our ears do send signals to our brain that perceives frequencies higher than 20k and many acoustical instruments actually

produces frequencies in this range. ( i am aware of the inherent limitations of CD frequency response, but SACDs and other media can get pretty high not to mention

harmonic overtones in this range on any source)

Your input is appreciated. Thanks!

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"Must be a real big closet", That part of the house is an old farm house with very high ceilings, so yes there is a big closet under the stairs. He added an addition a couple years back that is between 1500 and 1600 square feet and that is where his system is located.

"Does he want to sell the speakers?" At times he has talked about it, but I think it is just talk. I think he is sentimentally attached because he was either 16 or 17 when he bought the 19s. The place he bought them from had 14s as well at the time. I also think he does not sell them because his wife is in charge of him and b/tched the entire time I had some La Scalas over there and wont let him complete his system. The soom is 24 by 30 something, I would have to ask depth to be sure and we wired it for 7.1 with 8 gauge copper when he built it and it has two locations for subs in the walls, all jack pannels and gear mounted flush in a fake wall, and she wont let him get the speakers to finish it off, but she holds girl scout meetings and scrap book meetings in the room and leaves it trashed for days at a time.

Roger

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Brad O, PM sent on HF Tweeter added to 19.

B) Even worse, a poster might of heard both, but not at the same time in the same place, so how subjective is their memory? Unless two devices are A/Bd, I feel most opinions hold as much promise as urine in a paper sack.

As I stated early on, I currently own BOTH and both are set up to run at optimum so what am I missing here? How is my opinion in this matter like URINE?[*-)]

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"Does he want to sell the speakers?" At times he has talked about it, but I think it is just talk.

Well, if he doesn't want to part with the 19s....have him connect all the ground lugs together with a common wire on the crossover board. After 20 years oxidation builds up between the ground lug and the chassis and severely degrades the high frequency output.

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Of couse, I am wasting my breath on a Klispch forum typing this...haha. Just a fun debate for me.

Oh, I rather doubt that. The discussion above is remarkably even, considering this is a Klipsch forum. I don't have an opinion, but I enjoyed reading the posts. I've heard a then-new 19, but its habitat was a large auditorium at my place of work. No way to compare it to what I had in my living room.

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Brad O, PM sent on HF Tweeter added to 19.

B) Even worse, a poster might of heard both, but not at the same time in the same place, so how subjective is their memory? Unless two devices are A/Bd, I feel most opinions hold as much promise as urine in a paper sack.

As I stated early on, I currently own BOTH and both are set up to run at optimum so what am I missing here? How is my opinion in this matter like URINE?Confused

Brett,

What kind of a tool would someone have to be to say they like one speaker over the other if they haven't heard both speakers??

I assume it is safe to say then that most everyone that responded claims to have heard both.

I therefore put forth that unless someone has directly A/Bd both in an identical setting that their memory is subjective, and their comparison is tainted as well.

Why would you assume that my comments are amed directly at you then??

Roger

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It is funny...I have read this post before and I just spotted a pair of 19s in a local pawn shop today...I did not give it much though and then laughed when I saw this thread ressurected from way before I was a member

What was the cost for the pair?

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I have done all of those things. That being stated what is your reply?

My reply is that this thread was from 2007, and if you check my join date, you will find that I joined in 2008, so when I saw this thread, I responded to reading the entire thread. My response is that if you read the entire thread, and then reread my response and still think it is directed at you personally?

I staed that if they hadn't "A/B'd both, I felt their oppinion is like urine in a paper bag"

What does it mean to A/B a speaker? It means to directly compare both in the same room. Your orriginal post states you have done that. My post basically states that I would throw out any opinion that was not done this way, and still, any left over would still be subjective as mine and my brother in laws are as all of us hear things differently.

Well if after that you still think it is all about you, I would have to say that you are FRIKIN RETARDED!!!

Roger

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Roger, thank you for clearing that up. Being Retarded ( I like to call myself metally challenged ) I am a little slow.

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I've owned K-horns. Upgraded xovers and mid drivers (Altec). Now have a set of 19s. The 19s are far superior in the most important areas - mainly they sound better-balanced and the mids are almost entirely free of any hardness or glare. That was not the case with the K-horns using 45 SET amps.

Admittedly I only had one good corner and so did not get the full impact of what k-horn bass can do. I would wager it is superior in some ways. OTOH, the path delay of the long bass horn could be audible.

To those who cannot live with any horn shout the Altec Model 19 is viable. I don't think the K-horn is without completely replacing the midrange.

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Both are excellent speakers and as some have already said...it's up to your tastes and the listening environment. It's like agreeing on a good bottle of wine and what distinguishes it from a 'bad or average bottle'...usually more than cost.

Anyhow I ened up taking the top hat off my '04 Khorns, putting in some Crites tweets and an Altec 288k. Built a tractrix horn for the 288. Alinged tweet and 288, pointed to a more focused listening position...nirvana! Never been more impressed with a sound in 33 years. With the great Khorn bass, now very clean, clear, 3D like and so live. Did also throw up a few diffusers, traps and convex reflectors, these made a 'helova' difference.Also kept the AK4 cross and seems to like the Altec when postioned more astutely.

Love 'mixing and matching', keeps me off the streets.

All the best

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it's been a week or so I'm guesting my new Altec Model 19. so far I'm very happy with them. the HF horn of 19s sound much smoother than that bad K-400 in Khorns and two-way configuration delivers more sound coherency than 3-way. they also are less room dependent, I'm having fun connecting them to a 3.5wpc 2A3 SE tube amp. comparing 19 vs. CW, I'm absolutely in with 19s, comparing them to Khorns, then again 19 is my choice and I'll live with them for an infinitive time

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In my experience, the Altecs need a touch of equalization to sound as neutral as the K-horns. In the lower reaches of the Altec horn, it has a distinctive cry.

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arash,

glad to hear you are enjoying the Altecs.

What 2A3 amp are you using?

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Arash I agree, I have had 2 sets or corwalls and the 19's are a very different animal. You should look into the grounding issue with most m19 crossovers. If you search "ground lug mod" on the jbl lansing site or audiokarma, you should be able to find it. It makes a HUGE difference in sound. Also you should recap the originals they are probably way out of speck. The one thing about corwalls, they are way more forgiving then the m19's.

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Mdl 19 is a two way, perhaps we should be comparing it to the Klipsch two way - Jubilee. Anyone want to swap there Jub's for Altec 19's?[;)] Not in my house...

Cornman

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Mdl 19 is a two way, perhaps we should be comparing it to the Klipsch two way - Jubilee. Anyone want to swap there Jub's for Altec 19's?Wink Not in my house...

Cornman

if I only had a pair of Jubilee [:'(]

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I have enjoyed most all of the various speakers I have had in the house (inc. AL5's) & would love to play with the 19's as well, congrats on your find Arash. The Jubs have been great fun, but they in themselves have not made me a happier man.

peace

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