MDF, or Solid Wood or Something else

[Roc Rinaldi]

I've heard comments that MDF is the best material for speaker cabinets. MDF resonates better than solid wood. Solid wood is more durable for harsher environments.

Others have said solid wood is best.

Then I have also seen speaker cabinets made out of metal, aluminum, etc.

What is the best material for speaker cabinets. What are the pro & cons?

[Guest " "]

solid wood is expensive and a little more challenging to work with (joining, planing, etc), hardwoods may provide better sound results.

MDF is inexpensive, good sound character, does not like moisture, joiints are a little more challenging than regular grain woods.

plywood is avail in varying cost and grades, good sound character, easy to work with, edgebonds well

cenment is hard to work with (need formers), the best sound character, costs as much as any of the above.

[bluesboy]

solid wood is expensive and a little more challenging to work with (joining, planing, etc), hardwoods may provide better sound results.

MDF is inexpensive, good sound character, does not like moisture, joiints are a little more challenging than regular grain woods.

plywood is avail in varying cost and grades, good sound character, easy to work with, edgebonds well

cenment is hard to work with (need formers), the best sound character, costs as much as any of the above.

Fritz is right about all of the above. The nice thing about solid wood is that you have the ability to shape it ways that you can't do with plywood or veneered MDF such as rounded over edges. Other problems with plywood is the expense of void free material. I know from experience that regular hardwood veneer plywood from your local Home Depot or Lowes is not going to be void free or as dense as MDF. I have read that although musical insterments are made from hardwood speakers should not be because the wood colors the sound. I just built a pair of single driver speakers using solid hardwood though and they sound great.

[JJkizak]

My statement has no basis in fact. I like wood and I don't like MDF.

JJK

[Jay481985]

true wood does color the sound and can change from bin to bin due to moisture, grain characteristics, age, etc.... The best violins made by Stradivarus was ages maple that he made sure to age and have a certain moisture content. Even the adhesive was proprietary to him. But with solid wood comes a unique characteristic from each tree to tree. Its alot easier due to a violing being from one tree yet a speaker would be much more than one tree and tuning it would be harder due to each tree having its own grain pattern and characteristics a nightmare...... MDF and plywood gives good consistant properties. That is why there is no solid wood speaker, just veneer.

MDF is inexpensive, very dense (the denser the better) but it does not like screws (blowouts) and is rather hard on tools (the glue)

Plywood is expensive if you get the baltic birch or the void free stuff. Also the amount of ply changes the price considerably. 13 ply is alot more than 9 ply, but the more ply the stronger due to the nature of the laying out of plywood. Plywood is layered in a weave pattern with the grain switched 90 degrees to give it alot of strength. At the same time some void free high number plywood is almost as expensive as real wood planks of comparable size. It does not blow out as mdf and is more durable but actually less dense than mdf.

cement would be an idea material but due to weight it also makes most commercial sellability impossible. The best for sound does not do well for selling.

Metals like aluminum are nice, they are as dense as cement and make for an interesting statement speaker but for the cost and adjusted cost of the cool factor, it is not viable for most people unless you like to throw money away or are well to do.

ABS plastic is not bad at all but it needs sufficent bracing as it flexes like crazy. Though the acoustic properties are nice, hence you see alot of smaller speakers made out of abs plastic (cough bose and everyone who follows)

[Roc Rinaldi]

solid wood is expensive and a little more challenging to work with (joining, planing, etc), hardwoods may provide better sound results.

MDF is inexpensive, good sound character, does not like moisture, joiints are a little more challenging than regular grain woods.

plywood is avail in varying cost and grades, good sound character, easy to work with, edgebonds well

cenment is hard to work with (need formers), the best sound character, costs as much as any of the above.

Well then I want the cement speakers.

[Roc Rinaldi]

My statement has no basis in fact. I like wood and I don't like MDF.

JJK

Yes, but why?

[Roc Rinaldi]

solid wood is expensive and a little more challenging to work with (joining, planing, etc), hardwoods may provide better sound results.

MDF is inexpensive, good sound character, does not like moisture, joiints are a little more challenging than regular grain woods.

plywood is avail in varying cost and grades, good sound character, easy to work with, edgebonds well

cenment is hard to work with (need formers), the best sound character, costs as much as any of the above.

Fritz is right about all of the above. The nice thing about solid wood is that you have the ability to shape it ways that you can't do with plywood or veneered MDF such as rounded over edges. Other problems with plywood is the expense of void free material. I know from experience that regular hardwood veneer plywood from your local Home Depot or Lowes is not going to be void free or as dense as MDF. I have read that although musical insterments are made from hardwood speakers should not be because the wood colors the sound. I just built a pair of single driver speakers using solid hardwood though and they sound great.

Sounds like a draw between MDF & solid wood as to sound quality.

[Roc Rinaldi]

true wood does color the sound and can change from bin to bin due to moisture, grain characteristics, age, etc.... The best violins made by Stradivarus was ages maple that he made sure to age and have a certain moisture content. Even the adhesive was proprietary to him. But with solid wood comes a unique characteristic from each tree to tree. Its alot easier due to a violing being from one tree yet a speaker would be much more than one tree and tuning it would be harder due to each tree having its own grain pattern and characteristics a nightmare...... MDF and plywood gives good consistant properties. That is why there is no solid wood speaker, just veneer.

MDF is inexpensive, very dense (the denser the better) but it does not like screws (blowouts) and is rather hard on tools (the glue)

Plywood is expensive if you get the baltic birch or the void free stuff. Also the amount of ply changes the price considerably. 13 ply is alot more than 9 ply, but the more ply the stronger due to the nature of the laying out of plywood. Plywood is layered in a weave pattern with the grain switched 90 degrees to give it alot of strength. At the same time some void free high number plywood is almost as expensive as real wood planks of comparable size. It does not blow out as mdf and is more durable but actually less dense than mdf.

cement would be an idea material but due to weight it also makes most commercial sellability impossible. The best for sound does not do well for selling.

Metals like aluminum are nice, they are as dense as cement and make for an interesting statement speaker but for the cost and adjusted cost of the cool factor, it is not viable for most people unless you like to throw money away or are well to do.

ABS plastic is not bad at all but it needs sufficent bracing as it flexes like crazy. Though the acoustic properties are nice, hence you see alot of smaller speakers made out of abs plastic (cough bose and everyone who follows)

I want cement speakers.

[JJkizak]

Well, moisture destroys MDF. Then again plywood in a very low humidity (8 to 10%) environment such as Greenland after about 20 years the plywood turns to sawdust in between the two outside layers. (I saw it with my own eyes) However those were the days of non waterproof glue I have noticed the general degradation of an 18" x 6" by 20 foot MDF beam left outside for about 6 years and it wasn't really that bad except for some swelling. MDF "weight warps" after about 2 years if you use it as a shelf. Take a look at all of that cheap assemble yourself furniture (Bush, etc) with the warped shelves. It makes me throw-up. MDF is also murder on carbide saw blades. I thought once about using Cedar so that the sound waves would blow out a nice smell during music playback but gave that up. Professionally done MDF is just fine but I still don't like it.

JJK

[Roc Rinaldi]

Your Cedar idea could be a million dollar idea.

I'm not kidding.!!!!!

You'll have the women lining up for your Cedar Speakers.

[Jay481985]

Your Cedar idea could be a million dollar idea.

I'm not kidding.!!!!!

You'll have the women lining up for your Cedar Speakers.

just use cedar oil and oil the inside of the speaker?

[Roc Rinaldi]

Is that legal?

[Jay481985]

cedar oil? I remember seeing it to use on cedar closets to rejuvinate the wood

[Roc Rinaldi]

Oh.

[RFP]

Huge problem with solid wood is the expansion and contraction (see; http://www.woodbin.com/calcs/shrinkulator.htm )

Most of us tend to forget just how much movement there is in solid wood until something cracks [:'(]

Cheers,

Rob

[WMcD]

In my view, the best material is one which does not resonate.

It is probably correct to say that MDF is lossy and not spring-ey. It is relatively dead. Contrary to what you're saying, it does not resonate better; it resonates worse. So it is very good. In most cases it comes with very flat surfaces and can be purchased with veneer attached and at low cost.

This makes it good for manufacturers. They have the tools, jigs, and glue to work with it.

I don't use it in my home construction projects. Plywood is better for me. It is stronger and, as PWK says generally, you can put a screw into the edge without quite the worry it will chip apart. Granted, home woodworkers can get the knack of working with MDF.

= = = =

I tend to not scrimp on the cost of plywood. These projects are so labor and time intensive that cheaping out on materials could lead to more problems than they are worth.

OTOH, there is much talk of high quality ply, and void free, etc.

But think about it: I've never seen any report by a builder who says: "I built this unit but it is actually trash because of voids and it is made from softwood instead of hardwood."

- - -

Gil